Reactions to “The Dynasty”

TB12TheGoat said:

the fact there are still Pats fans who defend Belichick’s decision to bench Butler is ****ing insane. a few have even said Butler wouldn’t have helped make the 1 stop the team needed LMAO. there are probably at least 2 or 3 3rd and 4th downs you can go back to and see where Butler would have helped the defense make a stop. I refuse to ever watch that ******** game again but I do remember one play that Butler damn well would have made. I think it was Bademosi whiffing on a 3rd down tackle that would have left PHI with like 4th and 5 or something deep in their own territory. instead, he whiffs on Agholor who gets the 1st and PHI scores a TD on that drive. a tackle Butler would have no doubt made

that ******** by Belichick cost the team a ring. Brady and the rest of that 2017 team knows it. Kraft knows it

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Bingo times Infinity. That’s the EXACT SAME play I recall too.

condon84 said:

Wait so this doc was funded by the Kraft's hahahaha

This dude is such a a child.

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You get me talking for 5-6 hours, and by the end you'll be able to splice together footage of me bad talking my mother. It doesn't mean I hate her.

I've always appreciated Kraft, and what he did for the area keeping the team around, but this is petty... small.

signbabybrady said:

I don't think very many people debate that Butler would have had an impact. It comes down to who you hold responsible.

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There is one - and ONLY ONE - person responsible.

BennyBledsoe said:

But then that's what it is. A story. It's not proof one way or another. I would rate it as highly dubious as a source. If you're just looking for entertainment, sure. But, evidence? Proof? Look elsewhere.

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Huh? He used the interviews to tell the story from the people in the building, while adding news stories of the times to put it into context, along with some great film of the practices and games.

Boomer B said:

I was obviously generalizing when I wrote he’s an *******, but that is actually what Edelman called him also.

He is an *******, but there’s a lot more to him than that. He’s a brilliant football mind, he helped build a winning culture, he was a great leader of the team for many years, he was a tireless worker, etc…

So yes, even though he was an *******, he helped a lot of these guys like Gronk or Edelman reach their full potential which they are grateful for.

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Anybody ever in charge is an *******. If you aren’t … you’re not in charge, WTF is wrong with this next generation. This generation has way too many feelings… how did men get so sensitive.

signbabybrady said:

They were after the same attention that the book got but they didn't even do that very well. It's your new bible enjoy it.

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I never read the book. I gather you did. Did you like it?

venecol said:

That's not accurate. It painted Bill positively for sticking with Brady over Drew. The 2008 season with Cassell (an entire episode) was glowing towards Bill. The 2018 SB made Bill look like a genius.

Kraft looked bad on the Bledsoe stuff. Looked like a ***** on the Putin stuff. Looked weak af on the ending.

The only one not looking bad was Brady, but even he looked a bit weak, on how he got abused by Bill.

Is it a surprise that Bill, the biggest ******* of the 3, came out looking worse? Especially with his demeanor. He made himself look guilty as sin. Terrible look.

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I'd say it did paint Belichick in a bad light based on how they handled the Hernandez and Trump storylines:

They tried to make it seem as if Belichick could have prevented the Hernandez thing which is messed up. Even then, Bill and the Pats did make an effort to relocate Hernandez to a new residence, which was conveniently left out of the Documentary.

And they only focused on Belichick for the trump saga - ignoring Kraft donating money to Trump (foundation or campaign - I forget which one). And not including Belichick's other politics - there's a reason why McCourty doesn't speak negatively of Belichick as a person - he knows Belichick's views and what he's done.

While apparently ignoring positive statements from McCourty and Harrison.

That's also not including enough of the story of spygate

I agree with you on 2008 and 2018. Saying it made Belichick look entirely bad is wrong.

Overall, as I said, Belichick was still going to always look like the bad guy - deservedly so - because he made a lot of bad decisions and a lot of them were ego-based. Anybody looking at the dynasty objectively without any strong bias would still come away with the correct conclusion that Belichick made an effort to alienate Brady and eventually push him away, and that it backfired. And ended the dynasty. (The footage showing how he treated Garopollo vs Brady was very telling.)

I just didn't like how the documentary slanted certain events when they didn't have to. The facts already speak for themselves. Skipping over things and removing certain things - It's a little scummy imo.

Just let it be that Belichick was a great defensive coordinator that bought into his own hype too much and could be a real d*ck - rather than it being that he was all that and also possibly a low character individual.

The reality is more what Ty Law said, when he was just your coach you loved the guy. The only time he was a pain in the ass, was at contract time when you went to negotiate with him.

There are a lot of players like Gronk who left with a bitter taste in their mouth, and it was almost always over money. Over time when the noise dies down and retirement is settling in, you look back and realize the best thing that ever happened to you was that one guy who pushed you to be the best and never lied to you.

upstater1 said:

…Slater put it best: it's a coaching decision and at the end of the day, we trust our coach.

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And they were Wrong to have done that.

upstater1 said:

If Belichick is soft on players, they don't win against Seattle or Atlanta, and we're not even discussing this.,

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This statement is so wrong, it’s not just Wrong it’s WRONG.

The results of 51 & 53 have NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with the abomination of 52.

TB12TheGoat said:

the fact there are still Pats fans who defend Belichick’s decision to bench Butler is ****ing insane. a few have even said Butler wouldn’t have helped make the 1 stop the team needed LMAO. there are probably at least 2 or 3 3rd and 4th downs you can go back to and see where Butler would have helped the defense make a stop. I refuse to ever watch that ******** game again but I do remember one play that Butler damn well would have made. I think it was Bademosi whiffing on a 3rd down tackle that would have left PHI with like 4th and 5 or something deep in their own territory. instead, he whiffs on Agholor who gets the 1st and PHI scores a TD on that drive. a tackle Butler would have no doubt made

that ******** by Belichick cost the team a ring. Brady and the rest of that 2017 team knows it. Kraft knows it

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Rumors were that he slept with someone he shouldn’t have. IF that is true .. IF … would that make a difference? IF Butler did something so egregious…disrespectful… would it make a difference?? Do you think that Bill .. who all these years put TEAM above all else .., benched Butler for no reason? He played Taylor during his crazy days …

captain stone said:

This statement is so wrong, it’s not just Wrong it’s WRONG.

The results of 51 & 53 have NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with the abomination of 52.

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What are you going on about?

Wait, 52... you're talking about Malcolm Butler?

Hey Zues! Good grief...

Man, venecol, you would be really easy to manipulate. "But that's what the interviews said!"

How do we know? WE ALREADY KNOW he manipulated TWO of the interviews in such a way as to upset those who agreed to those interviews. How can we be sure he didn't do it with anybody else's? How can we be sure his facts are presented in an accurate light based on his statements regarding Kraft?

This is base level propaganda tactics, venecol. Seriously, you need to educate yourself on how things can be slanted just with an edit, a piece of music, choice of words.

vicspats said:

Rumors were that he slept with someone he shouldn’t have. IF that is true .. IF … would that make a difference? IF Butler did something so egregious…disrespectful… would it make a difference?? Do you think that Bill .. who all these years put TEAM above all else .., benched Butler for no reason? He played Taylor during his crazy days …

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Actually, that would make it worse. Bill isn't one to be judging who players sleep with given his own adulterous past.

venecol said:

Actually, that would make it worse. Bill isn't one to be judging who players sleep with given his own adulterous past.

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Bill sleep with your partner?

venecol said:

It's simple, Grazer was after the truth behind the relationship between the 3 main characters in the story. He described it as a story about the arch in the relationship between the 3 main players. That's the story he wanted to tell; that despite all the conflicts between them, they still managed to pull off the greatest dynasty in sports history.

Of course he leaned towards the dramatic. This was never going to be a Patriots rah rah super team doc. There's plenty of those already. He went after the human side of the story. That's what sells. Every good story has a villain.

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IF Grazer was after the WHOLE truth, he failed miserably. But I don't think that was the aim of this -- it couldn't have been, the way things were set up. Belichick's side of the story has yet to be told. Hopefully it will down the road sometime after he and Brady (and perhaps Kraft) are in the Hall of Fame.

upstater1 said:

If Belichick is soft on players, they don't win against Seattle or Atlanta, and we're not even discussing this.,

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Prior to that season, they were going on a 10 drought losing 2 straight Super Bowls, 2 straight back to back AFCCG's in a row (3 total) and 8-7 in the playoffs. They were on edge in that game against the Seahawks and Brady looked like he was going to faint had the Seahawks scored the game winning TD. Needed a miracle from an undrafted rookie CB executing his assignment when he got beat more often than not during practice on that specific play.

Butler's INT was the most important play of the 2nd Dynasty. Had they lost like that again, there probably would've been major finger pointing and Bill would've wanted to move Tom (play Jimmy) and Tom would've wanted Bill gone. They were too good to have that drought continue on like that.

Sam Bam Cunningham said:

Do you believe he has “absolutely no idea”?
Not believable in my opinion

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I stated a fact - - that's what Butler said in the documentary. That's an obective fact that he said it.

You stated your personal subjective opinion.

It is what it is.

But, go ahead, keep believing the guy who flat out lied to the interviewer right there on the screen - per Glasper today in the Globe:

Belichick: “Matt, we’ve talked about that.”
Hamachek: “I didn’t ask you about it.”
Belichick then delivers his patented silent icy glare into the camera."

We all choose whom we want to believe. Those that still eat up what Belichick says in public about SB 52 obviously have chosen poorly.

His decision was in no way "What was best for the team". It was a personal temper tantrum. He drove the school bus into the lake.

.

Tunescribe said:

IF Grazer was after the WHOLE truth, he failed miserably. But I don't think that was the aim of this -- it couldn't have been, the way things were set up. Belichick's side of the story has yet to be told. Hopefully it will down the road sometime after he and Brady (and perhaps Kraft) are in the Hall of Fame.

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Here is a great take by a poster on the other Pat's forum, I thought it brilliantly answered questions about the filmmaker's potential motive and credibility.

"Somehow this rumor is out there that the Krafts made this series. Seemingly, it all started because people jumped to conclusions over the final credits. This explanation right here makes perfect sense. I haven't watched the series yet and now don't know if I will. Just too many people talking about the negative slant. Do I believe RK is behind the portrayal of BB? No. Not sure why anyone wouldn't first suspect that maybe Jeff Benedict simply didn't like BB. Look at all of the difference of opinions we have. I don't need to find a conspiracy to explain this. In fact, I could explain his anti-BB bias with the mere fact that BB was friends with Trump and Jeff Benedict is very political and a Democrat. He tried to run for congress and fought against Trump on some casino projects. I guess one of the episodes actually goes into BB's letter to Trump. He made a big deal of it. So IMHO, the anti BB slant probably has more to do with Benedict having TDS than it does any influence from RK. I'm surprised nobody is thinking of this angle." - carawaydj

shmessy said:

Belichick: “Matt, we’ve talked about that.”
Hamachek: “I didn’t ask you about it.”
Belichick then delivers his patented silent icy glare into the camera."

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That was the funniest thing in the series. Unintentional comic gold.