Is Caldwell done?

[shmessy]

When Patten was here there also was 3 other great recivers on the team. This season there was only Caldwell to throw too. Caldwell was a number one, Patten was a number 3 behind Branch and Givens.

Which means that Caldwell faced far tighter coverages than Patten ever did.

Plus you failed to see what Dabruinz wrote: They were thrown to almost the same amount, 102-95, but Caldwell caught 61 and Patten 44, a far better percentage (especially in a year when Brady was so uncharacteristically off target. No one talked about how Brady was so off target on so many easy throws before this year).

Caldwell had a great year last year, and will be an excellent #3 for this team.

You favorably comparing Patten with him is ridiculous.

 

[MDPATSFAN]

Some of these posts about getting rid of Caldwell kill me. Yeah... let's completely turnover wr personnel and field F-Troop while Peyton's crew religously practice timing routes and become an even better machine.

At least we will be able to dissect Brady's body language this fall.

Seriously, there is something to be said for continuity especially at this position.

 

[PATSNUTme]

 

[PatsFan37]

I'm not even going to dignify the naysayers in this thread by reading their comments. It's 13 pages of at least a few people dissing last year's most reliable receiver in his first year with the team.

I'm only writing in case someone important (Caldwell, his wife) read this.

Caldwell is fast, strong, reliable, unbelievably tough and made a lot of key catches. He IS Brady's favorite target. He'd better be back next year or Brady will be pissed.

Okay, he missed a couple catches. And Brady threw an interception to Champ Bailey for a touchdown. You want to cut 'em both? Big-time players are put in big-time situations and sometimes they will screw up. Get over it.

Welker, Stallworth, and Washington have a lot to prove. So does Caldwell, but he's already spent a year proving it.

 

[shmessy]

I'm not even going to dignify the naysayers in this thread by reading their comments. It's 13 pages of at least a few people dissing last year's most reliable receiver in his first year with the team.

I'm only writing in case someone important (Caldwell, his wife) read this.

Caldwell is fast, strong, reliable, unbelievably tough and made a lot of key catches. He IS Brady's favorite target. He'd better be back next year or Brady will be pissed.

Okay, he missed a couple catches. And Brady threw an interception to Champ Bailey for a touchdown. You want to cut 'em both? Big-time players are put in big-time situations and sometimes they will screw up. Get over it.

Welker, Stallworth, and Washington have a lot to prove. So does Caldwell, but he's already spent a year proving it.

Well put. I would only add that he took the most HELLACIOUS hit I've ever seen last year (Bengals game) and came back to play IN THE SAME GAME.

He has the heart of a lion and will hopefully be a #3 or #4 WR for this team for a long time to come.

 

[MDPATSFAN]

I'm not even going to dignify the naysayers in this thread by reading their comments. It's 13 pages of at least a few people dissing last year's most reliable receiver in his first year with the team.

I'm only writing in case someone important (Caldwell, his wife) read this.

Caldwell is fast, strong, reliable, unbelievably tough and made a lot of key catches. He IS Brady's favorite target. He'd better be back next year or Brady will be pissed.

Okay, he missed a couple catches. And Brady threw an interception to Champ Bailey for a touchdown. You want to cut 'em both? Big-time players are put in big-time situations and sometimes they will screw up. Get over it.

Welker, Stallworth, and Washington have a lot to prove. So does Caldwell, but he's already spent a year proving it.

There were lots letdowns in the AFCG...Hobbs being hit in the back with a sure interception if he played the ball, Moroney performing the Tony Eason possum move several times, stupid penalties, missed tackles, etc.... Not sure why some obsess about Caldwell.

 

[Rob0729]

There were lots letdowns in the AFCG...Hobbs being hit in the back with a sure interception if he played the ball, Moroney performing the Tony Eason possum move several times, stupid penalties, missed tackles, etc.... Not sure why some obsess about Caldwell.

It is the Bill Buckner mentality. Buckner wasn't the only reason the Red Sox lost the World Series in 1986. In fact, in the grand scheme of things his error should not have lost the Red Sox the World Series if it wasn't for other mistakes by the Red Sox. But it was the ball dribbling through his legs that people seem to drawn to because it is a real bonehead play that people can point to and say that is why they lost. People seem to forget that that was game six of a series that went 7 games. People seem to forget that Calvin Schraldi blew saves in game six and seven including being one strike away from winning game six. People forget McNamara mysteriously pulled Roger Clemmens early in game six. If you ask most people why the Red Sox lost the 86 World Series, they will blame Buckner.

That is what people are doing with Caldwell. He dropped two passes that looked relatively easy to catch and they are blaming him for the loss. There are other reasons why we lost, but some people won't blame Brady no matter what and other plays were less obvious.

 

[Deus Irae]

It is the Bill Buckner mentality. Buckner wasn't the only reason the Red Sox lost the World Series in 1986. In fact, in the grand scheme of things his error should not have lost the Red Sox the World Series if it wasn't for other mistakes by the Red Sox. But it was the ball dribbling through his legs that people seem to drawn to because it is a real bonehead play that people can point to and say that is why they lost. People seem to forget that that was game six of a series that went 7 games. People seem to forget that Calvin Schraldi blew saves in game six and seven including being one strike away from winning game six. People forget McNamara mysteriously pulled Roger Clemmens early in game six. If you ask most people why the Red Sox lost the 86 World Series, they will blame Buckner.

That is what people are doing with Caldwell. He dropped two passes that looked relatively easy to catch and they are blaming him for the loss. There are other reasons why we lost, but some people won't blame Brady no matter what and other plays were less obvious.

For the record, I've always blamed Gedman because of the passed ball. They called it a wild pitch, but it was easily catchable.

 

[Terry Glenn is a cowgirl]

Caldwell had a great year last year, and will be an excellent #3 for this team.

While I don't agree that Caldwell had a great year last year, he would be far better suited to the #3 spot.

 

[shmessy]

While I don't agree that Caldwell had a great year last year, he would be far better suited to the #3 spot.

OK, that's fine. However, this thread was called "Is Caldwell Done?" And many of the posters had, incredibly, been arguing for the affirmative.

 

[salty]

OK, that's fine. However, this thread was called "Is Caldwell Done?" And many of the posters had, incredibly, been arguing for the affirmative.

I'm pretty sure Solman was the only one who actually said he would be cut. Most people who dislike Caldwell were saying he will be the 4th or 5th WR.

 

[Kdo5]

I'm pretty sure Solman was the only one who actually said he would be cut. Most people who dislike Caldwell were saying he will be the 4th or 5th WR.

In the Caldwell haters' dreams.

 

[frankiesfly]

Which means that Caldwell faced far tighter coverages than Patten ever did.

You really think teams were fearing Caldwell. Lmao. Like he is T.O or something. Teams covered Caldwell like any crappy reciever. Thats why he was open. I dont even know why i responded, u got the moderator disease.

 

[BradyManny]

This thread just won't die will it.

 

[pats1]

You really think teams were fearing Caldwell. Lmao. Like he is T.O or something. Teams covered Caldwell like any crappy reciever. Thats why he was open. I dont even know why i responded, u got the moderator disease.

What's next in your bag of excuses?

 

[SamBamsFan]

Folks here seem to be assuming that Caldwell and Gaffney will make the team, but with all the receiving talent that we have brought in that seems increasingly unlikely.

Caldwell will cost us nearly $1.9M in 2007. Its nice that Tom Brady is already familiar with him, but I don't think he has the talent to justify that kind of cap hit. Especially not as a fourth string receiver or worse.

I think that BB may be planning to drop Caldwell like a Tom Brady AFC Championship game pass.

I doubt that Kelly Washington makes the team. He is the epitome of JAG.

 

[solman]

I'm pretty sure Solman was the only one who actually said he would be cut. Most people who dislike Caldwell were saying he will be the 4th or 5th WR.

To avoid having others state my beliefs for me, here is what I believe:

1. It is more likely than not that Caldwell will be cut, traded or restructured downwards.
   I am still accepting bets from people who believe that he will be on the Patriot's opening day 53 man roster, and will be following up tomorrow with those who have already expressed interest.
   
   
2. Talent is often poorly measured by on field statistics.
   Caldwell had 61 catches last year which was 41st best in the league, but I don't believe that he is even remotely the 41st best receiver in the league.
   Washington had 9 receptions last year, but I think there is a better than 25% chance he will be a star.
   
   
3. Players should be cut when their roster space and salary cap space can be better spent on other players.
   Like Reche, Dillon had a solid season last year. (28th in the NFL in rushing).
   Dillon didn't do anythong wrong to deserve getting cut. He just didn't have the talent to justify the nearly $4.8M due to him this year.
   
   
4. Compared to what we paid for him, I think that Reche Caldwell had an amazing season for us last year.
   I'm upset about his drops, but they don't play a huge role in my assesment of his talent.
   I have never disliked or hated him.
   
   
5. Compared to most #1 receivers in the NFL, Reche's talents are poor.
   His 61 catches are primarily a consequence of his being the best receiver on a Patriot's team with a serious defficiency at receiver.
   I don't think he has a great ability to make plays after catching the ball.
   I don't think he has great hands.
   I don't think he has a great ability to get open in one on one match ups.
   
   
6. $1.9M is more than we should pay for a receiver of Caldwell's talents.
   

I'm done arguing this. Football is played on the field. The 2007 season will determine who was right.

This is the last time I will visit this thread.

If you still believe that Reche will make the 53 man opening day roster without a substantial downward restructuring, and you would like to make money off of my belief to the contrary, please send me a PM with your email address, so we can arrange a bet.

 

[shmessy]

To avoid having others state my beliefs for me, here is what I believe:

1. It is more likely than not that Caldwell will be cut, traded or restructured downwards.
   I am still accepting bets from people who believe that he will be on the Patriot's opening day 53 man roster, and will be following up tomorrow with those who have already expressed interest.
   
   
2. Talent is often poorly measured by on field statistics.
   Caldwell had 61 catches last year which was 41st best in the league, but I don't believe that he is even remotely the 41st best receiver in the league.
   Washington had 9 receptions last year, but I think there is a better than 25% chance he will be a star.
   
   
3. Players should be cut when their roster space and salary cap space can be better spent on other players.
   Like Reche, Dillon had a solid season last year. (28th in the NFL in rushing).
   Dillon didn't do anythong wrong to deserve getting cut. He just didn't have the talent to justify the nearly $4.8M due to him this year.
   
   
4. Compared to what we paid for him, I think that Reche Caldwell had an amazing season for us last year.
   I'm upset about his drops, but they don't play a huge role in my assesment of his talent.
   I have never disliked or hated him.
   
   
5. Compared to most #1 receivers in the NFL, Reche's talents are poor.
   His 61 catches are primarily a consequence of his being the best receiver on a Patriot's team with a serious defficiency at receiver.
   I don't think he has a great ability to make plays after catching the ball.
   I don't think he has great hands.
   I don't think he has a great ability to get open in one on one match ups.
   
   
6. $1.9M is more than we should pay for a receiver of Caldwell's talents.
   

I'm done arguing this. Football is played on the field. The 2007 season will determine who was right.

This is the last time I will visit this thread.

If you still believe that Reche will make the 53 man opening day roster without a substantial downward restructuring, and you would like to make money off of my belief to the contrary, please send me a PM with your email address, so we can arrange a bet.

Thank you. That was a reasoned analysis. I don't agree with the conclusion, but it was not the "I hate his big eyes, and he dropped two passes so he should be gone" junk that wastes everybodies time.

You make several good points in it. I don't think ANYONE is stating he will be our #1 this year. Regarding your point #5, it is moot, since he won't be our #1 WR this year. Also, you're comparing him to #1's who had been in their systems more than one year.

But he does have the confidence and rapport with Brady and should be a very solid #3 or #4. Whether or not he restructures his contract, I have no idea. This is not a normal cap year and the Pats are oozing cap space. I believe the Pats definitely want him on the team next year because of his experience and rapport with Brady.

 

[pats1]

To avoid having others state my beliefs for me, here is what I believe:

1. It is more likely than not that Caldwell will be cut, traded or restructured downwards.
   I am still accepting bets from people who believe that he will be on the Patriot's opening day 53 man roster, and will be following up tomorrow with those who have already expressed interest.
2. Talent is often poorly measured by on field statistics.
   Caldwell had 61 catches last year which was 41st best in the league, but I don't believe that he is even remotely the 41st best receiver in the league.
   Washington had 9 receptions last year, but I think there is a better than 25% chance he will be a star.
3. Players should be cut when their roster space and salary cap space can be better spent on other players.
   Like Reche, Dillon had a solid season last year. (28th in the NFL in rushing).
   Dillon didn't do anythong wrong to deserve getting cut. He just didn't have the talent to justify the nearly $4.8M due to him this year.
4. Compared to what we paid for him, I think that Reche Caldwell had an amazing season for us last year.
   I'm upset about his drops, but they don't play a huge role in my assesment of his talent.
   I have never disliked or hated him.
5. Compared to most #1 receivers in the NFL, Reche's talents are poor.
   His 61 catches are primarily a consequence of his being the best receiver on a Patriot's team with a serious defficiency at receiver.
   I don't think he has a great ability to make plays after catching the ball.
   I don't think he has great hands.
   I don't think he has a great ability to get open in one on one match ups.
6. $1.9M is more than we should pay for a receiver of Caldwell's talents.

I'm done arguing this. Football is played on the field. The 2007 season will determine who was right.

This is the last time I will visit this thread.

If you still believe that Reche will make the 53 man opening day roster without a substantial downward restructuring, and you would like to make money off of my belief to the contrary, please send me a PM with your email address, so we can arrange a bet.

I can't see how you believe the Patriots go cut and dry, "if we are paying him more than he is worth, then we cut him, regardless." That's not how the Patriots work.

A) I don't think think the Patriots believe they are paying Caldwell more than he is worth. If it was 2005 again, I'd probably say yes. But the salary cap situation in the NFL has changed drastically since then.

B) Again, even if they did believe they were overpaying him, that doesn't mean he's automatically going to be cut. There are other factors. The Patriots don't have tunnel vision. He's great insurance, he has shown he can be a decent starter, and the Pats' cap situation right now isn't prohibiting them from doing anything else. With the cap space they have right now, cutting him because he, at least in your eyes, "is being paid more than he is worth" wouldn't make sense. They'd gain $1,871,000 in cap room, but there aren't any players out there with equal value that you'd be able to get for a lesser price. And if you got less talent for a lesser price, you'd still have plenty of cap room left - more than what you started with - and a worse player to show for it. It just doesn't make sense.

 

[DaBruinz]

While I don't agree that Caldwell had a great year last year, he would be far better suited to the #3 spot.

This coming from the person who originally said you preferred Patten over Caldwell....

Caldwell is a good #2 receiver who was forced into the #1 role and didn't have a lot of support on the other side. He did well all things considered.

With the amount of competition the Pats will have in camp competing for the top 2 spots, it will be a very interesting camp. Currently, Caldwell and Gaffney have a leg up on Stallworth and Washington. It will be interesting to see how those two come in and do.

What is nice is that the Pats have 5 quality receivers and it will be hard for teams to cover them all.