Tom Curran: Patriots used the Colts game to experiment with players

[Rob0729]

Saw a comment on another thread and it deserves repeating: if BB used yesterday as "experiment" day, why not experiment more with that failed experiment named Ocho? Why not give the Fresh Prince of Belaire, Underwood, more reps?

Ochocinco played in the no huddle offense for the first time all season yesterday. Underwood got the most reps he has gotten all season yesterday. So you have done a great job bringing up topics that support the theory that Belichick was doing some experimentation yesterday.

The fact of the matter is though, there is not a lot of need to experiment with the best passing offense in the league.

EDIT: According to Mike Reiss, Ochocinco played extensively in the first half and none in the second while Underwood played a lot in the second half and not the first. Much like the Pats would do with players in a preseason game.

 

[mgteich]

There are three positions where we have had injuries all year and are constantly dipping into our deep depth and bringing in folks from the streets. Those positions are safety, corner and linebacker. To me it is a good idea to give the bottom of the roster at these positions more reps because they might be needed.

Posters think that we have a problem with our passing game. Perhaps Belichick is less concerned.

Saw a comment on another thread and it deserves repeating: if BB used yesterday as "experiment" day, why not experiment more with that failed experiment named Ocho? Why not give the Fresh Prince of Belaire, Underwood, more reps?

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Through the 3rd qtr, BB (in some snaps) had Carter play, what I would describe, as 4th tech. Inside Shoulder of LT and outside shoulder of LG.

 

[Kontradiction]

In the first half of the game, the Colts had 1 long drive for a FG. I won't even discuss the goal line stand on that drive though that is what you want from this defense, however, the remaining possessions were all 3 and outs (-1, 8 and -3 yardage gained on 3 possessions for 4 yards in offense and a net total of 71 yards of total first half offense). Now take a look at that statistic for the entire half of one game then match it up with *the Colts moved the ball on us all day and we were lucky to not have a closer game earlier*. Do you believe what you stated matches up with the facts?

In the second half the Patriots took the opening KO and made the score 24 to 3. On the ensuing possession, the Colts gained 43 yards (reaching to approx. the Patriot 42 yard line) before the Patriot defense got a turnover. The Patriots then immediately marched down and made the score 31 - 3 with about 4 minutes to go in the third Quarter (everyone thinking the game is basically over at this point). At the end of the quarter, the Colts had moved the ball to about their own 40 having gained approx. 30 yards before the end of the 3rd quarter.
Total after 75% of the game, the Colts had reached the red zone once and additionally had crossed midfield once (reaching the Patriot 42 yard line). So again, 'the Colts moved the ball on us all day and we were lucky to not have a closer game earlier' seems incompatible with the facts.

Your argument is not as dead-on as you're presenting it. "All day" might have been a poor choice of words, which is what usually happens when you drink and post . But the Pats weren't shutting down the Colts nearly as much as you're trying to point out. The Colts were comfortably moving the ball in the third quarter (the one possession is our only sample) before Delone Carter coughed it up. In the fourth quarter, all hell broke loose. So, really, if we're looking at it, the Colts were able to move the ball in relative comfort against the Pats throughout half of the game. If the defense does that in the playoffs against a quality team and the offense has an off day, we're in trouble.

The Patriots looked horrible in the 4th quarter (both offense and defense). They made a very comfortable lead become less than comfortable with lackluster to poor play on both sides of the ball. However, a media pundit and some odd personnel choices points to BB doing some possible in game experimenting. Do you have anything whatsoever in terms of anecdotal evidence to suggest the Patriots were not doing what is suggested?

Thinking back on it now, this would seem to be a very, VERY odd choice for a coach who once, famously, said this: "Don't tell me about leads in this league".

 

[Kontradiction]

Also, some of you should probably realize that if Belichick indeed WAS experimenting with different guys at different positions, it's probably because he sees that the defense hasn't been playing very well over the course of the entire season and is trying to fix it as best as he possibly can.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Saw a comment on another thread and it deserves repeating: if BB used yesterday as "experiment" day, why not experiment more with that failed experiment named Ocho? Why not give the Fresh Prince of Belaire, Underwood, more reps?

Because he doesn't have the kind of issues or injuries on offense beyond the OL that he's had on defense across the board all season. And Ocho for one has already had more than enough opportunity snaps to make a case for what he is going forward...marginal insurance if someone gets injured. On defense he's playing guys who haven't had any opportunity, in some cases in their career, to show what they can and can't potentially do on defense in a pinch. Now he knows. And while the overall performance in the 4th quarter was underwhelming, there were positives to be taken from some of the individual performances. There aren't a lot of practice reps left for wholesale experimentation, or as much margin for error in games going forward given the playoff picture and the significance of seeding. Lack of talent and experience remains an issue on defense, not remotely the case on offense where focus and consistency remain the only nagging issues. Experimentation there isn't in his best interest. Tough enough week dealing with OL injuries and working in a backup RT and PS Center and a rookie RB while trying to maintain focus and intensity.

Bill works on situational stuff as much as he can in practice. I don't mind him working on as much as he can in games where the opportunity presents itself, and defending against the 0-16 Colts presented that opportunity game this season. No need for him to go hog wild. This isn't week 17 and we don't have a lock on seeding or even the division mathmatically at this point. And we may not until week 17 is in the books. I don't want him screwing with the offense because it still has focus based consistency issues it's dealing with even under optimum conditions.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Your argument is not as dead-on as you're presenting it. "All day" might have been a poor choice of words, which is what usually happens when you drink and post . But the Pats weren't shutting down the Colts nearly as much as you're trying to point out. The Colts were comfortably moving the ball in the third quarter (the one possession is our only sample) before Delone Carter coughed it up. In the fourth quarter, all hell broke loose. So, really, if we're looking at it, the Colts were able to move the ball in relative comfort against the Pats throughout half of the game. If the defense does that in the playoffs against a quality team and the offense has an off day, we're in trouble.



Thinking back on it now, this would seem to be a very, VERY odd choice for a coach who once, famously, said this: "Don't tell me about leads in this league".

For the record, Delone didn't simply cough it up... He had the ball knocked out by a very timely and stragegic hit. So don't make it sound like the Colts simply screwed up and put the ball on the ground like a typical screw up opponent with the lead so often does in JETS games... That was a forced fumble.

 

[Kontradiction]

For the record, Delone didn't simply cough it up... He had the ball knocked out by a very timely and stragegic hit. So don't make it sound like the Colts simply screwed up and put the ball on the ground like a typical screw up opponent with the lead so often does in JETS games... That was a forced fumble.

That ball didn't come out until his arm flew backwards and went over his head. I'll give the LB's credit for stripping away at the ball, though. The difference is that the ball didn't come out when they did that. The ball came out when he fell backwards hard and couldn't control his arm anymore.

 

[Rob0729]

Also, some of you should probably realize that if Belichick indeed WAS experimenting with different guys at different positions, it's probably because he sees that the defense hasn't been playing very well over the course of the entire season and is trying to fix it as best as he possibly can.

The defense has been playing fairly well of late. He is experimenting because he had the luxury to do so yesterday. He isn't satisfied with the defense, but no one can say that the defense wasn't improving even before the hit the skid of mediocre to horrible QBs.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Through the 3rd qtr, BB (in some snaps) had Carter play, what I would describe, as 4th tech. Inside Shoulder of LT and outside shoulder of LG.

He was doing a lot more experimentation than simply subbing for starters. But in the end that isn't what killed the defense late, it was simply letting down in the face of a 31 point deficit with ten minutes left to play and no idea the offense might have also let down...and the Colts players and coaches were playing for something more important to most players at the end of the day than a win...their jobs next season. And that was the double or triple for that matter whammy.

 

[Rob0729]

BTW, the Big Nickel made a return appearance yesterday for the first time since Tank Johnson was on the team. Tell me that the Pats weren't experimenting.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

For the record, Delone didn't simply cough it up... He had the ball knocked out by a very timely and stragegic hit. So don't make it sound like the Colts simply screwed up and put the ball on the ground like a typical screw up opponent with the lead so often does in JETS games... That was a forced fumble.

Jets - not one but TWO games now this season where the opposing kicker completely muffs the kickoff. You can't discount the Jets penchant for good fortune.

 

[Kontradiction]

The defense has been playing fairly well of late. He is experimenting because he had the luxury to do so yesterday. He isn't satisfied with the defense, but no one can say that the defense wasn't improving even before the hit the skid of mediocre to horrible QBs.

Again, "don't tell me about leads in this league". In practice, the defense gets work against an actual offense (our's, no less). That would have been the best chance to experiment with those guys. Not a regular season game. Further, isn't Belichick supposed to be the coach who specializes in putting his games in in-game situations in practice and in training camp? If his ability to do that is unquestionable, why make the decision to do it in a regular season game? Just doesn't make any sense to me.

In the end, though, we're 9-3 and are currently holding the #1 seed in the AFC.

 

[Rob0729]

Again, "don't tell me about leads in this league". In practice, the defense gets work against an actual offense (our's, no less). That would have been the best chance to experiment with those guys. Not a regular season game. Further, isn't Belichick supposed to be the coach who specializes in putting his games in in-game situations in practice and in training camp? If his ability to do that is unquestionable, why make the decision to do it in a regular season game? Just doesn't make any sense to me.

In the end, though, we're 9-3 and are currently holding the #1 seed in the AFC.

The Pats are only allowed 14 padded practices all season. You want to waste the less than one practice a week they get to play in pads in experimenting with Slater at safety or implementing the Big Nickel? You can't get a proper read on experimenting with these players and formations in shells.

Yesterday, the Pats had a game against a team that had packed it in and most people think they are trying to lose to get the first overall pick. This is a game where Belichick could afford to get some real game experimentation.

I can't see how people don't think it is a little fishy that we are seeing new formations we haven't seen all year, players who never played a position starting, and a lot of back ups on both side of the ball getting starts or significant amount of playing time. Especially since in recent weeks, the defense has been playing a lot better.

 

[Ivan]

Eh, let them jump.

Unfortunately they won't, although they would clearly be happier as jets fans.

I wish they would because i'm sick to death of the neverending whining and crying but instead they will just continue to b.tch and moan forever.

On the other hand when they win their next SB wee will all have the opportunity to tell them to shut up and drop dead if they even attempt to celebrate it.

 

[Ivan]

I'm going to convince myself that Curran's article is 100% spot on so the burning hatred I still feel toward the fourth quarter dwindles into my disdain for the Jets normality.

It didn't bother me in the least, in part because i didn't watch it. The game was over at 31-3, the rest was fluff.

 

[TruthSeeker]

UNFORTUNATELY THERE ARE STYLE POINTS......

BOTH RAVENS (+7) and SQUEELERS (+21) made up ground on the SOV tiebreaker on Pats last night. Houston maintained being IN FRONT OF PATS on SOV tiebreaker.

We dont have enough common games and everybody who can tie with Pats is going to have the same # of AFC wins. SOV is going to be the dealbreaker (except for a 2-way H-H w/ Pitt).

It's been mentioned before but clearly needs repeating. Strength of victory is not related to points scored; it's related to the number of wins. Here's the definition:

A part of the NFL's tiebreaking proceedure, strength of victory is figured by calculating the combined winning percentage of the opponents a team has beaten.

About Football Glossary - Strength of Victory

 

[Garbanza]

It appears that the koolaide has moonshine in it these days.

The pass defense is what it is...not very good. "Experimenting" to see if Slater is better than an actual DB? Maybe, or maybe it's a desperate attempt to wake personnel up? Give Ochostinko more real game opps? He sure took advantage! (eyeroll).

There may be some truth to the "experiment" theory....but it's not the whole story. I just can't see why he was so pissed off if he was just "experimenting."

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

It appears that the koolaide has moonshine in it these days.

The pass defense is what it is...not very good. "Experimenting" to see if Slater is better than an actual DB? Maybe, or maybe it's a desperate attempt to wake personnel up? Give Ochostinko more real game opps? He sure took advantage! (eyeroll).

There may be some truth to the "experiment" theory....but it's not the whole story. I just can't see why he was so pissed off if he was just "experimenting."

Classic

My god.

Maybe he was like mad because like it wasn't particurly good.

In the other segment of the population where the IQ is north of zero, the following is obvious:

The roster has been in shuffle mode.

Shuffling is done usually for a purpose

If you have new shufflees, you want to see if the shuffling works.

If it doesn't that tends to be bad so most head coaches in the NFL don't like failure.....at anything.

 

[Patspsycho]

Again, "don't tell me about leads in this league". In practice, the defense gets work against an actual offense (our's, no less). That would have been the best chance to experiment with those guys. Not a regular season game. Further, isn't Belichick supposed to be the coach who specializes in putting his games in in-game situations in practice and in training camp? If his ability to do that is unquestionable, why make the decision to do it in a regular season game? Just doesn't make any sense to me.

In the end, though, we're 9-3 and are currently holding the #1 seed in the AFC.

As BB himself says, there's nothing like actual game reps. No amount of practice is going to duplicate that.