Here Comes Dobsonmania

[Ivan]

Detroit is stout against the run? Expect our boys to spread them out and chuck it all around the schoolyard?

Here comes just the opposite. Bill will line up and run it right through the teeth all afternoon... Successfully.

If I were other teams Id prepare for the exact opposite of what everyone expects the Pats to do. Because well.. That's what Bill does.

That can be true but the more likely approach is to attack them where they are weak and minimize their strengths. The colts can't stop the patriots run game so they just ran it right down their throats, they pretty much announced that last week and did it all night long. I expect them to run outside and use the flats more often than they have been to date, and to spread them out and go no huddle to try and tire their big guys out. I don't expect many slow developing plays that set Brady up for sacks but think there will be a few long balls to keep them honest.

 

[Ivan]

You say that we are "overflowing in receiving talent", celebrating the talent and production of Amendola, Tyms, Dobson and even Thompkins. Some have other assessments of the current value of those players.

"overflowing in receiving talent" is a gross overstatement, but definitely like the depth that Amendola, Dobson, Tyms, and Wright give them. No team can afford pro bowl receivers all the way down the depth chart and imo the Patriots depth at those spots is very good in relative terms. other than Amendola most of them are still developing as players and have a good ceiling if they develop the way the patriots want them to.

 

[AzPatsFan]

You say that we are "overflowing in receiving talent", celebrating the talent and production of Amendola, Tyms, Dobson and even Thompkins. Some have other assessments of the current value of those players.

Yes, the Haters must continue to hate...

 

[Oswlek]

You say that we are "overflowing in receiving talent", celebrating the talent and production of Amendola, Tyms, Dobson and even Thompkins. Some have other assessments of the current value of those players.

I'm totally confused by this post. Your comment doesn't reflect at all what I wrote, even going so far as to put a phrase in quotes that I've never said. Did you mean to reply to someone else?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

"overflowing in receiving talent" is a gross overstatement, but definitely like the depth that Amendola, Dobson, Tyms, and Wright give them. No team can afford pro bowl receivers all the way down the depth chart and imo the Patriots depth at those spots is very good in relative terms. other than Amendola most of them are still developing as players and have a good ceiling if they develop the way the patriots want them to.

I would say we have a bottom 10 receiving corps. I don't think Amendola, Dobson, or Tyms would have even made the roster on some of the past teams. LaFell and Edelman are the only productive receivers we have. Now, if you want to add in Gronkowski and Vereen, our overall skill position players are right up there.

I believe that Dobson and Tyms would be a monumental dropoff at the critical #1 receiver spot if LaFell went down. I do think that Amendola would be okay filling in for Edelman if Brady were forced to use him more. He wouldn't be as good, but I think he is still an above average slot receiver. In fact, I think he is better today than Wes Welker.

 

[Oswlek]

I don't think Amendola, Dobson, or Tyms would have even made the roster on some of the past teams.

Which teams are those? 2007? 2004?

I bet at least two of them would have made more than half of NE's rosters over Brady's career. Tyms may not be doing much, but he's no worse than Bethel Johnson who was on the team from 2003-2005, or the bevy of guys NE kept rotating in from 2009-2013 hoping to find some quality depth.

In fairness to Bethel, he was a hell of a returner in 2003 - NE doesn't win the SB without him - but he was basically a Tyms level contributor from then on, and those were with some good teams.

 

[KA-]

I fine with them waiting until he is needed to use him, right now the only player i can see himj taking snaps from is Tyms and he is far from "hot."

Yes but Tyms barely gets any snaps ... Dobson comes off as a player who needs a flow of passes to get into rhythm while Tyms is that guy you throw in and tell him to run deep and see if he can beat anyone for a big play

 

[mgteich]

I'm totally confused by this post. Your comment doesn't reflect at all what I wrote, even going so far as to put a phrase in quotes that I've never said. Did you mean to reply to someone else?

The comment I was responding to was Ivan's. He has made a further comment. I apologize for any confusion.

 

[mgteich]

I would say we have a bottom 10 receiving corps. I don't think Amendola, Dobson, or Tyms would have even made the roster on some of the past teams. LaFell and Edelman are the only productive receivers we have. Now, if you want to add in Gronkowski and Vereen, our overall skill position players are right up there.

I believe that Dobson and Tyms would be a monumental dropoff at the critical #1 receiver spot if LaFell went down. I do think that Amendola would be okay filling in for Edelman if Brady were forced to use him more. He wouldn't be as good, but I think he is still an above average slot receiver. In fact, I think he is better today than Wes Welker.

I believe Amendola would have made almost all our past teams. A 2nd round receiver in his 2nd year with Dobson's rookie stats also would have made almost every team.

 

[mgteich]

"overflowing in receiving talent" is a gross overstatement, but definitely like the depth that Amendola, Dobson, Tyms, and Wright give them. No team can afford pro bowl receivers all the way down the depth chart and imo the Patriots depth at those spots is very good in relative terms. other than Amendola most of them are still developing as players and have a good ceiling if they develop the way the patriots want them to.

I suspect that if we match our wide receivers against other playoff quality passing teams, we don't measure up well, not the starters, not the backups. We do well in the passing game because of Brady, Vereen, our OL and our TE's.
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That being said, since we don't need much from our backup WR's, the ones that we have are OK, and yes they have potential. That may sound good, but come next year, most of us will be looking to cut Amendola (because of his salary, and hope to have upgrades over Dobson and Tyms. To put it another way, WR will be a need for the patriots in the next off-season, unless the team is willing to keep DA, which they just might need to do.

 

[AzPatsFan]

I suspect that if we match our wide receivers against other playoff quality passing teams, we don't measure up well, not the starters, not the backups. We do well in the passing game because of Brady, Vereen, our OL and our TE's.
=================

That being said, since we don't need much from our backup WR's, the ones that we have are OK, and yes they have potential. That may sound good, but come next year, most of us will be looking to cut Amendola (because of his salary, and hope to have upgrades over Dobson and Tyms. To put it another way, WR will be a need for the patriots in the next off-season, unless the team is willing to keep DA, which they just might need to do.

Amendola compensation must be addressed in the off-season. It is not clear that he is cut.

Why do so many think that rookie WRs are an improvement? History shows that most require three seasons of grooming to become productive.

What ever comparisons are made to the Lombardi teams front liners, not a single one was anywhere as deep as this team. Who was the 4th, 5th and 6th WRs on those teams?

 

[ATippett56]

I suspect that if we match our wide receivers against other playoff quality passing teams, we don't measure up well, not the starters, not the backups. We do well in the passing game because of Brady, Vereen, our OL and our TE's.
=================

That being said, since we don't need much from our backup WR's, the ones that we have are OK, and yes they have potential. That may sound good, but come next year, most of us will be looking to cut Amendola (because of his salary, and hope to have upgrades over Dobson and Tyms. To put it another way, WR will be a need for the patriots in the next off-season, unless the team is willing to keep DA, which they just might need to do.

Cutting Danny Amendola's base salary from $4 million to $2 million provides the same benefit as cutting Danny Amendola outright.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-england-patriots/danny-amendola/

 

[mgteich]

Cutting Danny Amendola's base salary from $4 million to $2 million provides the same benefit as cutting Danny Amendola outright.

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-england-patriots/danny-amendola/

First, that is not true. You are referring to the effect on the 2015 cap and ignoring the dead money.

Second, there is no reason to believe that Amendola would accept a new contract from the patriots at $2M for 2015 services. Of course, his acceptance would depend on the new bonus and other terms of the contract.

 

[RayClay]

I suspect that if we match our wide receivers against other playoff quality passing teams, we don't measure up well, not the starters, not the backups. We do well in the passing game because of Brady, Vereen, our OL and our TE's.
=================

That being said, since we don't need much from our backup WR's, the ones that we have are OK, and yes they have potential. That may sound good, but come next year, most of us will be looking to cut Amendola (because of his salary, and hope to have upgrades over Dobson and Tyms. To put it another way, WR will be a need for the patriots in the next off-season, unless the team is willing to keep DA, which they just might need to do.

We need about 2 1/2 WRs with Gronk, Wright and Vereen, so I would say having decent receivers in reserve would make us overflowing. Definitely compared to last year.

 

[RayClay]

I don't care about next year, by the way. One of our WRs could be super Bowl MVP and looking for a big pay day for all we know.

 

[RayClay]

I would like to see one or two receivers (including amendola) worked in and this week might be the time to do it. they might want to go 4-5 wide some time and they need to get a comfort zone with those other receivers for it to be effective. Especially if they want to use the hurry up.

Whoever gives us the best chance to win.

 

[supafly]

You say that we are "overflowing in receiving talent", celebrating the talent and production of Amendola, Tyms, Dobson and even Thompkins. Some have other assessments of the current value of those players.

Yes, the Haters must continue to hate...

Because Amendola (11 catches), Tyms (1 catch), Dobson (3 catches), and Thompkins (13 catches) are all producing quite nicely, right?

Damn those "haters"...trying to tell it like it is! Always so negative.

 

[KA-]

Because Amendola (11 catches), Tyms (1 catch), Dobson (3 catches), and Thompkins (13 catches) are all producing quite nicely, right?

Damn those "haters"...trying to tell it like it is! Always so negative.

I don't think it's fair to expect every single WR on the team to be putting up good numbers, what type of numbers do you think would fall under your definition of "producing" this far into the season while considering how the Pats game plan for each team?


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After reading threads like this, I think a lot of people want the Pats to be like their fantasy teams, it's just not going to happen. Why would someone like LaFell lose looks to let's say ... Dobson? To pad Dobson's stats so the fans can rest easy? I just don't see the logic behind it, we have players who are producing, eating up a lot of targets, and killing defenses ... would you want to risk this kind of production for pretty much unknowns just so they can be considered as "producing"? I would probably have a different outlook on this if these games were close and we were struggling passing the ball, but we're not, these games have been complete blow outs and TB is putting up MVP numbers.

Do I think the Pats need to rework their WR roster? Of course, what team doesn't want to get better? But a lot of people on these forums need to realize we can't just go out and get big ticket names, we all know BB loves having depth on the roster so it doesn't really mix well with adding big ticket names.

Unfortunately, looking at the FA list for next season ... there isn't much available. There are some viable options but I have no idea what the price of those viable options would be (Cobb, Maclin, Smith) just to name a few of the bigger names, and I don't think those guys even have much of a shot to leave their current teams. Maybe Maclin.

Amendola - He was getting a lot of work early in the season and he looked terrible, now he has settled into a smaller role which fits him better. Considering what is out there for next season, I think they need to redo his contract to something much more realistic and use him the same way.

It really comes down to picking your poison .. do you want a Defense with Revis + depth while adding 1 WR FA (not a big ticket name). Or do you want to stack the offense and limit what you can do in all other areas of your football team? I pick Revis/Depth/a LaFell type of WR. We have Tom Brady, he brings the best out of players and it's also proven that the craziest offenses in NFL history could not win the Superbowl ... twice.

I'm not really going to get into this part too much because this post has gone long enough (maybe a different post), but Julio Jones is the perfect example why you can't go all in to move up to get that caliber of WR in the draft. He has been a complete beast and is everything you expected, but all teams will rob you for that kind of pick. ATL gave up 5 picks, 5 picks. They have crippled their current team

 

[mgteich]

We need about 2 1/2 WRs with Gronk, Wright and Vereen, so I would say having decent receivers in reserve would make us overflowing. Definitely compared to last year.

I agree that we need 2 1/2 WR. The 1/2 is Amendola, who, IMHO, is OK in his role of getting a few reps and being the injury backup for major reps. Many disagree with me and don't think that Amendola is doing his job and that we have only 2, rather than 2 1/2 WR's.

Yes, I AGREE that having decent receivers in reserve would make us overflowing. Based on what we've seen, I don't see Tyms, Dobson or Boyce as decent receivers for the 2014 season. To put it another way, I think that we'd be better off if these "decent receivers" got zero reps and we saw more of Wright.

 

[RayClay]

I agree that we need 2 1/2 WR. The 1/2 is Amendola, who, IMHO, is OK in his role of getting a few reps and being the injury backup for major reps. Many disagree with me and don't think that Amendola is doing his job and that we have only 2, rather than 2 1/2 WR's.

Yes, I AGREE that having decent receivers in reserve would make us overflowing. Based on what we've seen, I don't see Tyms, Dobson or Boyce as decent receivers for the 2014 season. To put it another way, I think that we'd be better off if these "decent receivers" got zero reps and we saw more of Wright.

I think they have talents others don't (I love La Fell, but am not sold on him as a deep threat). I'd be happy to see one or both worked into a package even if it's seldom used. One or two big plays at crucial times can define a season, certainly a playoff game.