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* Off The Grid's Official Rant & Rave Thread ~ 2013 Version!! *


I'm more of a believer in the chart than some, but I think there's also a natural premium on more chances.

Well said.

I am actually a big Fan of the Chart ~ I find it to be an enjoyable, useful Reference.

It's only when somebody lays it down as Gospel, with a manifestly complete lack of understanding of how Market Forces play Havoc with what I love to call "Book Value", and propose to denounce far more informed and thoughtful opinions that've just as clearly made Allowances for same...that I tweak out. :D

Dare I ask the name of your Book??
spock.gif
 


That's 88 Points for 142 Points, For Those Scoring At Home.

And the Chart that I used ~ while certainly subject to the foibles of Human Error & Subjectivity ~ is actually based on Historical Facts, which is more than one can say for somebody referencing JJ's Chart and vapidly calling it Gospel. :rolleyes:


I dont think the traditional value chart is the end all be all and of course it has its flaws but if you look at all the trades tonight they all line up value wise pretty well with that chart....and what worries me is BB's track record of picking WR in the 2nd or 3rd round
 
I dont think the traditional value chart is the end all be all and of course it has its flaws but if you look at all the trades tonight they all line up value wise pretty well with that chart....and what worries me is BB's track record of picking WR in the 2nd or 3rd round

You completely missed the clearly expressed Point.
 
OTG, what do you think of DB David Amerson? Would you take him in the 2nd or 3rd if available?
 
Holy Crap!! :eek:

We just RAVAGED the Vikings!!! :rocker:
Geico Commercial:

Pats Fans watching the 2013 NFL Draft today sure are happy.

How happy are they?

I'd say happier than Off The Grid after a Bill Belichick first round trade down with the Minnesota Vikings.
 
OTG, what do you think of DB David Amerson? Would you take him in the 2nd or 3rd if available?

Honored to be asked, Brother Reign. :cool:

I'm afraid that you won't care for my answer, but here it is:

David Amerson Scouting Report ~ 2013 NFL Draft -

I do believe he's got Potential, and while I'd prefer to see us deploy our Resources elsewhere, I would consider'm a reasonable Return for a late 3rd Rounder, Bro. I think he's got a Future as a Free Safety, and we need Depth, there.
 
Geico Commercial:

Pats Fans watching the 2013 NFL Draft today sure are happy.

How happy are they?

I'd say happier than Off The Grid after a Bill Belichick first round trade down with the Minnesota Vikings.

OK, I literally laughed out loud, just now!! Thanks!! :D :rocker:
 
I dont think the traditional value chart is the end all be all and of course it has its flaws but if you look at all the trades tonight they all line up value wise pretty well with that chart....and what worries me is BB's track record of picking WR in the 2nd or 3rd round

Forgive me. The style of your responses stuck in my craw ~ obviously ~ but you deserve an answer, and I've been remiss in providing it.

Clearly, you're Zeroed In on WideOuts, yet worried that Coach Bill is so God Awfully bad at picking WideOuts on what is now Day 2 that his decamping from Day 1 worries you considerably...Is that about right?

If so, I can offer you this Comfort, much good may it do you: There are a lot of quality Split Ends & Flankers who project to the 2nd & 3rd Round ~ in which we now suddenly hold 4 Picks, Praise Jeebus!! :D ~ intelligent guys who can run a Route Tree. This Year offers remarkable Depth of Talent at those Positions.

I can offer no Comfort regarding Coach Bill's Record, as it has been awful of late, though I would remind you that he's not perfect: Deion Branch being a wonderful example of success, albeit many, many Years ago. :eek:

Sorry to've taken so long to get back to you...and to've been a bit snippy!! :D
 
OK, I literally laughed out loud, just now!! Thanks!! :D :rocker:
By the way, I love the trade down since the sweet spot in the 2013 NFL Draft is the second round and third round.

New England Patriots roster needs to address depth at the following positions:

Defensive End (Cornellius Carradine)
Defensive Tackle (Bennie Logan)
Wide Receiver (Markus Wheaton and Josh Boyce)
Interior Offensive Line (Brian Schwenke or Barrett Jones)
Safety (anyone not named Steve Gregory)
Cornerback (anyone not nicknamed Glass-IR Dowling)
 
Honored to be asked, Brother Reign. :cool:

I'm afraid that you won't care for my answer, but here it is:

David Amerson Scouting Report ~ 2013 NFL Draft -

I do believe he's got Potential, and while I'd prefer to see us deploy our Resources elsewhere, I would consider'm a reasonable Return for a late 3rd Rounder, Bro. I think he's got a Future as a Free Safety, and we need Depth, there.

I appreciate your timely response and evaluation. I'm a bit disappointed but everything in your analysis is dead on. I read through a few other prospects I'm watching and must say my eye for talent isn't very good...this year anyway.

If Werner had been available at 29 would you have taken him or accepted the trade? He's the one of the few I pegged as a blue chip player.
 
This is a Chart which in my opinion reflects a far more accurate Valuation of the Picks.

But one must always remember that every single Pick's Value is 100% Relative to Circumstances.

Having so stipulated...

That Chart suggests these Book Values ~ that's my Term ~ for the Picks swapped tonight:

#29 > 88

#52 > 63

#83 > 43

#102 > 35

#229 > 01


That's 88 Points for 142 Points, For Those Scoring At Home.

And the Chart that I used ~ while certainly subject to the foibles of Human Error & Subjectivity ~ is actually based on Historical Facts, which is more than one can say for somebody referencing JJ's Chart and vapidly calling it Gospel. :rolleyes:

I'll take that Trade. :cool:

Like I said: We ravaged them.

I too was praying (to my Lord & Master Satan) that Bill would trade out of the first round
in order to acquire more picks. Then when I saw the logo of the Pats on the clock change
to that of the Vikes, I thought that we better get their 3rd-rounder for this far of a drop
instead of their 4th. Considering that we received not only their 3rd but also their 4th,
5th & 7th makes this trade OK in my book.

I gotta admit, though, that waiting until #52 to make our first pick seems like a long time.
Perhaps as Patchick suggested, Bill might now think about packaging a 2 & a 3 in order to
move into the late 30s/early 40s.
 
I'm more of a believer in the chart than some, but I think there's also a natural premium on more chances.

With all of those picks, the Patriots now have tremendous flexibility to work the board throughout day 2. (In fact, they could easily package the 2nd & 3rd from the Vikings to take the player they would have taken at 29, walking away with a free 4th & 7th.)

I agree on both points. And welcome back, too.
 
By the way, I love the trade down since the sweet spot in the 2013 NFL Draft is the second round and third round.

New England Patriots roster needs to address depth at the following positions:

Defensive End (Cornellius Carradine)
Defensive Tackle (Bennie Logan)
Wide Receiver (Markus Wheaton and Josh Boyce)
Interior Offensive Line (Brian Schwenke or Barrett Jones)
Safety (anyone not named Steve Gregory)
Cornerback (anyone not nicknamed Glass-IR Dowling)

I like the positions you addressed, including Carradine, Wheaton, Schwenke/Jones,
the anti-Gregory & the anti-Glass IR.
 
I appreciate your timely response and evaluation. I'm a bit disappointed but everything in your analysis is dead on. I read through a few other prospects I'm watching and must say my eye for talent isn't very good...this year anyway.

If Werner had been available at 29 would you have taken him or accepted the trade? He's the one of the few I pegged as a blue chip player.

Good Morning!! How I love the occasions when I get to sleep at night!! :D

Philosophically, I am such a rabid fan of Trading Down ~ and that particular Trade was so heavily tipped in our favor, from my Perspective ~ that I would've considered it even if Star Lotulelei had still been on the Board.

Had I been running things, I would've traded Mallett to the highest Bidder, which I strongly suspect may very well have netted us #38 from the Cardinals, which would've greatly influenced my answer to your Query.

But I'm assuming that your Query precludes any such machinations...

Thinking, thinking, thinking...
39.gif


Well, after much agonizing reflection, I am going to say that I'd've taken the Trade.

1 ~ Passing on Bjoern Werner ~ or his TeamMate, Tank Carradine, who I like even more and is still available ~ would probably cause me physical Pain, as I believe that the import of a Top Level Defensive End could ~ across from Chandler Jones ~ cause a dramatic Ripple Effect for our Defense far in excess of'is nominal Value.

2 ~ Therefore, the Opportunity Cost of passing on Werner & Carradine ~ for there's no way in Hell that either would be available, come #52 ~ could be immense. If you care to read them, these Factors are what persuade me:

3 ~ We are aiming far higher, but Rob Ninkovich was pretty adept on the Job in 2012, and I believe it's important to consider how much better he'll likely be in 2013, with a full Year of experience under'is belt.

4 ~ Jake Bequette & Justin Francis are unknown quantities ~ as indeed are Werner & Carradine, though less so ~ but I believe that they offer considerable UpSide, though not as dynamic, mind you.

5 ~ All of which is to say: I expect considerable improvement and substantially increased Impact in 2013, simply from developing who we already have at Defensive End, albeit not the Impact of Werner or Carradine.

6 ~ As such, the possibilities inherent in that remarkable Heist seduce me. If we trade down a few more times ~ and we should have no problems doing so ~ #29 could actually parlay into several of the following Prospects:

QB Sean Renfree ~ 6th/7th Round

OC Barrett Jones ~ 3rd/4th Round

OG Hugh Thornton ~ 4th/5th Round

OG Joe Tretter ~ 6th/7th Round

OT Reid Fragel ~ 4th/5th Round

TE Travis Kelce ~ 3rd/4th Round

XE Jordan Reed ~ 3rd/4th Round

SE Christopher Harper ~ 4th/5th Round

SE Corey Fuller ~ 6th/7th Round

FL Marquise Goodwin ~ 4th/5th Round

XB Marcus Lattimore ~ 4th/5th Round

XB Kerwynn Williams ~ 6th/7th Round

XB Latavius Murray ~ 6th/7th Round

XB Damon Harper ~ 6th/7th Round

DT Brandon Williams ~ 3rd/4th Round

DF DeVonte Holloman ~ 4th/5th Round

MF Keith Pough ~ 6th/7th Round

SS Duke Williams ~ 5th/6th Round

FS Josh Evans ~ 4th/5th Round

Except for Barrett Jones & Christopher Harper, I believe that every single Prospect on that list commands tremendous Impact Potential as a top level Starter in the NFL ~ and Jones & Harper are the kind of guys who're virtually guaranteed to be Starters and savvy, steadying Rocks for a Decade or so.

Every Year, the Fears, Prejudices, and Foolishness of NFL Leadership render the Prospects of dozens upon dozens of highly talented & motivated Prospects virtually barren.

Most decision makers ~ it seems to me ~ get caught up in Statistics, Combine Numbers, and a misperceived notion of Pedigree, as well as their own lack of Vision, Judgment, and Testicular Fortitude.

That ~ and my belief that insufficient Depth of Talent has cost us Six SuperBowls ~ is why I am so maniacally aggressive in my Relentless Pursuit of Draft Picks.

~ I don't want Scrubs backing up our Starters and inevitably stepping in in the PlayOffs.

~ I want future Starters & Studs & All Pros doing so.

And because of the continuing foolishness of most GM's...it's quite possible to have that.

Every Year.

*************************************************

Wow. :eek:

That
turned into a much longer Answer than I'd planned. :eek:

That's what a night of good sleep'll do!! :D

Addendum > In Summary, I, personally, would've taken the Trade, but had Coach Bill taken the theoretically available Bjoern Werner at #29, as you've posited, I would've applauded the move!! :cool:
 
Can't believe the Bolts surrendered a 4th Rounder to move up from #45 to #38 and pick Teo. :eek:

Had I been contractually obligated to draft Teo in the 2nd, I would've surrendered a 4th Rounder to obviate that obligation.

The Dumb Get Dumberer. ;)
 
gotta go Markus Wheaton, Aaron Dobson, or Jamar Taylor here at 52.
 
My word.....after all these years of height/weight/speed/arm ratio for OLBs, how was there virtually no talk on Jamie Collins? We're all numb, I guess.
 
Eh.

Jamie Collins is a guy I like...

Jamie Collins

But in a 344 Defense.

He has no place in Coach Bill's recent 245/425 Hybrid. :confused:

So that makes the Pick interesting, in that it presumably casts light on Coach Bill's Intentions.

I don't like it, though. I would've preferred:

~ MF Arthur Brown

~ FL Quint Patton

~ TE Travis Kelce ~ though I think we can get'm much later

~ SS Dayario Swearinger

~ DT Brandon Williams ~ though I think we can get'm much later

~ FL Markus Wheaton

~ OC Brian Schwenke ~ though he'd be a much better Value much later

~ SE DaRick Rogers

~ FL Marquis Goodwin ~ though Later

~ DT Ben Logan ~ though likely available Later

....and a few other guys.

This Pick makes no sense to me.

Unless we're converting whole heartedly back to a 344, what the Hell do we do with Collins??

Bad Move, in my Book. :nono:
 
My word.....after all these years of height/weight/speed/arm ratio for OLBs, how was there virtually no talk on Jamie Collins? We're all numb, I guess.

:yeahthat:

After peeling myself off the ground, I remembered: 6'4" 250 with a 41.5" vertical! And can cover and tackle.

I think we all got a little over-focused on "need positions." As a result, on Twitter there are football reporters and draftniks nationwide gushing over the Pats' incredibly great pick, while all the Patriots fans have "WHO???" conniptions. :)
 


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