The Defensive Front Seven

[Ring 6]

OK, let me ask for some clarification.

1) Do we need a backup #4 LB on the team, and how much should we expect to pay?

2) Do we need an additional backup DE on the team (in addition to the LB's, Moore and Buchanan), and how much should we expect to pay?

Yes we need backups. Duh.
I just don't follow your line of thinking of assigning money to a spot and throwing it at whoever shows up.
If a player is available at a cost consistent with the role he will play,and the quality that he will play it, sign him. Alternatively signing cheap vets or drafting players to fill depth spots works as well.

Looking at Ayers, first I think it will be impossible to keep him at any price, because we just gave him 24 combined snaps in 3 playoff games, and are likely to add Mayo back next season (not to mention draft choices) to further bury him on the depth chart. Why would he come here to play less than 10 snaps a game?
If for some reason he wanted to stay (aside from not wanting a guy who doesn't want to fight for playing time) I would say his projected role and quality of play would justify something in the vicinity of 1.5 to 2mill. The drop off to a rookie or vet at the minimum taking his place, both in need and quality would justify spending the extra money elsewhere, or on a better option at the position, IMO.

Lets not forget, BB had the opportunity to use Ayers in the playoffs and chose to sit him on 154 of then 178 snaps. Surely that gives us some insight into BBs assessment of Ayers.

 

[Ring 6]

I'll try to make this more simple. Your position was the same last year, and Belichick agreed with YOU.

No, my position wasn't the same last year because Akeem Ayers wasn't available and the position I am discussing is about Akeem Ayers.

1) You don't think that Ayers is worth $3M-$4M to the patriots as a backup DE. I believe that he did get reps as a LB in at least one of the playoff game, playing instead of Casillas. Last year, you took a similar position when some of us wanted to spend this amount of money on a free agent backup DE if one of sufficient quality was available.

Money is better spent upgrading spots that will see a lot of playing time rather than spots that will be bench warming.
My position has always been that the best thing BB could do would be to get a stud pass rushers and use Nink less on passing downs, and expand his role to more than LDE.

2) You believe that it is fine for Ninkovich and Jones (and Collins and Hightower) to play over 90% of the reps. Some of us would be more comfortable if they played more in the 80-85% range.

BB appears to disagree with 'some of you'. I dopn't know how Ayers solves that problem if BB wont take Jones or Nink off the field for him.

3) You are correct in saying that I don't understand your emphasis on Ayers lack of reps when Jones was healthy. Ayers was the replacement for Jones (except for the one game where Easley played). I wouldn't expect him to play much if the philosophy is for Ninkovich and Jones to play unless they are injured.

Then that devalues a guy you want to pay 3-4 million for. If he were worth that, BB would have gotten him on the field. IF Mayo were healthy in the playoffs, how many snaps do you think Ayers would have gotten? Any?

 

[mgteich]

Yes we need backups. Duh.

Yes, we agree.
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We have 5 quality players at LB and DE. We have Ninkovich, Jones, Mayo, Collins and Hightower. Presumably, we will have 4-6 backups on the Game 1 roster. I agree that if all of these players are healthy throughout the 2015 season, the value of backups is minimal. With one injury, we might be playing Practice Squad quality players in the base (Skinner and Fleming last year).

The open question is how to fill the backup positions, and how much these positions are worth. If we just ASSUME health, then we should just re-sign Casillas and move on. If we have injuries, we'll have an excuse.

The alternative is pay for backups who are capable of starting at more than one position, IF THERE ARE INJURIES. That player needn't play any defensive reps at all if everyone is healthy. I see Ayers and Casillas as examples of these players.

Consider the OL. I certainly hope that we draft a top LG. I suggest that Belichick would pay serious money to Connolly as a backup, as he has for Cannon. How many reps should I expect these Game Day backups to play if there are no injuries?