Patriots 2013 Rookies

[supafly]

You have to give Boyce a chance.

Kenbrell Thompkins has nothing whatsoever locked up.

I don't get why so many people are down on Dobson

The reality is that we needed to rebuild our WR position with younger and speedier talent, and these selections went a long way towards achieving that goal.

I believe that all 3 are a work in progress, and any/all of them either have the potential to be large contributors or bench riding backups. There is a lot of grey area and it the question can't be answered in one rookie year.

They all have their pluses and negatives in different ways, and common sense would point to AD being our WR with the highest potential, but like I said--I still think that it's too early to tell about any of them. They all looked both good and bad at times, which is to be expected in a rookie year in a complex offense.

 

[coolguy]

The reality is that we needed to rebuild our WR position with younger and speedier talent, and these selections went a long way towards achieving that goal.

I believe that all 3 are a work in progress, and any/all of them either have the potential to be large contributors or bench riding backups. There is a lot of grey area and it the question can't be answered in one rookie year.

They all have their pluses and negatives in different ways, and common sense would point to AD being our WR with the highest potential, but like I said--I still think that it's too early to tell about any of them. They all looked both good and bad at times, which is to be expected in a rookie year in a complex offense.

All it takes is one big play for them to be a star just like this guy

 

[Kdo5]

I don't get why so many people are down on Dobson (a lot of people were calling him a JAG potential the game threads). The guy has had the best rookie season by any Patriots' WR since Terry Glenn. I know that isn't an impressive list of WRs, but he did have a better rookie season than Deion Branch who was easily the best WR drafted between Glenn and Dobson.

When I look at Dobson, I think he has the best shot at being a superstar out of this rookie class. He has some things to work on to be a very good WR, nevermind a stud. But he has things that cannot be taught. He burns defenders quite a bit off the line and frequently wide open down the field. He can make freakish catches.

Yes, Dobson needs to work on his consistency and routes. I think people overrate his drops because of how he started the season, but he could be a bit better there.

If Dobson was healthy, based how he started to come on before he got injured, he could have had upwards to 800 yards and 7-8 TDs for the year if he didn't basically miss the last month of the season due to a stress fracture.

I have felt the same way for a while. Some people can keep being down on Dobson. I think they are dead wrong. I've been saying again and again that Dobson has looked like our best rookie WR draft pick since Branch. The talent and potential is there, his dropping issues eventually subsided, and he tends to get more looks from Brady than any receiver next to Edelbeast. At a point in the season there were games when he was getting more looks than Edelman actually.

 

[fnordcircle]

If our FO applied the same standards to Edelman that people are applying to Boyce he'd have been cut years ago.

Sometimes players just need time and then when they're shot comes they make the best of it.

 

[farn]

People on this board are way too harsh in their judgement of BB the "GM"....

There have been amazing years (2003, 2010), very good (2001, 2002, 2004, 2011, 2012). Even "poor" years yielded key pieces (trades for WW and RM in 2007, Mayo and Slater in 2008, Edelman and Vollmer in 2009).

Drafting is like parenting. You do your best using your gut, advice from trusted people, and putting in time. But in the end, it's a guessing game.

This crop looks promising, as do ALL drafts since 2010.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

If our FO applied the same standards to Edelman that people are applying to Boyce he'd have been cut years ago.

Sometimes players just need time and then when they're shot comes they make the best of it.

Edelman's first preseason game:

5 receptions for 37 yards
1 kickoff return for 24 yards
1 punt return for 75 yards + touchdown
1 ST tackle

All of that from a former QB in his very first preseason game. After that game, there was ZERO chance of him clearing waivers.

 

[Wheelman]

If our FO applied the same standards to Edelman that people are applying to Boyce he'd have been cut years ago.

Sometimes players just need time and then when they're shot comes they make the best of it.

I agree with you. But Edelman is a converted QB so his learning curve was steeper than it should be for Dobson/Thompkins/Boyce. But yeah I don't get the whole bust after one season type attitude.

 

[supafly]

I have felt the same way for a while. Some people can keep being down on Dobson. I think they are dead wrong. I've been saying again and again that Dobson has looked like our best rookie WR draft pick since Branch. The talent and potential is there, his dropping issues eventually subsided, and he tends to get more looks from Brady than any receiver next to Edelbeast. At a point in the season there were games when he was getting more looks than Edelman actually.

It appears that Aaron Dobson was a good enough choice at WR, and he certainly may really take off next season, but I'm not understanding how you'd claim that "he tends to get more looks from Brady than any receiver next to Edelman?" Or the questioning as to why some people are a bit down on him? (believe it or not, I'm not really one of those people that are necessarily down on him myself. I'm just trying to give an honest assessment)

The guy has had 15 catches since week #6. That's the past 10 games, averaging 1.5 catches a game. What am I missing here?

I think he has potential, but I hardly think he's been some great acquisition, or that our postseason chances ride on him (unless your claim is that we need any other capable receiving body outside of Edelman, which I'd highly agree with).

The truth is that he did okay in some aspects with flashes at times, and that we really have no idea if he'll be the next Randy Moss or Chad Jackson. I would absolutely disagree with anyone who'd be ready to give up on him, but I'd also disagree with these assessments that he had some great rookie season too. The truth is that one of these guys should have stepped up under the circumstances, and that's really yet to happen to this point outside of Brady trusting Julian Edelman every time he throws the ball.

 

[captain stone]

The reality is that we needed to rebuild our WR position with younger and speedier talent, and these selections went a long way towards achieving that goal.

I believe that all 3 are a work in progress, and any/all of them either have the potential to be large contributors or bench riding backups. There is a lot of grey area and it the question can't be answered in one rookie year.

They all have their pluses and negatives in different ways, and common sense would point to AD being our WR with the highest potential, but like I said--I still think that it's too early to tell about any of them. They all looked both good and bad at times, which is to be expected in a rookie year in a complex offense.

Thompkins' spot on the 53 needs upgrading, but not with a 2014 rookie. I'd rather a young vet
- Golden Tate, e.g. - be signed early in the free agency period as a bridge between the 2013
rookies and the smurfness of Edelman (who must be re-signed by all means necessary)
& Amendola.

 

[Deus Irae]

Some interesting takes here.

 

[Arrington Planet]

The guy has had 15 catches since week #6. That's the past 10 games, averaging 1.5 catches a game. What am I missing here?

Your numbers are off here, he's had 24 catches, even though he's missed three games and has been limited in two more. That's 3 catches a game during the 8 games he played during that span.

 

[supafly]

Thompkins' spot on the 53 needs upgrading, but not with a 2014 rookie. I'd rather a young vet
- Golden Tate, e.g. - be signed early in the free agency period as a bridge between the 2013
rookies and the smurfness of Edelman (who must be re-signed by all means necessary)
& Amendola.

Absolutely. I think we'd all want to see a better overall WR brought in, and one would assume that they may have been more aggressive and/or wouldn't have let Welker/Llyod leave so easily had they known the situations with Hernandez and Gronk.

The concern I'd have is whether the team could afford such a player, along with the usual worry about whether or not they could pick up the system well enough to be worth their cost.

I suppose a guy like Emmanuel Sanders may be a possibility again depending on his price demands. I think he'd probably be the ceiling though. Of course we'd all like to see Edelman retained too, as long as it's an affordable deal. Sanders would be the upgrade that you're looking for in terms of Thompkins, although I don't know how comparable their specific responsibilities would be either.

 

[supafly]

Your numbers are off here, he's had 24 catches, even though he's missed three games and has been limited in two more. That's 3 catches a game during the 8 games he played during that span.

My numbers are not off.

In the past 10 games after week 6, he has caught 15 balls.

Aaron Dobson Career Game Log - Pro-Football-Reference.com

Edit: actually, since he started his career in game #2 you're right---it's 18 catches, not 15. I assumed the column started at week 1, but I forgot that he didn't start until week 2.

It certainly is not 24 as you state though. There's no 3 catch per game average from week 7 on, it's 1.8.

 

[Kdo5]

It appears that Aaron Dobson was a good enough choice at WR, and he certainly may really take off next season, but I'm not understanding how you'd claim that "he tends to get more looks from Brady than any receiver next to Edelman?" Or the questioning as to why some people are a bit down on him? (believe it or not, I'm not really one of those people that are necessarily down on him myself. I'm just trying to give an honest assessment)

The guy has had 15 catches since week #6. That's the past 10 games, averaging 1.5 catches a game. What am I missing here?

I think he has potential, but I hardly think he's been some great acquisition, or that our postseason chances ride on him (unless your claim is that we need any other capable receiving body outside of Edelman, which I'd highly agree with).

The truth is that he did okay in some aspects with flashes at times, and that we really have no idea if he'll be the next Randy Moss or Chad Jackson. I would absolutely disagree with anyone who'd be ready to give up on him, but I'd also disagree with these assessments that he had some great rookie season too. The truth is that one of these guys should have stepped up under the circumstances, and that's really yet to happen to this point outside of Brady trusting Julian Edelman every time he throws the ball.

Sorry but 1.5 catches per game? He missed three of the last ten games entirely w/an injury and was sidelined for the vast majority of two other games with the same injury. Thus he basically played five out of the last ten games which makes that stat irrelevant.

And yes from week six up until his injury in week twelve, Let's compare Dobson's numbers to Edelman.

Dobson: 22 rec, 3 TDs, and more yardage.
Edelman: 16 rec, 0 TDs with just one game averaging over 10 YPC

Now let me make myself clear. I believe Edelman is the best we've got right now but I am correct in saying that Dobson got more looks (or at least made the most out of them) than Edelman from when he began hitting his stride from week 6 up until his injury which basically sidelined him the remainder of the year.

You are skewing the facts by acting like Dobson played all of the last ten games when he really only played five. And the 22 catches are recorded, confirmed stats from week 6 to week 12.

 

[supafly]

Sorry but 1.5 catches per game? He missed three of the last ten games entirely w/an injury and was sidelined for the vast majority of two other games with the same injury. Thus he basically played five out of the last ten games which makes that stat irrelevant.

And yes from week six up until his injury in week twelve, Let's compare Dobson's numbers to Edelman.

Dobson: 22 rec, 3 TDs, and more yardage.
Edelman: 16 rec, 0 TDs with just one game averaging over 10 YPC

Now let me make myself clear. I believe Edelman is the best we've got right now but I am correct in saying that Dobson got more looks (or at least made the most out of them) than Edelman from when he began hitting his stride from week 6 up until his injury which basically sidelined him the remainder of the year.

You are skewing the facts by acting like Dobson played all of the last ten games when he really only played five. And the 22 catches is a fact from week 6 to week 12.

You guys can try and spin it however you want, the fact remains that in the past 10 games from the N.Orleans game on (weeks 7-16), he's caught a grand total of 18 receptions.

As I said in the last post, I forgot that he had missed the week #1 game, so the column starts for week 1 for everyone else. That takes his average in the past 10 games up to 1.8 instead of 1.5. Feel better now?

Whether he's missed games or not is irrelevant. We're discussing reasons why people think he had such a good year.

18 total receptions from the middle of October on don't usually equate to having a good year. I'm sure he'll see more looks next year and hopefully continue to progress. I'm not meaning to belittle him. I'm just answering the question as to why some here are down on him a bit. It's hard to have a ton of confidence for a guy who's either missed games, or not produced much since the middle of October. Even then, it isn't like he was exactly tearing it up. He had what equates to a "normal" rookie year for WRs in our offense, when we normally have much better options and slowly blend our new rookies in.

It's a shame that none of the 3 rookies really took complete advantage of their opportunity and stepped up in the absence of Hernandez, Gronk, Vereen, etc. They gave us something to hopefully build on though.

 

[Arrington Planet]

In the past 10 games after week 6, he has caught 15 balls.

Whoops, I understoond you wrong there and thought you counted the week 6 game too. Yes, without that game is 18 instead of 24.

 

[supafly]

Whoops, I understoond you wrong there and thought you counted the week 6 game too. Yes, without that game is 18 instead of 24.

Either way, it's no big deal. Like I said, it is 18 instead of the 15 that I originally posted, so I'm glad that you pointed it out so I went back and noticed that he didn't play in week 1.

I think Dobson could end up being a fine receiver, or at least a bigger play threat who catches 45-50 balls a year or something (it'll depend on our other receiving options of course), but I'm simply pointing out the answer to the question which was "why are some down on him?"

The reason some are likely down is that he really hasn't done too much from mid October on, aside from the PIT game.

 

[Arrington Planet]

You guys can try and spin it however you want, the fact remains that in the past 10 games from the N.Orleans game on (weeks 7-16), he's caught a grand total of 18 receptions.

Hey, don't look at me, I was just correcting (wrongly, but that's another story ) your numbers. I don't like Dobson that much, I wanted Keenan Allen all along, so at the moment I'm at the "we drafted the wrong guy" bandwagon.

 

[Kdo5]

Either way, it's no big deal. Like I said, it is 18 instead of the 15 that I originally posted, so I'm glad that you pointed it out so I went back and noticed that he didn't play in week 1.

I think Dobson could end up being a fine receiver, or at least a bigger play threat who catches 45-50 balls a year or something (it'll depend on our other receiving options of course), but I'm simply pointing out the answer to the question which was "why are some down on him?"

The reason some are likely down is that he really hasn't done too much from mid October on, aside from the PIT game.

I presumed you were counting week six and if we are then it is 24 catches. I don't understand why week six wouldn't be counted. And it is still ridiculous to act like his production dipped by throwing out a stat of 1.5 catches per game over the last ten games when he only played five.

If he didn't play then it is silly to use stats to make it seem like his production went down because of his play on the field.

 

[supafly]

Hey, don't look at me, I was just correcting (wrongly, but that's another story ) your numbers. I don't like Dobson that much, I wanted Keenan Allen all along, so at the moment I'm at the "we drafted the wrong guy" bandwagon.

I don't really mind the pick itself, I just don't think he did anything all that impressive, that's all. I honestly didn't expect anything more than the "high" bar set by Branch, and it was good to see Dobson/Thompkins contribute on some level.

Just b/c they didn't put up great numbers doesn't necessarily mean that they won't eventually. I think the fact that they got live game reps in important situations may have been extremely helpful. I'm just pointing out what seems to be a misconception that he had some great rookie campaign. He showed some flashes at times though, and that's something to build off of. He has talent it seems, so we can hope for a good 2nd year leap.