Mr Kraft, The Time has Come To Ask: Whose Side Are You On?

[dliverey]

Goodell should suspend the ball for 2 games and then make a policy stating the penalty for the infraction. Rewatch the video of the game and then jump to an indefinite suspension. That is how he does it right?

 

[NYCPatsFan]

One of the main standards of our legal systems is the presumption of innocence, known as the principle of "innocent until proven guilty". With the Patriots, is the exact opposite.

People truly believe that NE filmed the Rams walkthrough on SB 36, stole a copy from the Jets playbook, violate the rules by filing false injury reports, use illegal formations, among others.

Why?
Due to their name being tossed and dragged through the mud so often, with no active response or defense from the owner & FO against the detractors.

If a writer twits about the team purposely 'deflating balls', the immediate conclusion is that the Pats are guilty, with further analysis to come, rather than innocent. Most often than not a particular opinion gets repeated throughout various news mediums and social networking sites, until it creates a false vision where the perceived truth can actually be very far away from the actual truth.

At the end, even if the Pats have been cleaned up for all these accusations through the years, the damage is done. Public perception has worsened after this report, and there will be those who bring it year after year. We have already been judged "by the people".

Most of the fans around the league have already set their mind on "what happened", regardless of the conclusions the league draw on this issue.

Well said!

Follow up point that I mentioned in another thread: this is now setting the platform for every friggin 'columnist' in the city whose NFL team loses to us to casually claim that the Pats won probably because we cheated.

All they need is just some complaint by the losing team or something more easy - 'unamed sources' speculating - on some strange issue, whether or not it impacted the game.

That is enough to set off a media storm calling into question every hard work, superior intelligence and ethics of both the coaches and the players.

 

[Rob0729]

That's not evidence that the league is troubled by the accusations.



Says who? So far, the only evidence is that they'll address it in the offseason.



When has the league's brand EVER taken a hit for what the Patriots have done? Seriously? The height of the cheater stuff was 2007, and the NFL has only taken off further since then.

It is common sense that the league does not want a cheating scandal to dominate Super Bowl week. You don't need proof.

 

[Ring 6]

You're right. The damage was well contained.

For a mere technicality of camera placement, we were fortunate to have our coach fined half a million dollars, our owner fined a quarter of a million dollars, lose a first round pick and still have to hear about it eight years later with no end in sight.

Could you please tell us how it could have had a worse outcome?

You think fighting it in the media would have changed that?
The lost pick still bothers me (our worst 3 years of the era followed that) but the rest doesn't. I don't care about BB or Krafts money, and I couldn't care less about 'hearing about it'.

 

[BradyManny]

It is common sense that the league does not want a cheating scandal to dominate Super Bowl week. You don't need proof.

Rob, for starters, when you are talking about an organization that has often behaved irrationally (NFL), common sense need not apply.

Second, you are saying that the league should be troubled by something which has been an issue for seven years and a) they have shown no signs of being troubled for in the past b) if anything, have seen an increase in interest and in ratings due to those purported troubles.

So why should the league be troubled, purely out of principle? Yeah, the NFL is the last place where that's going to matter. Sorry, you are trying to apply logic, reason and ethics to a place where those things do not reign.

 

[Ring 6]

True, but could it have been worse?

Who knows. Making statements without the facts rarely works out well.

 

[neuronet]

It is common sense that the league does not want a cheating scandal to dominate Super Bowl week. You don't need proof.

Not so sure about that...it keeps them in the headlines. You think Goodell is worried? Did he quickly come out and address it; is there evidence he is accelerating the investigation to kill the story?

 

[PatsFanSince74]

I posted this in the Deflate-Gate thread, but feel it deserves a separate thread.

This has been going on for years since Cameragate. It didn't work then, and it won't work now. ....

Mr. Kraft: WE shouldn't have to be dealing with this, YOU come out of the cave and deal with it. Stop worrying about being a "traitor to your class" and fight for your fans for once."

As the guy who posted out here (to much derision) the very day after spygate broke in 2007 that the Patriots had to get all over the issue before it got "legs" and took on "a life of its own," you are preaching to the choir. I've also posted several times that the way the Pats handled spygate in the media should be a case study in how not to deal with such matters.

I don't think we can expect there to be much change. It seems to be in the Patriots DNA to react in the way you describe. I don't think this is as worrisome. The spygate story took on a new life with the Tomass lies. Here, I think the NFL wants to kill the story as much as should the Patriots.

 

[Rob0729]

The league will be fine. I agree it's not good to have this the lead story for SB week but it's the Patriots brand that's taking all the hits on this. The NFL isn't going to suffer at all. That's why I say Kraft should do something besides possibly trying to hurry this along behind the scenes.

Long term the brand will be fine for both the NFL and the Patriots. But they are concerned with their immediate image.

 

[RobAllan]

It is common sense that the league does not want a cheating scandal to dominate Super Bowl week. You don't need proof.

Noooo the league couldn't possibly benefit from a major story like this before the biggest game of the year. A story being covered by every major news outlet on every major news show. A game that had no true "bad" guy because people hate both the Seahawks and the Patriots. This didn't give those wafflers something to root against at all.

You'd think it's common sense, but it's really not. This much media coverage would only increase people watching the game. They ought to just add the results findings to the halftime show to ensure people keep watching in case the game isn't close at the half.

 

[Rob0729]

Rob, for starters, when you are talking about an organization that has often behaved irrationally (NFL), common sense need not apply.

Second, you are saying that the league should be troubled by something which has been an issue for seven years and a) they have shown no signs of being troubled for in the past b) if anything, have seen an increase in interest and in ratings due to those purported troubles.

So why should the league be troubled, purely out of principle? Yeah, the NFL is the last place where that's going to matter. Sorry, you are trying to apply logic, reason and ethics to a place where those things do not reign.

I will turn it back on you. What evidence shows they aren't concerned?

I am sure no one wants this hanging over next week especially after the scandals this year.

 

[Rob0729]

Noooo the league couldn't possibly benefit from a major story like this before the biggest game of the year. A story being covered by every major news outlet on every major news show. A game that had no true "bad" guy because people hate both the Seahawks and the Patriots. This didn't give those wafflers something to root against at all.

You'd think it's common sense, but it's really not. This much media coverage would only increase people watching the game. They ought to just add the results findings to the halftime show to ensure people keep watching in case the game isn't close at the half.

So are you saying that the way the league and the Ravens botched the Ray Rice thing was great for the league? That dominated the news for weeks. Perhaps Goodell deserves a raise for generated much needed publicity for the league.

I am sorry, but the Super Bowl doesn't need extra publicity. It is the most watched sporting event in the world. It certainly doesn't need a cheating scandal for publicity.

 

[RobAllan]

I will turn it back on you. What evidence shows they aren't concerned?

I am sure no one wants this hanging over next week especially after the scandals this year.

Well, for starters, it's better people focus on this (lamest scandal in the NFL ever) than recapping all the truly rotten stuff instead before the game. This is a win for the league.

All the television attention all but ensures additional viewership for the game. This is a win for the league.

This Superbowl didn't have a good guy/bad guy thing. Nor did it have a TRUE underdog. (The 'Hawks were favored but most polling shows people think the Pats will win by a SLIM margin.) Now there's a definite reason to root for or against one of these teams. This is a win for the league.

Sorry to say, but from a marketing perspective (the only one that mattes where Gooddell, the owners, and $ are concerned) ... deflate-gate is a gift from the Gods. And there's no real negative outcome for anyone but the Patriots- and everyone already hates them anyway. So from a league perspective that's a null change.

I know what you're trying to say. In a perfect world this shouldn't be good for the league. But as it stands, it totally is.

 

[Rob0729]

Not so sure about that...it keeps them in the headlines. You think Goodell is worried? Did he quickly come out and address it; is there evidence he is accelerating the investigation to kill the story?

He's not trying to kill the story. He will conclude the investigation to resolve the story.

Why would the league need to let this run out for weeks? What evidence could they get two weeks from now that they wouldn't already have? That is the only reason they would extend the investigation is if they need to gather more evidence.

 

[BradyManny]

I will turn it back on you. What evidence shows they aren't concerned?

I am sure no one wants this hanging over next week especially after the scandals this year.

Rob, you keep saying you are sure no one wants this hanging over them next week. What is hanging over the NFL right now? Who has cast a light upon the integrity of the game - that's never been questioned, that's never been the issue. It's always the integrity of the Patriots.

You may be sure of your convictions here - but you should question them. Because I assure you: the NFL has faced zero negative repercussions for the reputation hits that the Patriots have taken, and if anything, the feedback to the NFL has been positive in the form of increased ratings and interest in games involving the Patriots.

So, you have a cycle here - Patriots do something borderline, Patriots take heat from stupid people and stupid media, viewers tune in. No one questions the NFL's integrity. Repeat. Where in this loop does something spur the NFL to panic when the Patriots are thrown under the bus? Nowhere.

As for the NFL not being concerned: there is seven years of evidence of the NFL leaving the Patriots out to dry, starting with spy gate. They botched that situation as bad as humanly possible, and only made the witch-hunt worse. Again, no fallback to NFL whatsoever, so stupid behavior is only reinforced. Look, even last week, Harbaugh comes out and accuses the Pats of deception - what was the NFL's response? Wait a day and quietly admit that no rules were violated? Real strong. They could've been on twitter that night to explain Harbaugh was wrong.

Now we have the ball thing, equally trivial and ridiculous - honestly, should've been fully investigated and a decision should've been made at this point. All they need to do is interview the ref and the ball boy, and any competent organization could've had that done by lunch yesterday. We'll see - if they wrap this up quickly, and I really hope they do, then yes, that would be evidence they are concerned. But I see a group that strikes quickly on anything that damages NFL reputation or threatens advertising, and a group that does not see the Patriots reputation issues bleeding onto them. And again, seeing the situation in which not only has it not damaged them, but it's benefited the game - why would they?

 

[RobAllan]

So are you saying that the way the league and the Ravens botched the Ray Rice thing was great for the league? That dominated the news for weeks. Perhaps Goodell deserves a raise for generated much needed publicity for the league.

I am sorry, but the Super Bowl doesn't need extra publicity. It is the most watched sporting event in the world. It certainly doesn't need a cheating scandal for publicity.

You can read my other post- Ray Rice was obviously bad for the league. This isn't even a real scandal, but now people are talking about it instead of Ray Rice, Peterson, et. al.

And it doesn't matter how big your event is- if you can get more people watching it's more ad sales and increased revenue for the next year. It absolutely does make a difference- it doesn't matter how big you are, you can always get bigger. Working in marketing for years I can tell you, the people that spent the most on it and wanted the most attention were the brands (and parent companies) that needed it least. The NFL is trying to grow the brand both here and abroad and there IS actually room to do both as insane as that sounds.

The thing with this is- even if the story ends tomorrow, it's now already the biggest talking point before the big game. Not Aaron Hernandez, not any random rapist on the Colts, not anybody else I mentioned above. It's kinda brilliant, actually, if you're not a fan of the team.

 

[Rob0729]

Well, for starters, it's better people focus on this (lamest scandal in the NFL ever) than recapping all the truly rotten stuff instead before the game. This is a win for the league.

All the television attention all but ensures additional viewership for the game. This is a win for the league.

This Superbowl didn't have a good guy/bad guy thing. Nor did it have a TRUE underdog. (The 'Hawks were favored but most polling shows people think the Pats will win by a SLIM margin.) Now there's a definite reason to root for or against one of these teams. This is a win for the league.

Sorry to say, but from a marketing perspective (the only one that mattes where Gooddell, the owners, and $ are concerned) ... deflate-gate is a gift from the Gods. And there's no real negative outcome for anyone but the Patriots- and everyone already hates them anyway. So from a league perspective that's a null change.

I know what you're trying to say. In a perfect world this shouldn't be good for the league. But as it stands, it totally is.

Huh?!? We are talking about the Super Bowl here. Do you really think anything that happens with Deflate Gate is going to increase or decrease the viewership of the Super Bowl? Do you really think there were hundreds of thousands or millions of people out there who weren't going to watch the Super Bowl change their minds because the Pats deflated a few footballs?

From a marketing standpoint, this is only negative. The league has already taken massive hits to their brand this year with Ray Rice, Adrian Peterson, and Greg Hardy. This is just another hit. Compared to the other ones, it is a minor hit. But it is still a hit.

 

[RobAllan]

And as predicted, Ben Volin just Tweeted it's "gone international" and he'll be on BBC to talk about it shortly. (You'll note BBC is the major broacaster in the country the NFL wants to move to next.) It practically writes itself.

Oh and us stupid Pats fans are more rabid to see our team win than ever now. And people that forgot they hate us, do again. What a great game this is now going to be!

 

[Rob0729]

Rob, you keep saying you are sure no one wants this hanging over them next week. What is hanging over the NFL right now? Who has cast a light upon the integrity of the game - that's never been questioned, that's never been the issue. It's always the integrity of the Patriots.

You may be sure of your convictions here - but you should question them. Because I assure you: the NFL has faced zero negative repercussions for the reputation hits that the Patriots have taken, and if anything, the feedback to the NFL has been positive in the form of increased ratings and interest in games involving the Patriots.

So, you have a loop here - Patriots do something borderline, Patriots take heat from stupid people and stupid media, viewers tune in. No one questions the NFL's integrity. Repeat. Where in this loop does something spur the NFL to panic when the Patriots are thrown under the bus? Nowhere.

As for the NFL not being concerned: there is seven years of evidence of the NFL leaving the Patriots out to dry, starting with spy gate. They botched that situation as bad as humanly possible, and only made the witch-hunt worse. Again, no fallback to NFL whatsoever, so stupid behavior is only reinforced. Look, even last week, Harbaugh comes out and accuses the Pats of deception - what was the NFL's response? Wait a day and quietly admit that no rules were violated? Real strong. They could've been on twitter that night to explain Harbaugh was wrong.

Now we have the ball thing, equally trivial and ridiculous - honestly, should've been fully investigated and a decision should've been made at this point. All they need to do is interview the ref and the ball boy, and any competent organization could've had that done by lunch yesterday. We'll see - if they wrap this up quickly, and I really hope they do, then yes, that would be evidence they are concerned. But I don't see it. I see a group that strikes quickly on anything that damages NFL reputation or threatens advertising, and a group that does not see the Patriots reputation issues bleeding onto them. And again, seeing the situation in which not only hasn't, but it's benefited the game - why would they?

What is hanging over the league? One of their Super Bowl participants are accused of cheating. If this is not resolved by next week, it will be the lead story. If the Patriots win, the Super Bowl is tainted because the winner cheated to get to the Super Bowl.

It is a trivial issue, but not if you let it snow ball. If the league doesn't resolve it quickly and lets it linger weeks, it is telling the public that this is a significant accusation of cheating and demands attention. A trivial issue is resolved quickly. If the league needs weeks to resolve it, it is on the level of Spygate or worse. Or at least that is the message they are sending.

 

[BradyManny]

Huh?!? We are talking about the Super Bowl here. Do you really think anything that happens with Deflate Gate is going to increase or decrease the viewership of the Super Bowl? Do you really think there were hundreds of thousands or millions of people out there who weren't going to watch the Super Bowl change their minds because the Pats deflated a few footballs?

To quote Glen Ordway: "you're making my point..." No, if anything, Deflate Gate only increases intrigue and viewership. How is it a bad thing for the NFL?

From a marketing standpoint, this is only negative. The league has already taken massive hits to their brand this year with Ray Rice, Adrian Peterson, and Greg Hardy. This is just another hit. Compared to the other ones, it is a minor hit. But it is still a hit.

Rob, no. It's not a hit. It's a hit on the Patriots. A hit would be activist groups showing up at media day next Tuesday to boycott the Super Bowl because of the NFL's embarrassing handling of the domestic violence situation. This is not a hit, it's a diversion, and the NFL knows its audience - stupid beer-drinking men who want to watch the big bad Patriots against the big bad Seahawks next Sunday. Ball-gate doesn't hurt, maybe helps that storyline.