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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by aluminum seats, Sep 20, 2010.

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  1. aluminum seats

    aluminum seats In the Starting Line-Up

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    In the sense that sports is never a smooth, straight line, and considering the Pats historically get better over the course of a season, maybe it’s better to lose now. Never feels that way when it’s happening, but you take your lumps and, hopefully, learn and improve.

    Another loss on the road. Will continue to be brought up until they get some wins.

    And another terrible second half, after last season’s endless string of them. We can’t praise coaching and then not call it out, and strong first halves/weak second halves seems like coaching, to me. Seems that Bill CAN do it all over the course of the week, but in-game stuff is when you need outside/additional brain power. Is it just not there, or afraid to speak up, or is it ignored?

    A question that wiser folks than me can maybe help with:

    Please explain to me how the Pats get shutout in the second half. Revis is out, and they don’t score? Seemed that Brady was forcing it to Moss on more than one occasion. You’ve got Welker, the TEs, Faulk, and on and on, and he’s throwing to a blanketed Moss. Was no one else open?

    And another:

    I’m sorry, but do the Pats actually have linebackers? I don’t recall a linebacker’s name being said, ever. The D line seemed to play well (maybe this is the better Warren), but the LBs made no plays. The Pats were able to win Super Bowls w/Troy Brown and Earth Wind & Fire (or whatever his name was) because the LBs were flying around making plays.

    Last, trivial, I know, shouldn’t even mention it, he’s allowed to be friends w/whoever. But the shot of Brady sitting glumly next to Moss is one I saw way too many times last year. Seeing it yesterday, I realized I would rather not see it again.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2010
  2. World Champs 3X

    World Champs 3X Practice Squad Player

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    Observations from the game

    Moss has lost a step and can’t get by defenders
    We have no running game hit and will not have one until we get a good running back and Taylor is not a good running back
    and we still can't get any pressure on the QB
    It’s going to be a long season, doubt we make the playoffs.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2010
  3. Bobs My Uncle

    Bobs My Uncle PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Our defense is young, inexperienced and will suffer growing pains, especially without a consistent and steady pass rush and with Butler manning one of the starting CB spots. But this was to be expected.

    On offense, whoever is responsible for calling plays isn't very good at his job. No way an offense that features two of the best players ever at QB and WR, along with the games best, current, slot receiver, not to mention the games best 3rd down back, a seasoned OL, very good TE's, and deep and talented #3 and #4 receivers, should get shut out in a half of football. This was not expected.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2010
  4. The_Riddler

    The_Riddler 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    We drafted a linebacker very high in Round 1 and for some reason, the man is just not making any plays and can't seem to shed guards. Mayo has been pretty mediocre for a while now.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2010
  5. RhodyPatriot

    RhodyPatriot In the Starting Line-Up

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    The lack of a pass rush is leaving the D backfield exposed.
    This team is paying a price for bad drafts and a change in philosophy which put acquiring more toys for Brady THE priority over investing in the defense.
     
  6. satz

    satz 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    I think first of all this is a excepted. With our unknown defence with so much youth if you expected different you are wrong. Young players do play up and down. We will have a few more weeks of this where they will look tremendous in one week and bad in another.

    the goal is to get better and get more consitent by the last 6-7 weeks and playoff if we make it.

    we had cunningham playing his first game as a OLB
    Spikes was all over the place and i felt guyton was a better matchup to the TE .he has the wingspan.
    Cro matches up with Moss better .
    Brady has to work tate in there ,with cro on moss and wilson/safety on welker tate should have been the target .
    Secondary will be fine , i am some one who thinks they will be fine .We did miss bodden. I think for now i will put the taller CB on the taller WR .
    I did not see the adjustment to bring merriweather in for sanders/chung as he is a better coverage guy or using more tate/TE .

    We need a RB. .There is no fear of running outside and perimeter threat with any of our backs.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2010
  7. borg

    borg In the Starting Line-Up

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    With Revis out, Jets DBs were practically inside our WR's skin.
    Pats DBs gave the standard 5 yd cushion between the 20's
    Jets RBs that released from backfield never covered by the 4 LBs in the 3-4
    Midget DBs ....giant WRs...Hobbs, Wilhite, now Butler...formula is wrong.
    Moss is a one trick pony...straight line speed. He has no agility. Forget any pattern where he cuts.
     
  8. aluminum seats

    aluminum seats In the Starting Line-Up

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    Right--I was going to single Mayo out actually. He had a terrific rookie season, and was banged up last year. Is he still getting back to speed now? Would hate to think we're seeing some bizarre Eugene Wilson thing, a guy who starts great when he's playing next to vets and then devolves into nothing. I don't get it.
     
  9. blackglass3

    blackglass3 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No Jersey Selected

    Mayo was pretty solid last week...this week he was invisible. Confused...
     
  10. NJPatsfan26

    NJPatsfan26 In the Starting Line-Up

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    IMO we looked pretty solid as a team last week, yesterday. 2nd half, we were invisible.
     
  11. Willie55

    Willie55 In the Starting Line-Up

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    The Patriots aren't making in-game adjustments like the used to. That was always a trademark of BB's teams. Last year and two games this year they get out to any early lead and end up blowing it in the end. It was even evident in the Cincy game, they got out to a large lead and then had to hold on, at one point they were ahead 24-3. Time to kick the coaches in the ass.
     
  12. Bobs My Uncle

    Bobs My Uncle PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Huh, this is so not true. If anything the team has not spent enough early picks on offense!

    Defense has been very well represented early in recent drafts. Unfortunately, either the selection of these defensive players has been suspect or the coaching up of these guys has been poor.

    Code:
    Year	No.	Round	Pick	Player	Name	Position	College
    2010	1	1	27	27	Devin McCourty	DB	Rutgers
     	2	2	10	42	Rob Gronkowski	TE	Arizona
     	3	2	21	53	Jermaine Cunningham	LB	Florida
     	4	2	30	62	Brandon Spikes	LB	Florida 
    
    2009	1	2	2	34	Patrick Chung	DB	Oregon
     	2	2	8	40	Ron Brace	DT	Boston College
     	3	2	9	41	Darius Butler	DB	Connecticut
    
    2008	1	1	10	10	Jerod Mayo	LB	Tennessee
     	2	2	31	62	Terrence Wheatley	DB	Colorado
     	3	3	15	78	Shawn Crable	LB	Michigan
    
    2007	1	1	24	24	Brandon Meriweather	DB	Miami (FL)
     	2	4	28	127	Kareem Brown	DT	Miami (FL)
    
     
  13. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    Earthwind Moreland was not on any SuperBowl winning roster. He was let go prior to the Pats getting to the SuperBowl.

    Not sure what game you watched, but Mayo and Spikes were both other there. The problem I saw was that they knew a LB couldn't cover Dustin Keller, but then , neither could Pat Chung.

    You also need to remember that Cunningham and Spikes are both new to the Pats 3-4. They aren't the vets that Bruschi, Vrabel, McGinest and Phifer were in 2003. It's going to take them time to make the adjustments. Even Mayo is still learning..
     
  14. Sicilian

    Sicilian Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    I think your point on Moss is spot on. In 2007, Brady could chuck it up to Moss even if he was double covered and Moss would come down with it somehow. He can't do that anymore, he's just not that receiver at his age. He still has good speed, runs decent routes, and can catch the ball when he's open, but Brady HAS to adjust and start viewing him as just one receiver of many. If he's open, throw it him by all means. If he's not, you have to go somewhere else, period.

    Another thing I think is somewhat overlooked is Chung's near interception on the first defensive play of the game. I usually not one to pin anything on one play (it probably wouldn't have changed the outcome), but if Sanchez tries to go deep on his first throw and ends up getting picked, I'm not convinced either he changes, or the gameplan changes from then out. He wouldn't have nearly the confidence I don't think, and who knows what happens then.

    Again, only one play, so I won't actually say it was the difference. Just one of those "what ifs..."
     
  15. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    Don't let facts get in the way of your rantings..

    Over the last 3 drafts, the Pats have had 15 picks in the 1st 3 rounds. 10 of those 15 picks have been on defense.

    The 2007 draft was a lousy draft to begin with in terms of talent. That's been proven around the league.
     
  16. aluminum seats

    aluminum seats In the Starting Line-Up

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    Earthland Moreland saw significant playing time on a 14-2 team that went on to win the Super Bowl. That's the point. C'mon.

    And "not sure what game you watched" would suggest that you think Mayo was a force out there, huh? Or are you just saying that yes, factually, they were "out there." I guess I should clarify that I didn't mean "do the Patriots actually have linebackers" as a literal question.

    Of course the Pats' D is young. But since we're discussing yesterday's game, I would say Mayo's play was diappointing.
     
  17. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    No Jersey Selected

    BTW, Chiefs are 2-0.
     
  18. condon84

    condon84 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Mayo is the most overrated player in Patriot history. I saw him yesterday, making his customary tackles 6 yards past the line of scrimmage.

    I also saw Ninkovich get destroyed trying to set the edge.

    Someone also mentioned this yesterday that when the Jets gashed us for those two big LT runs, Vince shot up the backfield like he was one gapping it and left a hole for LT to run through. What the hell was that? It's one thing if a rookie does it and another for a respected vet and leader to do it.

    All in all, I'm not surprised this happened to our defense. Same coaching staff, same defensive philosophies, same results.

    As far as our offense is concerned, the Jets defense made an adjustment after Brady led our team to those two long drives to open the game. They were initially playing zone and Brady picked them apart. They made an adjustment, went into press coverage and we couldn't adjust for some reason or we're just too stubborn.

    Here's a thought: With Brady and Moss being buddies, is it possible that Brady's just forcing passes his way so he could set him up for a big contract?
     
  19. SoCal Pmen

    SoCal Pmen 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #54 Jersey

    Jets definitely played with a more sense of desperation. NE seemed surprised by the fact the Jets let Sanchez open it up and as he got into a rythm they didn't have an answer. They were playing to stop the run and then began scrambling around when Sanchez started to throw the dink and the dunk passes.

    The good news is that the Pats will get better as the season goes on albeit not in all areas but they should be able to improve their offensive effectiveness. The biggest area of concern is the running. I don't know how they're going to beat the best teams in the league when you're only gaining 60 yards on the ground. Pass rush and corner play go hand in hand and both of these are also question marks which we already knew going into the season with the loss of Ty Warren and Bodden.
     
  20. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    Moreland was on the roster for 9 games, playing in 7 and starting in 2.

    What your "point was" and what you said are two different things. You said they won SBs with Moreland in there. And they didn't. He wasn't on the roster at that time. He'd been cut.


    I make every effort to say exactly what I mean. No where did I imply or suggest that Mayo was a force. What I noticed was that the Jets tended to run at his side, but pass to the side that Spikes was on, though there was one play where Mayo was the one in coverage.

    Just because we're discussing yesterday's game doesn't negate the fact that the Pats defense is young and they are still learning how to properly execute the system. Still learning the ideas that they all have to work as a team and what happens when they fail to do so.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2010
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