Another HUGE ref blunder: punter suffers broken jaw, may have broken neck

[Froob]

https://twitter.com/BenVolin/status/412987406900424704/photo/1

Apparently refs never decide a game. So we have to be content losing multiples downs a game due to holding or pass interference.

 

[Ring 6]

I include "looking in another direction" in being blindsided.

But he is not looking in the other direction, he is facing the blocker.
Are you really telling me a blocker is supposed to stop and check where the guy is looking before blocking him when he is headed DIRECTLY toward the runner?

Should the punter have had better awareness? Absolutely.

You cant blame that on the blocker.

But the hit simply was too high, the crown of the helmet makes contact with the punter's head/neck area.

At best its borderline.
I guarantee that would not be called 95% of the time. The best argument you can make is the very top of the helmet contacted the very bottom of the head.
How would you suggest he make that block? Remembering that his job is to block the man, not to make sure he doesn't get injured in the course of it.

THAT is how he got a broken jaw and cracked vertebrae. As I said before, the blocker knew he had the guy dead to rights and went overboard. It's easy to imagine him thinking in that split second, "He's not looking and I'm going to murder this guy" instead of just breaking down and delivering a solid shoulder block.

He clearly tried to block in the chest with his shoulder.

I remember a play from years back when Warren Sapp was blocking on an interception return for Tampa vs. Green Bay. Sapp got a head of steam and blindsided a Packer offensive lineman, dislocating his hip. Totally unnecessary. Yeah, the ol' "keep your head on a swivel" adage applies in these cases, but taking advantage of it -- especially at the pro level -- equates to injurious intent.

I don't know how you can think you know the intent of a guy making a block in a sport where you are trained your entire life to hit as hard as you can.

 

[dizi24]

To my eyes it looks pretty clearly like he led with the helmet.

It doesn't even really matter whether he led with the helmet. If he hit him above the head, it's almost always an illegal hit. The rule covers the helmet, shoulders, forearms, and hands.

The whole "helmet to helmet" thing has become the most overused phrase in football. I don't think there is anywhere in the rulebook where its illegal to hit "helmet to helmet," but it's legal to hit them in the helmet with other body parts. Essentially, the rule prevents blows to the head, not just helmets to helmets.

 

[Ring 6]

Attached is the moment of impact.

The steelers player is wearing black and yellow, the bengals punter is orange and white.

You see how the steelers player has his head down thats called leading with the helmet.

Ok do you see how the steelers players helmet makes direct contact with the face/chin of the bengals player? Thats called hitting someone in the head.

You see how he is movinghis head to the side and delievering the blow with his shoulder? That is NOT leading with the head.
Here is a hint. The head always arrives before the shoulder.

 

[dizi24]

But he is not looking in the other direction, he is facing the blocker.
Are you really telling me a blocker is supposed to stop and check where the guy is looking before blocking him when he is headed DIRECTLY toward the runner?


You cant blame that on the blocker.


At best its borderline.
I guarantee that would not be called 95% of the time. The best argument you can make is the very top of the helmet contacted the very bottom of the head.
How would you suggest he make that block? Remembering that his job is to block the man, not to make sure he doesn't get injured in the course of it.



He clearly tried to block in the chest with his shoulder.


I don't know how you can think you know the intent of a guy making a block in a sport where you are trained your entire life to hit as hard as you can.

1. I don't know why you think intent matters.

2. This isn't a WR going to the ground and a DB hitting him high because the WR went low at the last second. The punter was barely moving. 57 lined him up and hit him straight in neck/helmet.

3. What else was he supposed to do? Maybe just extend the arms and knock him over (seeing as he probably had 100 pounds on him and was moving at a high speed). Or he could have just led with his shoulder into either his legs or his midsection. Again, the punter was barely moving, so any of these options were possible. Instead he lined up his helmet.

4. This doesn't make it illegal, but let's be honest, the punter is 150 pounds soaking wet getting blocked by a 250 lbs linebacker. There's no need to lay the punter out. Of course it would be legal, but it's still dirty. You can't watch that play and be left with any realization other than that the LB was trying to really injure him. If you want to drill a WR, TE or RB going over the middle, that's fine, it's clearly a part of the game. A punter who has no chance of making a play? Come on.

The dude is high to have high mouth wired shut and won't be able to talk for several months, has a severed vertabre that may permanently impact his life and career, and a couple inches higher, and he may never walk again. For what purpose? It was illegal, and dirty. It's just sad you're sticking up for him.

 

[dizi24]

You see how he is movinghis head to the side and delievering the blow with his shoulder? That is NOT leading with the head.
Here is a hint. The head always arrives before the shoulder.

Who cares whether it was the shoulder or the helmet? It's still illegal, and still dirty.

 

[groganbootleg]

The jaw could have been broken when he hit the ground. I don't know for sure that the force of the hit could not have cause it either even if it was direct.
I'm not a doctor. I'm just commenting on what I see. Last I checked its not a crime to have an opinion even if the majority doesnt agree.

You're entitled to your own opinions, but not your own facts.

You see how he is movinghis head to the side and delievering the blow with his shoulder? That is NOT leading with the head.
Here is a hint. The head always arrives before the shoulder.

Interesting that you didn't keep the pic in that since it shows that the helmet was making contact with the jaw BEFORE the shoulder pads hit anything.

 

[PatriotReign]

Apparently refs never decide a game. So we have to be content losing multiples downs a game due to holding or pass interference.

It's gotten so bad I'm wondering if the replacement officials have returned.

 

[chasa]

annnnd ignored, You show him an image of the helmet hitting the head of the punter and he says nope thats the shoulder to shoulder

 

[Observer]

You see how he is movinghis head to the side and delievering the blow with his shoulder? That is NOT leading with the head.
Here is a hint. The head always arrives before the shoulder.

I only see him lining his head up to hit squarely in the neck. Dude, it is okay to be wrong, it's only an internet forum.

 

[Ring 6]

I only see him lining his head up to hit squarely in the neck. Dude, it is okay to be wrong, it's only an internet forum.

Do you really think that a player making a block aims the tip of his helmet at the neck, or would you suspect when the shoulder strikes the middle of the chest making a tremendous block that was where he aimed?

Its not a matter of right or wrong. I am stating my opinion and what I see. No one has to agree. No one has showm me reason to change my mind either.

 

[Ring 6]

1. I don't know why you think intent matters.

Because the other poster I was replying to cited intent.

2. This isn't a WR going to the ground and a DB hitting him high because the WR went low at the last second. The punter was barely moving. 57 lined him up and hit him straight in neck/helmet.

He is runnng directly toward the ball carrier. Do you dispute he is attempting to get involved in trying to tackle the returner?

3. What else was he supposed to do? Maybe just extend the arms and knock him over (seeing as he probably had 100 pounds on him and was moving at a high speed). Or he could have just led with his shoulder into either his legs or his midsection. Again, the punter was barely moving, so any of these options were possible. Instead he lined up his helmet.

This is my real dispute.
His job is to block the man. Football players are taught the best block is one that hits the man as hard as you can and knocks him to the ground.

4. This doesn't make it illegal, but let's be honest, the punter is 150 pounds soaking wet getting blocked by a 250 lbs linebacker. There's no need to lay the punter out. Of course it would be legal, but it's still dirty. You can't watch that play and be left with any realization other than that the LB was trying to really injure him. If you want to drill a WR, TE or RB going over the middle, that's fine, it's clearly a part of the game. A punter who has no chance of making a play? Come on.

This again, is where I disagree.
They are playing a competitive football game. 57s job is to block for the returnman. He should never stop and ask himself whether the man running toward the ball carrier is too feeble or fragile to hit. He shouldn't even know its the punter, just a guy in the other jersey.

The dude is high to have high mouth wired shut and won't be able to talk for several months, has a severed vertabre that may permanently impact his life and career, and a couple inches higher, and he may never walk again. For what purpose? It was illegal, and dirty. It's just sad you're sticking up for him.

I think he did was he was taught to do. The injury is an unfortunate result. My assessment of the legality of the hit is not incosideration for the injured player.

 

[Kontradiction]

I only see him lining his head up to hit squarely in the neck. Dude, it is okay to be wrong, it's only an internet forum.

You see that because that's what's happening in that pic. Never, ever, ever, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER does a blocker get taught to lower his helmet before making a block. That is a cardinal sin of blocking. You keep your head up and to the side and make contact with the shoulder. His head is straight, down, and with the crown pointing up at the punter's helmet. This was a premeditated shot and it's most certainly not a clean hit.

My advice to you would be to put the guy you're arguing with on ignore. Andy has never been wrong in his life.

 

[Ring 6]

You're entitled to your own opinions, but not your own facts.

I have given my opinions. What 'fact' do you think is mine alone?

Interesting that you didn't keep the pic in that since it shows that the helmet was making contact with the jaw BEFORE the shoulder pads hit anything.

Not sure why you find that interesting. I actually don't think there was one in there because I didn't delete anythng, just quoted the post.

Why are you looking for some conspiracy theory here?
I see what I see. Its really OK if we disagree, you don't have to try to make some crazy accusation like I have some kind of agenda and I'm hiding things to cover it up.
Geez, this board goes whacko sometimes.

 

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

Do you really think that a player making a block aims the tip of his helmet at the neck, or would you suspect when the shoulder strikes the middle of the chest making a tremendous block that was where he aimed?

Its not a matter of right or wrong. I am stating my opinion and what I see. No one has to agree. No one has showm me reason to change my mind either.

I certainly wouldn't expect that to be what a player would do, however I've seen video and images showing the player in question doing exactly that. I also wouldn't expect someone when presented with irrefutable evidence of what happened to deny it, but here we are...

 

[Ring 6]

You see that because that's what's happening in that pic. Never, ever, ever, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER, EVER does a blocker get taught to lower his helmet before making a block. That is a cardinal sin of blocking. You keep your head up and to the side and make contact with the shoulder. His head is straight, down, and with the crown pointing up at the punter's helmet. This was a premeditated shot and it's most certainly not a clean hit.

Why would he put his head DOWN to make a high hit?
Every player is taught to never put their head down, and every player always does it. That is why so much practice is spent on it because its unnatural to keep your head up.
Your argument is like saying droping a pass is intnetional because no one is even taught to not catch the ball.

My advice to you would be to put the guy you're arguing with on ignore. Andy has never been wrong in his life.

Been wrong many times, just not the ones you thought I was. That was you being wrong.

 

[Ring 6]

I certainly wouldn't expect that to be what a player would do, however I've seen video and images showing the player in question doing exactly that. I also wouldn't expect someone when presented with irrefutable evidence of what happened to deny it, but here we are...

Are you disputing that when he approached the defender (punter) he attempted to block him with a shoulder to the chest?

 

[Ring 6]

I certainly wouldn't expect that to be what a player would do, however I've seen video and images showing the player in question doing exactly that. I also wouldn't expect someone when presented with irrefutable evidence of what happened to deny it, but here we are...

My point is if the helmet contacted the jaw, that was incidental to the block with the shoulder.
I don't see how you can look at that and see anything other than an attempt to make a block. If you see helmet to jaw contact, you can't really think that was the aim from looking at the play as a whole.

 

[groganbootleg]

I have given my opinions. What 'fact' do you think is mine alone?

Fact: The Steelers player's helmet hit the chin of the Bengals punter.

You claim it didn't happen and his broken jaw is the result of some freak accident when he hit the ground (which would make it the first documented case ever of someone's jaw breaking when the back of his head hit the ground). The case you are making is absurd and if I didn't know better I would accuse you of trolling this thread.

 

[Tunescribe]

Why would he put his head DOWN to make a high hit?

You can lead with the crown of the helmet on a high hit. This happens all the time.