Welcome to PatsFans.com

Wilfork vs. Nalen

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by coltsfan, Jan 9, 2006.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. coltsfan

    coltsfan Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2005
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    As a neutral observer, I see this as the key matchup to the game. The most important player on the Broncos' running game against the most important player of the Pats' run defense. If the Pats can stop the Broncos running game and not have to overly commit to stopping it, they will likely win the game. Shanahan has basically tried to handcuff Plummer with his playcalling this year, so I don't see him being able to win the game without a strong running game.

    I am making this post because I'd like to see the breakdown of this matchup from the first time you guys played, and also get some insightful opinions of the matchup. I have been impressed with the breakdown Bocks O'Rocks (sp?) does of the Pats games.

    It should be a great matchup. The Pats' front seven has been dominant for the last few games, but this is definitely the best O-line they have faced. Thoughts?
  2. Brownfan80

    Brownfan80 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,305
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    The thing that the original breakdown won't show is that Wilfork was getting destroyed through the first 6-8 weeks and has played like another man for the final 8 weeks. Wilforks quality of play has easily doubled over the final stretch and the results of the original matchup may be much different this time around.

    Wilfork was routinely getting single blocked out of plays in the first half, in the second half he's commanding double teams and still making plays. His improvement, coupled with the return of Kevin Faulk, Corey Dillon and Patrick Pass will certainly go a long way to telling the difference in this game. Add in Tedy Bruschi, Ellis Hobbs, Artrell Hawkins and Richard Seymour and you've got the other side to the story. We'll see what happens. Our team is a much different squad than the one Denver beat down in October.
  3. LA Pats Fan

    LA Pats Fan Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    131
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    Minus Seymour

    Wilforks play probably reflect more on Seymour being injured than anything else. If you look at the Pats first game against Denver both Seymor and Bruschi were not present. Both are huge in the run defense...
  4. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2004
    Messages:
    5,750
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +14 / 2 / -0

    #12 Jersey

    The key is the Pats LBs. They can not over run plays and give the Bronco backs cut back lanes. The Broncos OL is the dirtiest in football and it is important that the Pats DL are aware of the low blocks.
  5. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,562
    Likes Received:
    183
    Ratings:
    +436 / 10 / -11

    #24 Jersey

    And therein lies the reason we HAVE TO have Bruschi for this game. Maybe Beisel is doing better now but we can't risk our season on him and his picking the wrong hole like he did last time against Denver, including on one TD. Bruschi and Vrabel will be tough up the middle.
  6. ilduce06410

    ilduce06410 Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2005
    Messages:
    916
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    "neutral observer"?

    wow you dolts fans certainly run the spectrum of neuroses.

    i agree with your comment, tho. for those of us who like to watch OL/DL action, this will be fun. in any 3-4 defense, the performance of the ILBs is dependent on the NT's consistency in tying up two OLs. wilfork has really come on, perhaps right on schedule for a NT, in the past 8-9 games.
    nalen is one of those quick centers who's also muscled up enough to lay a lick on NTs. he's a BC guy, and is one of the more dirty players in the nfl. remember bryan cox?
    watch your knees, vince. watch his knees, richard and ty.
  7. LiquidBlue

    LiquidBlue Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    We spread the field and kill you with the run. Sorry but thats how it is. Then establish the play action and it's over.
  8. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,562
    Likes Received:
    183
    Ratings:
    +436 / 10 / -11

    #24 Jersey

    With that monsterous 3.9 YPC since Week 9 ? In that same time the Patriots have allowed 2.9 YPC.

    You do the math.
  9. LiquidBlue

    LiquidBlue Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Stats mean nothing.
  10. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    31,562
    Likes Received:
    183
    Ratings:
    +436 / 10 / -11

    #24 Jersey

    When it's 3rd and 8 after two 1 yard runs, they might mean something.
  11. LiquidBlue

    LiquidBlue Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2006
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    We have a big play guy, Tatum Bell and we have a long yardage receiver, Ashley Lelie.
  12. 24champbailey

    24champbailey Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2006
    Messages:
    23
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    does this stat include when you play the jets twice? They have a great running game! :singing:
  13. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2005
    Messages:
    20,550
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +25 / 0 / -0

    Because the meanest of my sisters is bullying the State of Indiana, I will take pity on you - plus I'm a pushover for a silver tongued devil, even in blue and white!

    http://www.targetsoft.com/patriots/denver.htm

    As has been noted, Vince really stepped up his game in the last six games and you could see the light bulb flickering on in that horrid Monday night game mid-season. I'd say he's 100% improved from what you read here and getting better. Enjoy!
  14. shakadave

    shakadave Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2005
    Messages:
    2,232
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    Make sure your profile on this forum is set up to show signatures, and read mine! It refers to a game almost exactly one year ago.
  15. Bronco Freak

    Bronco Freak Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2006
    Messages:
    265
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    One word to describe this matchup...

    MISMATCH

    Especially in the 4th quarter, that is when TATUM BELL busts his big runs. The Pats are gonna be worn down.

    That extra week off will come into play in so many ways, gameplanning, stamina, home field etc...

    Brady is a great QB, but all good things come to an end. And face it, the Pats can't beat us with Danny Kannell selling insurance...
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2006
  16. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2005
    Messages:
    20,550
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +25 / 0 / -0

    I agree mismatch.....;)
  17. coltsfan

    coltsfan Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2005
    Messages:
    365
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Thanks for the link, that's just what I was looking for!

    I'm surprised you say that about the Monday Night game(I'm assuming you're talking about the Colts game. :D ) He made a great play shooting the gap on the Colts' first play, but I don't remember him doing much besides that. I thought Saturday handled him fairly well, which was the reason the Colts were able to run the ball well in short yardage.

    Wilfork does seem to be playing better now. What do you attribute that to? Is it possible that he maybe got into better shape as the season went on? One thing not helping his cause is the Pats don't have a backup nose tackle to give him a rest.
  18. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2005
    Messages:
    20,550
    Likes Received:
    25
    Ratings:
    +25 / 0 / -0

    There are a number of things contributing to his improvement, I'll note them in a sec...Vince's play against the Colts was poor, but when you've been watching him for seven games at that point in the season, you could see little things that spoke to his understanding of what he should be doing.

    It's the instructor in me, 'he stinks' doesn't mean hopeless, you drill them on fundamentals until it becomes second nature and you put them in situations where they are forced to think, or show themselves to be complete morons. Once you have them demonstrating the fundamentals in their responses, you just sit and wait, they get smoother, quicker to react with the right combination, and slowly they start recognizing things faster and faster and faster until they start to see each choreographed step six steps ahead of the action. Feeling smug, you then sign on as a consultant for Bud Light commercials. :D

    Okay, what he is doing now:

    All of the DLs are now playing further back off the line of scrimmage. Vince is back the farthest, usually 3-4 feet off the ball - he used to be curled up almost over the ball. This step back forces the Center to take a step to reach him, which allows Vince to get his hands up. This also means the Guard double-teaming him needs to take two steps to get into him, giving Vince time to read and set himself for the contact. Third, he gets a better view of the backfield, not the same one the ILBs 5 yds behind him have, but one with a wider scope then Saturday's mouth guard - truly disgusting, yech!

    He may have played himself into better shape, can't say for sure.

    Finally, Vince is a second year man, he's been learning how to be a two-gap defensive lineman. You can see him pushing less to chase the RB, and working more to mind HIS resposibilities which include both 'a' gaps and sucking up as many blockers as he can.

    He's still vulnerable to a cut block and Nalen belly flopped him several times in week six. I expect him to be significantly stronger against the run in this game, and Nalen is going to have to break a sweat. :singing:
  19. bucky

    bucky Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    1,717
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    You're right. Vince is playing off the ball more and hopefully that will enable him to protect his feet better vs Nalen. Nalen is one of the best Cs in the NFL, particularly at sealing and blocking on the 2nd level. In the Broncos' scheme, all it takes to get through the front 7 is for 1 player to be out of position. Defending the stretch play is about 2 things - setting the edge at the point of attack, and pursuit down the line to catch the cut backs. I expect the Broncos to have some success running the ball because nobody can shut them down completely. Hopefully, the Pats can cut out the big plays, limit them to FGs in the red zone, and score enough TDs to force the Broncos to play catch up in the 4th quarter.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>