Cassel and the CBA

[ctpatsfan77]

Thank you very much Miguel. More questions and I am afraid....

#11 - What does play under the tender mean? I thought as soon as the franchise is signed the money is garaunteed, even if the player is cut or injured.
#14 - Can the franchise be rescinded at any time? making him an UFA?

IMO I would rather use the $14.6 M to sign a premium free agent (Suggs or Asomugha) and extend Wilfork because realistically a trade won't occur until draft day leaving the free agent cupboard bare. This approach would cost the Pats a couple of draft picks. I love the draft but it is a crap shoot at best.

"Play under the tender" = actually remain on the roster under the terms of the tender, rather than signing a new deal. [As long as the tender is signed before July 15, Cassel can renegotiate.] Also, it's guaranteed against comparative lack of skill, against football-related injury, and against cuts related to the salary cap. I'm not sure it's guaranteed against stupidity, however (see: Winslow II, Kellen).

Also, it can be rescinded as long as he hasn't already signed it.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Disagree - the hype machine has been rolling for a while now, and Cassel has played his part well and gotten himself out in the open. Teams know he's available as of tomorrow, yes, there is the wink wink tampering issues, but Cassel could be gone by February 27th, freeing the Pats up to do whatever they want in free agency.

The hype has moved to a point where we've seen the option of a team actually obtaining Cassel outright in exchange for 2 firsts brought and up and discussed. A trade for Cassel will happen as fast the Pats let it happen.

Has it been discussed on other teams' boards?

 

[BradyManny]

Has it been discussed on other teams' boards?

I don't know about fan bases, but somebody in the past few weeks linked to an article about why Cassel could yield 2 first round picks and also another article where I think someone in the Minnesota media suggested it, but I could be wrong about one or either of those...

 

[cstjohn17]

Disagree - the hype machine has been rolling for a while now, and Cassel has played his part well and gotten himself out in the open. Teams know he's available as of tomorrow, yes, there is the wink wink tampering issues, but Cassel could be gone by February 27th, freeing the Pats up to do whatever they want in free agency.

The hype has moved to a point where we've seen the option of a team actually obtaining Cassel outright in exchange for 2 firsts brought and up and discussed. A trade for Cassel will happen as fast the Pats let it happen.

As for extending Wilfork, they can have an agreement in place now and wait until the Cassel situation resolves itself.

That is a lot of double top secret wink wink nudge nudge... there is a market for Cassell but I doubt that there any teams that are lining up to fork over two 1st round picks the day that free agency starts (despite over 1,000,000 'confirmed' reports on internet message boards).

Looking closer at ths list of FA QBs, the best thing for the Pats would be for Warner to retire because it is super scrub city after him. Also Philly holding onto McNabb would help.

If this happens quickly I could see the Pats accepting a lower price, example two 2nd round picks on March 1 and 14.6 in cap space could be more valuable than a 1st and 2nd on April 27.

 

[Deus Irae]

That is a lot of double top secret wink wink nudge nudge... there is a market for Cassell but I doubt that there any teams that are lining up to fork over two 1st round picks the day that free agency starts (despite over 1,000,000 'confirmed' reports on internet message boards).

Looking closer at ths list of FA QBs, the best thing for the Pats would be for Warner to retire because it is super scrub city after him. Also Philly holding onto McNabb would help.

If this happens quickly I could see the Pats accepting a lower price, example two 2nd round picks on March 1 and 14.6 in cap space could be more valuable than a 1st and 2nd on April 27.

Warner has already said that it's the Cardinals or retirement, according to the NFL version of the National Enquirer:

ProFootballTalk.com - WARNER CONFIRMS THAT IT’S CARDINALS OR NO ONE IN 2009

 

[mgteich]

Given this year's QB market, is Cassel worth the 11th pick or so in this year's draft? To put it another way, if you were Minny or Carolina or Tennessee or Chicago and could trade up to #11 and get a QB who has proven himself over a full season, and has four years of training by the patriots, would you trade up to #11?

Well, that's about all the value these teams need to give for Cassel. Minny's 22 this year and their pick from next year is worth about an 11. And, would you rather have Cassel or one of the top QB's in this year's draft? That may be Minny's choice: give two firsts for one of the QB's in the draft or for Cassel.

 

[AzPatsFan]

How would the negotiations work?

"Hey, Matt, we just franchised you and you will earn $14.4 million dollars this year and next year you'll be a free agent and can get a $20 mil signing bonus. But check this out, instead of making $14 mil this year, we will pay you $8 mil. Plus, you won't be a free agent next year, either. Instead of the $20 mil you could get on the open market next year, we'll pay you $12 mil. Whaddaya say?"

That is not the choice he has, or would have... He is bound ot the Patriots if there is no CBA for the next two seasons.

If he wants to get traded, it helps to have a trade-able contract for the new team. Otherwise the new team might not have CAP room, or would stop because of the uncertainty.

 

[ayjackson]

Technically there will be no action before Feb 27 and the start of Free Agency, tampering rules you know.

Well would it be tampering if he's franchised (non-exclusive)? It permits negotiations with other teams. I know he can sign or be traded until the 27th, but the franchise tender permits discussion with other teams, no????

 

[PatsFanInVa]

But did he ever return?
No he never returned
And his fate is still unlearned (Bull ****!)...

Oh sorry, that's Charlie on the MTA. My bad.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Well would it be tampering if he's franchised (non-exclusive)? It permits negotiations with other teams. I know he can sign or be traded until the 27th, but the franchise tender permits discussion with other teams, no????

Not before Feb 27th and the start of the Free Agency period - the owners give each other time to negotiate with their own Free Agents before the meat market starts. For example: Vince Wilfork is a Free Agent next year, if everyone follows the rules, NE gets first crack at re-signing him - if they feel it necessary, they are allowed a two week window to apply the Franchise Tag so they can extend the negotiations. The tampering rules are in place to punish, say, the Cleveland Browns if Eric Mangini were to try and horn in on the discussion early...not that he ever would.

 

[DCPatriot]

With apologies for asking what must have an obvious answer: if Cassell is traded, what is the impact on the Pats salary cap? (I keep reading different views on this and do not see a direct answer to Fencer's question in his earlier post in this thread.)

Thanks in advance.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

If Cassel signs the franchise tender, plays the 2009 season under the tag, and the 2010 season is uncapped, then Cassel would be an RFA in 2010.

Miguel,
I'm a little confused.
>>>7.) If Cassel is an RFA in 2010, the Patriots' tender offer has to be at least 110% of his 2009 salary. 110% of $14.651 million is $16,116,000.<<<
Some sites have listed the increase as 20% of the franchise tender from the previous year.

 

[patchick]

Not before Feb 27th and the start of the Free Agency period - the owners give each other time to negotiate with their own Free Agents before the meat market starts.

But the Patriots could choose to waive that restriction and permit specific teams to talk to Cassel, no? So that a deal could be in place simply awaiting signature on 2/27?

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Miguel,
I'm a little confused.
>>>7.) If Cassel is an RFA in 2010, the Patriots' tender offer has to be at least 110% of his 2009 salary. 110% of $14.651 million is $16,116,000.<<<
Some sites have listed the increase as 20% of the franchise tender from the previous year.

Two different things: to slap the franchise tag on him again would require 120% of the prior year's salary. To give him an RFA tender would require 110%.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

But the Patriots could choose to waive that restriction and permit specific teams to talk to Cassel, no? So that a deal could be in place simply awaiting signature on 2/27?

If I understand the rules correctly, as soon as the Patriots put the franchise tag on Cassel, he's free to negotiate with other teams until and unless he signs the tender.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

But the Patriots could choose to waive that restriction and permit specific teams to talk to Cassel, no? So that a deal could be in place simply awaiting signature on 2/27?

P'rhaps, all I know is the trading and free agency windows remain closed until the start of the new League season. It seems reasonable (and therefore unlikely) that teams are not allowed to approach another club's franchise prior to the new season.

 

[Metaphors]

P'rhaps, all I know is the trading and free agency windows remain closed until the start of the new League season. It seems reasonable (and therefore unlikely) that teams are not allowed to approach another club's franchise prior to the new season.

I believe you are correct that UFA, RFA, franchise and transition players are all under the rules regarding free agency, which doesn't begin until the termination of the existing player contract at the end of the league year (around March 1).

Of course that doesn't stop players from signing contracts 15 seconds into the free agency period.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

Two different things: to slap the franchise tag on him again would require 120% of the prior year's salary. To give him an RFA tender would require 110%.

So if they franchise him this year (2009), what would be his status next year, 2010? Is it the same if it's a capped or an uncapped year???

 

[ctpatsfan77]

So if they franchise him this year (2009), what would be his status next year, 2010? Is it the same if it's a capped or an uncapped year???

Since 2009 would be Cassel's fifth NFL season:
Capped year --> UFA
Uncapped year --> RFA

 

[Miguel]

With apologies for asking what must have an obvious answer: if Cassell is traded, what is the impact on the Pats salary cap? (I keep reading different views on this and do not see a direct answer to Fencer's question in his earlier post in this thread.)

If Cassel is traded, there will not be any dead money hit on the Patriots salary cap. His $14,651,000 comes off the books.