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Stop the madness

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Patslifer, May 19, 2008.

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  1. Patslifer

    Patslifer Banned

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    I have had several posters insult me over saying the patriots broke a NFL rule. Belichick admitted to screwing up with his understanding of the rule, and then he apologized for violating the rule.

    Can we stop the madness? Someone please tell me how the patriots did not break a rule? Spygate was overblown, unfair and an all out media attack on our beloved pats.
    But, to claim the pats did not break any rules it total douchebaggery - (imo). Kraft and Belichick admitted to making a mistake and breaking an NFL rule, just accept it! I buy Belichicks explanation regarding the rule he broke, but I also am objective enough to know he broke one.


    Ps, I love the pats.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  2. DefenseRules

    DefenseRules Pro Bowl Player

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Stop the madness.

    BB broke a rule. He admitted it and appologized. I've accepted that and moved on.
     
  3. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Re: Stop the madness.

    I am a big homer. Having said that, it is clear that a "rule" was violated.

    There is no need to insult someone for saying that. Certainly if a troll comes here and uses "Cheaters" he's fair game until he gets whacked.

    If all you are saying is that a rule was broken and someone is attacking you personally, let the moderators know. Some people may feel insulted if someone says "I disagree". But if you are being called names for saying a rule was broken, then that needs to stop.

    Let's leave this thread floating for a while so people get the message.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  4. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Stop the madness.

    People are claiming that he didn't break a rule? I don't see how that argument could hold water. I mean, maybe you could argue that the wording was ambiguous enough that it could be easily misinterpreted, and therefore the punishment shouldn't have been what it was, but they definitely did break a rule. To be totally honest, I'm not even sure that I buy Belichick's misinterpretation claim. IMO, he did it, knew it was against the rules, but figured that, like all of the other minor, largely-irrelevant rule-breaking that goes on, it just didn't really matter and was implicitly tolerated.

    Assuming that, what's he supposed to say as a justification? He's not going to sell out the rest of the league, so he couldn't very well tell the truth ("I bent the rules just past the breaking point, which pretty much everyone does in one way or another, so deal with it"). He also couldn't just say "Yeah I broke a rule and I knew it, get on with your lives already", as that would make him seem like a cheating jerkwad, which he isn't. Instead, imo, he explained it away as a misinterpretation, which is now backfiring on him. Ironically, if I'm right, his classiness in being unwilling to sell out the rest of the league is yet again the reason why he's taking a beating from journalists again. At some point, I just hope he'll say enough is enough and start saying what he knows about everyone else.
     
  5. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    Stop whining.

    I can't stand posters who blurt out INSULTS first, and THEN whine when someone insults them back. You started the insults first. This is embarrassing.
     
  6. richpats

    richpats Banned

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    OMG most of the guys on the FRAMe committee argued that Belichick hadn't broken a rule. I told them that he did break a rule and I was called a troll.

    ^And there is one now!
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  7. Patslifer

    Patslifer Banned

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    Re: Stop the madness.


    I stated my opinion that anyone who think's that the pats did not break are rule are delusional, after YOU responded to my original post in a very heated manor. I didn't report you, because I am not Eric Mangini, but I did want to highlight your crazy talk, to show that the vast majority of sane fans don't agree with you.


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Patslifer
    I'm sorry, anyone who thinks that the pats didn't break a rule are totally delusional. They may not have meant to do it, but they did.
    They didn't break one, no matter what you and Goodell say.
    Upstater1 , then says
    You're also someone with the mental capacity of a flea because you can't read the rule and come to a logical conclusion.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  8. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Stop the madness.


    I thought the argument was that the rule was vague, open to misinterpretation, and pretty much irrelevant in the first place since breaking it didn't afford any significant advantage?
     
  9. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    Taking this guy's word is kind of like blindly trusting Matt Walsh.

    He insults people as being delusional and then cries when people insult him back.

    He said I was delusional for believing the Patriots didn't break a rule. You seem to think the same thing. Let me ask you, did you watch the interview with Keteyian? Go watch the CBS interview in which Belichick claims that the memo doesn't take precedence over the bylaw, and then come back and tell me what Belichick made a "mistake" about.

    His only mistake, according to Belichick, was in not seeking clarification for a rule. He made this point several times during the interview, and furthermore even when Armen read the memo back to him word for word, Belichick said, "Again, during a game." He made it a point of emphasis.

    This means it's clear that Belichick does not agree with the commissioner's interpretation. Clearly, Belichick believes his interpretation is the correct one.

    We've had several threads on here in the last week, one from a Sports Law lawyer employed at the university who believes that Belichick read the rule correctly.

    I guess we should get in this argument again because before someone calls other people delusional for believing what was plain as day in the Keteyian interview, they should at least--AT LEAST--quote the rule and tell us how it should be read.
     
  10. Patslifer

    Patslifer Banned

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    Re: Stop the madness.


    That's not how it went. Your first post was very pointed, and you clearly think you know everything. I'm not crying or mad. I would have reported you to the mods if I was upset. No big deal.

    http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=82941

    Now don't go and edit your post's!
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  11. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    What?

    A very heated manner?

    This is what I wrote:

    You're saying that "we" should not forget the Patriots broke a rule. Meanwhile, a lot of your fellow Patriots fans have argued (convincingly, I might add) that they DID NOT break rule. So, it's your opinion that they broke a rule.

    Many of us don't agree.

    That's what I was responding to.


    You call this heated? I have never come across someone on these boards with such thin skin.

    The next thing you call me delusional, and I responded in kind.

    Then you go crying with a whole new pathetic thread.

    Man, I'm embarrassed to even be a part of these pansy discussion.
     
  12. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    I already pasted it verbatim here.

    I'd like to see a single person other than you who thinks my posts were insulting.
     
  13. Patslifer

    Patslifer Banned

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    I thought your post was pointed. Anyway, I can't agree with anyone who says the pats didn't break a rule.

    No big deal, truce?
     
  14. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    A lot of us think he interpreted the rule correctly.

    And that Goodell is way out of his depth.

    His minions, such as Steve Alic, know more. As Alic said, "That's football."

    I don't want to redo the whole FRAME points that are atop this webpage but a lot of points do back up this argument. The Steve Alic comment, Goodell's own comment that the Jets had permission to tape from unauthorized space, the sports lawyer's interpretation of the word, line by line, as well as Bill Belichick's own defense in the interview with Keteyian in which Belichick made clear he did not agree with the commissioner's interpretation of the rule.
     
  15. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    I never asked you to agree with it. I simply made the point that not everyone shares your opinion. You characterized that as delusional, and then got upset when I returned the favor.

    I think it's low class that you started this thread. If you want a truce, obliterate it and I'll call a truce. There are a LOT of us here who take Belichick's side vis a vis the rule. And anyone who watched the CBS interview with Keteyian knows that Belichick feels he did not break a rule. I agree with him.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2008
  16. Metaphors

    Metaphors In the Starting Line-Up

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    I don't think it is as black-n-white as that. It seems pretty reasonable that Belichick understood that the league wouldn't be thrilled about taping the opposing sidelines. The Pats had camera guys ejected from the sidelines in the past and never challenged the ejections based on the rules. It also seems pretty reasonable that Belichick thought he was on the right side of the word ("during a game") and intent (don't use recording to gain a competitive advantage) of the rule. In other words...no harm, no foul.
     
  17. Patslifer

    Patslifer Banned

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    I watched the interview, I think he misenterpeted a rule - which led to breaking it.
     
  18. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    Belichick addressed this. It was post the memo in 2006 that Patriots cameramen were ejected. Certainly Matt Walsh never was. What I want to know is this: were Patriots camera guys ejected before 2006? Because if they were, then maybe the league did recognize the rule as Goodell interpreted it.

    But if they weren't ejected before that, then it seems to me that the rule was as Belichick said. Why start ejecting people in 2006? In other words? Why issue a memo if the rule is clear?

    Regardless, in the Keteyian interview, Belichick was asked if he agreed with Goodell's actions. Belichick responded: "It's irrelevant what I think." Belichick said it was the commissioner's responsibility to make those decisions. He culd have easily issued a mea culpa there, but essentially he said that what he thinks is irrelevant. AFTER he made that comment he contested the value of the memo, he contested the wording of both the memo AND the actual rule. He even made it clear that the mistake he personally made--the only mistake--was not seeking clarification from the league.

    This is the precise reason why Peter King and the like are piling onto Belichick, because the interview made it clear that he feels he's in the right.

    And I agree with him.
     
  19. fierce

    fierce Practice Squad Player

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    #87 Jersey

    Re: Stop the madness.

    Are you still posing as a Pats fan? Seriously? Ok so you got a couple of real fans riled up good for you! God this place is amazing.
     
  20. upstater1

    upstater1 Pro Bowl Player

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    Re: Stop the madness.

    That's not even the point. The point isn't what YOU think. It's what Belichcik thinks.

    It's clear from the interview that Belichick does not believe he misinterpreted the rule.
     
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