What is Seymour's future with the Pats?

[condon84]

The Patriots should cut Seymour IMO ... he's had a great career but he's a 2 down DE in our system. Kind of hard to cut a guy who was here for 3 rings but business is business. I'd rather see Jarvis Greene resigned for 3 years and use the savings elsewhere. Belichick will be grabbing a DT/DE type in one of the 1st 3 rounds this year IMO.

Cut him? Dude, why would you do that? If they want to get rid of him, they can certainly trade him and get something back. Seymour, although viewed skewedly by Pats fans to be a bum, is probably still considered by NFL personnel men as the best Pats defender. He just had one of his best seasons and appears to be healthy. Why would you just get rid of an asset like that?

 

[cartmen]

Big Sey is a beast and had a great year not a good one but a great one. He lead his team in sacks and was doubled the entire year even more so once ADT was IR'd. With Warren hurt and VW banged up he was trippled at times which is why towards the end you saw alot of Wright and Jarvis at that position. If you guys went back and actually watched those games there were two places no one ran up the middle and to the D's left. When TW was healthy the run D was stout when he went down it became a little dicey but only on his (Warren's) side. BB keeps him as long as he sees him staying his usual dominant self

 

[billdog3484]

i love seymour, but at 9M per year, that may be a little too much. that being said, hes a great player and cutting ties would probably cost us more than we can give up in terms of cap penalties

 

[Kontradiction]

I don't know, who said this and who agreed with him?





Junior GMs. lol

You should quote the rest of the post (or sentence for that matter)...

I pretty much agree with this (except for the 2 down part) if Seymour gets too expensive to keep at the end of 2009.

I have admitted to Seymour being great and an ancor to our defensive line. You're making it out as if I'm saying he sucks and should be cut. If his price tag is too much for us to bear, we should just cut Seymour loose and draft his replacement. It's what Belichick did with another former GREAT mainstay on our defense in Ty Law. It's happened before and it could happen again easily.

 

[RayClay]

You should quote the rest of the post (or sentence for that matter)...



I have admitted to Seymour being great and an ancor to our defensive line. You're making it out as if I'm saying he sucks and should be cut. If his price tag is too much for us to bear, we should just cut Seymour loose and draft his replacement. It's what Belichick did with another former GREAT mainstay on our defense in Ty Law. It's happened before and it could happen again easily.

Well, I don't pretend to have the player budget and priorities of management down. I'm sure i trust the Front office to decide how much they want to spend.

Despite not pretending to know their budget, I would guess an experienced all pro at the position they value most would be worth quite a bit. I also imagine seymour will be reasonable, though well paid, either way.

What's missing here, is act 2. Has anyone ready to cut him come up with a plan to replace him? The top player we've ever had at the position we value most (besides qb) and the front office is just going to roll the dice? Does that sound logical to anyone?

 

[RayClay]

You should quote the rest of the post (or sentence for that matter)...



I have admitted to Seymour being great and an ancor to our defensive line. You're making it out as if I'm saying he sucks and should be cut. If his price tag is too much for us to bear, we should just cut Seymour loose and draft his replacement. It's what Belichick did with another former GREAT mainstay on our defense in Ty Law. It's happened before and it could happen again easily.

You know, they made Ty Law a very good offer, a lot more money than he ended up with. and you're saying they waited til the fourth round for Samuel because they knew he'd replace Law? Of course, 6'6" 310 pound athletes are a little harder to find than defensive backs. Otherwise, yeah, no problem.

So we just draft an all pro and plug him in. Sure does sound easy. I was under the impression that it would be hard to find, draft and develop such a player.

 

[mgteich]

Some would cut him Seymour. Some think he is the best DE in football, and certainly our best DL. Some think he would hold out. Some think he will be a boy scout and play hard for his next contract, like a player playing the last year of his rookie contract.

I do believe that we make the decision on whether to extend him now. We also should make decisions regarding Green and Wright. Our draft need will depend on these decisions. The effect is not minor. The decisions could move a DL from a definite Day One possible pick to a need after the 3rd round. Personally, I wouldn't draft someone to play on the DL if I already had locked in Warren, Wilfork, Green, Wright and had Smith for a couple of years.

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I think that Seymour is our third best defensive lineman, and our fourth best defesnive player. That being said, I think he is certainly worth spending valuable future cap space to extend him for another four years. His 2009 cap cost won't be affected too much. We have Warrne and Mayo locked up. It is time to try to lock up Wilfork and Seymour, if we can.
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What I don't want to do is wait for Wilfok and Seymour to become free agents.

 

[slash83]

Some would cut him Seymour. Some think he is the best DE in football, and certainly our best DL. Some think he would hold out. Some think he will be a boy scout and play hard for his next contract, like a player playing the last year of his rookie contract.

I do believe that we make the decision on whether to extend him now. We also should make decisions regarding Green and Wright. Our draft need will depend on these decisions. The effect is not minor. The decisions could move a DL from a definite Day One possible pick to a need after the 3rd round. Personally, I wouldn't draft someone to play on the DL if I already had locked in Warren, Wilfork, Green, Wright and had Smith for a couple of years.

===========

I think that Seymour is our third best defensive lineman, and our fourth best defesnive player. That being said, I think he is certainly worth spending valuable future cap space to extend him for another four years. His 2009 cap cost won't be affected too much. We have Warrne and Mayo locked up. It is time to try to lock up Wilfork and Seymour, if we can.
============

What I don't want to do is wait for Wilfok and Seymour to become free agents.

I respect your opinion and think very highly of Warren but Id go with Seymour as our second best dlineman behing Wilfork.

 

[AzPatsFan]

This is exactly why we need an OLB. Seymour was better this year by far compared to years past. He had 8 sacks, as a DE in a 3-4. That tells me he was probably double teamed a lot, and I bet you anything if we had a good OLB to come off the edge we'd see him being even more effective. When you have 3 linemen in the 3-4 going against an OL, the LBs have to make a lot of plays. We don't have the play makes off the edge to do that.

I want Seymour to retire a Patriot, so long as he stays healthy. The problem is money. It's funny AZ brings up Pace, White, etc. Well during the salary cap I don't know too many of those guys who had line mates making big money too. Remember, Warren is decently paid, wilfork needs a new deal, and Seymour is Seymour. We can't lock up too much in any single position regardless of the importance of it. 2 huge deals and one decent sized one kills our chance for other FAs and depth.

Let me introduce you to one of the "Foundation Tackles" higher paid teamates.

On was called Deacon Jones, another was Rosey Grier, the last was Lamar Lundy. Collectively they earnd the sobriquet ..."Fearsome Foursome". Perhaps you might of even heard of Merlin Olsen's teamates?

 

[Kontradiction]

You know, they made Ty Law a very good offer, a lot more money than he ended up with. and you're saying they waited til the fourth round for Samuel because they knew he'd replace Law?

Nope, you said that. I never mentioned anything about Samuel, just used Ty Law as a point of reference.

Of course, 6'6" 310 pound athletes are a little harder to find than defensive backs. Otherwise, yeah, no problem.

So we just draft an all pro and plug him in. Sure does sound easy. I was under the impression that it would be hard to find, draft and develop such a player.

You must not trust our talent scouts that know every little detail about the draft that much. Again, I'm not saying to just cut Seymour. I'm saying that if gets too expensive that when the time comes we have problems fixing leaks in other positions, then he should be traded. If that situation were to ever come, I would have confidence in BB's or Pioli's (if he is still around) ability to draft or sign his replacement for cheaper.

 

[RayClay]

Nope, you said that. I never mentioned anything about Samuel, just used Ty Law as a point of reference.

If his price tag is too much for us to bear, we should just cut Seymour loose and draft his replacement. It's what Belichick did with another former GREAT mainstay on our defense in Ty Law.

Eugene Wilson then? Who did they draft to replace Ty Law?

You must not trust our talent scouts that know every little detail about the draft that much. Again, I'm not saying to just cut Seymour. I'm saying that if gets too expensive that when the time comes we have problems fixing leaks in other positions, then he should be traded. If that situation were to ever come, I would have confidence in BB's or Pioli's (if he is still around) ability to draft or sign his replacement for cheaper.

I'd love to talk to a talent scout and ask them the odds they can replace a Seymour. It's possible.

Does every team have a 3-4 defensive end with his skills and 5 straight pro bowls?

Where are we picking in the draft? Not #6 unless we made a hell of a trade.

I think you are seriously overrating what any scout is able to do. All the drafters can do is pick in their spot and hope for the best.

 

[Bostonian1962]

If his price tag is too much for us to bear, we should just cut Seymour loose and draft his replacement. It's what Belichick did with another former GREAT mainstay on our defense in Ty Law.

Eugene Wilson then? Who did they draft to replace Ty Law?






I'd love to talk to a talent scout and ask them the odds they can replace a Seymour. It's possible.

Does every team have a 3-4 defensive end with his skills and 5 straight pro bowls?

Where are we picking in the draft? Not #6 unless we made a hell of a trade.

I think you are seriously overrating what any scout is able to do. All the drafters can do is pick in their spot and hope for the best.

There are retired players that made 5 straight Pro Bowls, and I don't think we should be sigining them. In other words, he made the Pro Bowls in the past. In at least 3 of those seasons, he didn't play all 16 games. In one of them, he missed 4 games. Now, more recently, following the '07 and '08 seasons, he didn't make the Pro Bowl. His next contract should be for what he provides now, not how he played in 2002.

 

[RayClay]

There are retired players that made 5 straight Pro Bowls, and I don't think we should be sigining them.

Wow, what an intelligent statement.

Seymour is 29 years old.

 

[maverick4]

For the top dollar he makes, he is slightly overpaid because he gets injured way too frequently.

I would trade Seymour with 1 year left on his deal for a 2nd or hopefully 1st round pick, and take a young talented DE underclassman who declared early for the draft.

 

[RayClay]

For the top dollar he makes, he is slightly overpaid because he gets injured way too frequently.

I would trade Seymour with 1 year left on his deal for a 2nd or hopefully 1st round pick, and take a young talented DE underclassman who declared early for the draft.

Have you decided how much you are going to pay everyone yet?

 

[Kontradiction]

If his price tag is too much for us to bear, we should just cut Seymour loose and draft his replacement. It's what Belichick did with another former GREAT mainstay on our defense in Ty Law.

Eugene Wilson then? Who did they draft to replace Ty Law?

Again, the conversation is not about Ty Law. He was used as a point of reference. You do know what a point of reference is, don't you? But since you seem so stuck on it, Asante Samuel was drafted to take over Law's duties and, as they probably hoped, replace him. Samuel actually did that and it was a success. I'm not saying this is easy to do, but the coaching staff did it before. And whether or not it was in the first round does not matter. BB/Pioli have shown through the years that they are money after the third round.

I'd love to talk to a talent scout and ask them the odds they can replace a Seymour. It's possible.

Does every team have a 3-4 defensive end with his skills and 5 straight pro bowls?

Where are we picking in the draft? Not #6 unless we made a hell of a trade.

I think you are seriously overrating what any scout is able to do. All the drafters can do is pick in their spot and hope for the best.

You should have talked to the Dolphins drafters last year and asked them the odds that they could replace Taylor. Look, you're not going to fully replace a healthy Richard Seymour. The guy is a beast. So was Jason Taylor. Our division-mates did replace Taylor however, although the production was not completely matched, through Philip Merling. And guess what? Merling was not drafted in the first round. It's entirely possible that Seymour could be replaced through the draft (especially this one with the loads of underclassman talent that is coming out) and it's also possible we could find someone in free agency, if we had to, who would be willing to take less cash than Seymour would demand. Again, would his production be matched or bested? Who's to say? But I'd be willing to take that shot if he asked for too much. Besides I would rather have Big Vince anchoring that line in the middle than have an overpriced Seymour on the outside. Seymour was only able to do so much this year and in years past since 2005 because of Wilfork's presence in the middle. He is the MUST RESIGN guy. I love Seymour, but not for millions more than the front office is willing to pay.

 

[maverick4]

Since we are franchising Cassel, we need to free up some money across the roster. I'm guessing Harrison and Bruschi won't be back either.


Seymour cannot be replaced in one year talent-wise, but we can draft someone who can eventually fill his shoes.

Wilfork will be re-signed because it's even more impossible to find an elite NT.

 

[RayClay]

Again, the conversation is not about Ty Law. He was used as a point of reference. You do know what a point of reference is, don't you? But since you seem so stuck on it, Asante Samuel was drafted to take over Law's duties and, as they probably hoped, replace him. Samuel actually did that and it was a success. I'm not saying this is easy to do, but the coaching staff did it before. And whether or not it was in the first round does not matter. BB/Pioli have shown through the years that they are money after the third round.



You should have talked to the Dolphins drafters last year and asked them the odds that they could replace Taylor. Look, you're not going to fully replace a healthy Richard Seymour. The guy is a beast. So was Jason Taylor. Our division-mates did replace Taylor however, although the production was not completely matched, through Philip Merling. And guess what? Merling was not drafted in the first round. It's entirely possible that Seymour could be replaced through the draft (especially this one with the loads of underclassman talent that is coming out) and it's also possible we could find someone in free agency, if we had to, who would be willing to take less cash than Seymour would demand. Again, would his production be matched or bested? Who's to say? But I'd be willing to take that shot if he asked for too much. Besides I would rather have Big Vince anchoring that line in the middle than have an overpriced Seymour on the outside. Seymour was only able to do so much this year and in years past since 2005 because of Wilfork's presence in the middle. He is the MUST RESIGN guy. I love Seymour, but not for millions more than the front office is willing to pay.

Taylor is 34. The Dolphins were 1-15 and he was not happy there.

Good teams keep their best players if they can.

not for millions more than the front office is willing to pay.

?

Again, where do you guys get the information on what the front office is willing to pay?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

For the top dollar he makes, he is slightly overpaid because he gets injured way too frequently.

I would trade Seymour with 1 year left on his deal for a 2nd or hopefully 1st round pick, and take a young talented DE underclassman who declared early for the draft.

Look at the Reiss defensive snaps thread. Even missing a game or so, Sey took the most snaps of any DL, 50+ more than Wilfy and 200+ more than Warren the next highest 2. That speaks to his ability to play in different defensive situations and to his game day availability.

 

[scout]

I'm not sure Seymour is injured that much more then any DL. Seems like every teams best DL is out a decent amount of time during the season. Does anyone have some type of litmus test for this?