Ochmed's First Mock

[Ochmed Jones]

Miami - J Long - Very safe pick.

St. Louis- C Long - Little and Hall are not the answer in 2008.

Atlanta - Dorsey - Best 4-3 DT in the draft.

Oakland - Ellis - DT is a huge hole in their defense.

KC - Clady - They are high on Croyle; pass on Ryan.

Jets - Gholston- Jets sold on the shiny chrome, ignore issues that lurk under the hood.

Dallas trades #22 and # 28 to the Pats for #7.Dallas takes McFadden - Playmaker and most explosive talent in the draft.

#22 Cason CB - Ball skills and can help as a returner. (Not especially quick twitch)

Patriots trade #28 to Atlanta for #34 and #103. Atlanta takes QB Flacco

#34 Goves OLB - Speed rusher off the edge. (Heart valve problem drops him a bit)
#62 Bryant NT - Best 3-4 NT in the draft. (Only 20 reps at 225. Lots of time with Woicik needed)
#69 Goff ILB - Works better in the 3-4 than Rivers. (Not as athletic as Rivers.)
#94 P Lee CB - Really came on strong this season.
#103 J Carlson TE - What could he have done with anything resembling a QB last season.
#129 K Langford DE - Hampton DE in 6'6" 285 with 4.9 speed. Developmental prospect.
#164 K Brown OG - Proved he was a player against Michigan. Nasty developmental prospect.
#197 Hester RB/FB - Versatile Warrior.
#238 Aldridge KR/WR - More help in the return game, if C Jackson sent packing.

 

[DocE]

I personally like Gholston, but I'd be very happy to get Groves later instead. Not sure if Cason is round 1 value, I guess it depends on what CB's are available at 22 as to whether I like the pick or not. Bryant is in the same boat, like the player, not sure about the value. The only pick I really don't care for is Goff in the 3rd round. If he's a taken in the 4th or 5th, I would be fine with him, but I don't care for him nearly as much most on the board.
Love the Lee and Langford picks, especially where you are getting them. If we came out of the draft with Groves, Cason, Lee, Langford, and Bryant on defense, I think I'd be pretty happy.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Any thoughts on Bryant's linemate Henry Smith? I saw an item where he was considered to be a more consistent performer than Red - seems like he'll be available as an UDFA, so that may not be a common assessment of his worth.

Seems you had some concerns about Goff's instincts last year, any change in your perspective?

 

[mgteich]

With Ryan and McFadden on the board, I would see no reason to trade out of the top 16.

It would seem we could get a 4th from Baltimore and then another pick from someone in the #9 to #16 spots.

I'm fine with picking McFadden, but if we don't, I'm also fine with several players who would be available at say #13. At least four out of the following would be there: Albert, Otah, Williams, McKelvin, Cromartie, Jenkins, Rivers and Harvey. I' be fine picking from this list, having just picked up a 3rd and a 4th to move down (or a second).

Miami - J Long - Very safe pick.

St. Louis- C Long - Little and Hall are not the answer in 2008.

Atlanta - Dorsey - Best 4-3 DT in the draft.

Oakland - Ellis - DT is a huge hole in their defense.

KC - Clady - They are high on Croyle; pass on Ryan.

Jets - Gholston- Jets sold on the shiny chrome, ignore issues that lurk under the hood.

Dallas trades #22 and # 28 to the Pats for #7.Dallas takes McFadden - Playmaker and most explosive talent in the draft.

#22 Cason CB - Ball skills and can help as a returner. (Not especially quick twitch)

Patriots trade #28 to Atlanta for #34 and #103. Atlanta takes QB Flacco

#34 Goves OLB - Speed rusher off the edge. (Heart valve problem drops him a bit)
#62 Bryant NT - Best 3-4 NT in the draft. (Only 20 reps at 225. Lots of time with Woicik needed)
#69 Goff ILB - Works better in the 3-4 than Rivers. (Not as athletic as Rivers.)
#94 P Lee CB - Really came on strong this season.
#103 J Carlson TE - What could he have done with anything resembling a QB last season.
#129 K Langford DE - Hampton DE in 6'6" 285 with 4.9 speed. Developmental prospect.
#164 K Brown OG - Proved he was a player against Michigan. Nasty developmental prospect.
#197 Hester RB/FB - Versatile Warrior.
#238 Aldridge KR/WR - More help in the return game, if C Jackson sent packing.

 

[jeffbiologist]

While I know most people will be tempted to trade back to the 20s to get 2 1s, I dont think BB/SP think like that. We can draft that low anytime, we want to take advantage of having a high pick. That said, they also dont like either the value there at 7 or the giant hole between 7 and 62. I think it more likely we work a trade with Carolina/Detroit to swap both 1s and 2s--to move up alot higher in round 2. I dont like mocks with the 2-for-1 much, every team we will be dealing with needs more picks than we do. I do think we increase the QUALITY of what we have, not the quantity.
Cason I have seen in mocks going as low as the 3rd rd. Not sold on Gholston or Groves....but maybe they are. I love the Bryant pick, but I think he might go ALOT higher now with so many more 3-4 teams putting a premium on that position. He could end up with any of our old cronies--Parcells, Mangini, or Crennel. Goff,,,,on every mock, I just dont think we take a ILB...unless he is a conversion project.(C.Long?)
I have seen the Colts are real high on Langford(2nd rd in some mocks), and Carlson is now the best all around blocking TE so he is likely to go in rd 2(and wouldnt be surprised to see us take him at 62,69).

 

[VJCPatriot]

Cason I have seen in mocks going as low as the 3rd rd. Not sold on Gholston or Groves....but maybe they are. I love the Bryant pick, but I think he might go ALOT higher now with so many more 3-4 teams putting a premium on that position. He could end up with any of our old cronies--Parcells, Mangini, or Crennel. Goff,,,,on every mock, I just dont think we take a ILB...unless he is a conversion project.(C.Long?)
I have seen the Colts are real high on Langford(2nd rd in some mocks), and Carlson is now the best all around blocking TE so he is likely to go in rd 2(and wouldnt be surprised to see us take him at 62,69).

If we are getting Groves with an early 2nd round pick, that is an absolute steal. Personally, I don't think he makes it past the Jags at #26. I agree that taking Cason at #22 appears a little bit high. He is rated as a second rounder by most scouting reports.

Bryant is a nice BACKUP for Wilfork, but not necessary by any stretch. I don't think the Jets take Bryant in round 2 because they just traded for Jenkins to plug their hole at NT.

Knowing BB, he WILL draft at least one tight end. I'm just hoping it's not until round 4. A tight end that can block is a plus... but have you considered that Watson's hands seem inconsistent at times despite his superior speed? Hmmm, and we also can't be sure how well David Thomas will do, he's missed a lot of time to injury.

 

[ALP]

Interesting....if the Jets have the option between Mcfadden and gholston, i believe they will take mcfadden

 

[VJCPatriot]

Overall I would be pretty happy with this draft haul. I just think that if we get those picks in return, that it will be Groves at 22 and Cason at 34.

One scenario I like a bit better is trading the later of the 1st round picks for a current 2nd and a future 1st. (IE a Kyle Boller deal). Having that extra 1st round pick for 2009 could be crucial in making a move up for a guy like Rey Malauga in 2009. Hell, if we're dealing with the Falcons, that future 1st might be high enough to get Malauga all by itself!

 

[State]

I like your thinking; you've put a lot of thought into this.

I'd be very happy with Quentin Groves, the gifted Auburn pass rusher at the end, and Jason Cason at the corner. That would help provide the infusion of youth at areas of need. And I think you are right on target with Dallas hoping to get the "home run" that they see in the Michael Vick of RBs. McFadden's the real deal. Ask any SEC defense.

So having them deal with us, and Jerry Jones has a very good working relationship with the Patriots, is a definite possibility.

And I think unless Gholston falls into our laps at 7, like Wolfork did a couple of years ago, the Pats are eager to trade down for the right value. We have a couple of need areas--LB and secondary--that need addressing right away. Plus, who wants to pay the cash for a player that might not pan out? That's the case with half of the first-rounders historically. In an era of cap limitation, we don't have the room to take a project in the first round. It can hold a franchise back for years.

The best value in the draft is second to fourth round, anyway.

Except for those rare players like Harvey and his 82" wingspan or Gholston and his physical gifts or Sedrick Ellis's explosiveness and power. Those traits are obviously not as available latter in the draft.

 

[Metaphors]

#22 Cason CB - Ball skills and can help as a returner. (Not especially quick twitch)

Patriots trade #28 to Atlanta for #34 and #103. Atlanta takes QB Flacco

#34 Goves OLB - Speed rusher off the edge. (Heart valve problem drops him a bit)
#62 Bryant NT - Best 3-4 NT in the draft. (Only 20 reps at 225. Lots of time with Woicik needed)
#69 Goff ILB - Works better in the 3-4 than Rivers. (Not as athletic as Rivers.)
#94 P Lee CB - Really came on strong this season.
#103 J Carlson TE - What could he have done with anything resembling a QB last season.
#129 K Langford DE - Hampton DE in 6'6" 285 with 4.9 speed. Developmental prospect.
#164 K Brown OG - Proved he was a player against Michigan. Nasty developmental prospect.
#197 Hester RB/FB - Versatile Warrior.
#238 Aldridge KR/WR - More help in the return game, if C Jackson sent packing.

I think it is way optimistic to think that Lee will be available at the end of round 3. Also Carlson looks to have a similar skill set to DThomas. Unless it is to plan for an eventual Thomas/Carlson pairing at TE, maybe it would be better to find a "pseudo-tackle" like Cottam or Stevens. They would be more likely to be available at #103 anyway.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

While I know most people will be tempted to trade back to the 20s to get 2 1s, I dont think BB/SP think like that.

Seeing as just a couple of weeks ago you advocated trading out of the first altogether, I'm glad you've seen the light.

 

[Seneschal2]

Dallas trades #22 and # 28 to the Pats for #7.Dallas takes McFadden - Playmaker and most explosive talent in the draft.

#22 Cason CB - Ball skills and can help as a returner. (Not especially quick twitch)

Patriots trade #28 to Atlanta for #34 and #103. Atlanta takes QB Flacco

#34 Goves OLB - Speed rusher off the edge. (Heart valve problem drops him a bit)
#62 Bryant NT - Best 3-4 NT in the draft. (Only 20 reps at 225. Lots of time with Woicik needed)
#69 Goff ILB - Works better in the 3-4 than Rivers. (Not as athletic as Rivers.)
#94 P Lee CB - Really came on strong this season.
#103 J Carlson TE - What could he have done with anything resembling a QB last season.
#129 K Langford DE - Hampton DE in 6'6" 285 with 4.9 speed. Developmental prospect.
#164 K Brown OG - Proved he was a player against Michigan. Nasty developmental prospect.
#197 Hester RB/FB - Versatile Warrior.
#238 Aldridge KR/WR - More help in the return game, if C Jackson sent packing.

Like the Pats trades and most of the picks. Personal preference for another CB rather than Lee. Doubt Jones trades both -- but it works here. Rumor has it Jones may trade that #28 but keep the #22. Keep an eye on this one.

Would be a huge success if the Pats came away with even some of these players. Good work.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Like the Pats trades and most of the picks. Personal preference for another CB rather than Lee. Doubt Jones trades both -- but it works here. Rumor has it Jones may trade that #28 but keep the #22. Keep an eye on this one.

Would be a huge success if the Pats came away with even some of these players. Good work.

Lee is a bit of a 1 year wonder and BB hasn't drafted a lot of those types.

I really like Wheatley at CB in the Pats defense, but 3 surgeries on his wrist including a bone fusing make me very nervous.

 

[PonyExpress]

This is a great draft. My only reservation is P. Lee. BTW, Ochmed here is an interesting article on Wheatley in the Denver Post:

http://origin.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_8996304

What's funny is that with one wrist and a metal plate Wheatley's ball skills are still better than Mckelvin's.

 

[Seneschal2]

I really like Wheatley at CB in the Pats defense, but 3 surgeries on his wrist including a bone fusing make me very nervous.

BTW, Ochmed here is an interesting article on Wheatley in the Denver Post:

http://origin.denverpost.com/broncos/ci_8996304

What's funny is that with one wrist and a metal plate Wheatley's ball skills are still better than Mckelvin's.

Wheatley is my 'official sleeper' pick at CB for the Pats. Ranked #2 after Cason, he does have better ball skills than McKelvin, and would also be the Pats primary kick returner. Even though he's lacking in size, he's a solid tackler, who like Cason, knows how to play CB.

Good article Pony -- thanks.

 

[Zeke_Mowatt]

Wheatley is my 'official sleeper' pick at CB for the Pats. Ranked #2 after Cason, he does have better ball skills than McKelvin, and would also be the Pats primary kick returner. Even though he's lacking in size, he's a solid tackler, who like Cason, knows how to play CB.

Good article Pony -- thanks.

Neat article, but without trading up from our late #2, do we have a shot at him falling that far? Or is he a good hopeful for a trade down later #1 and earlier #2 kind of pick?

 

[VJCPatriot]

Wheatley is my 'official sleeper' pick at CB for the Pats. Ranked #2 after Cason, he does have better ball skills than McKelvin, and would also be the Pats primary kick returner. Even though he's lacking in size, he's a solid tackler, who like Cason, knows how to play CB.

Good article Pony -- thanks.

He has better ball skills than McKelvin? Says who? As currently as April 17th, Gosselin has Wheatley ranked the #15 overall CB and McKelvin the #1. I understand that people have their favorites, but please keep it realistic. Wheatley is not going to be a second round pick, and I doubt he has better ballskills than the #1 ranked corner in the draft.

To be brutally honest, I don't think that Wheatly will go before round 4. A lot of teams lie when they say they are going to draft you at such and such a spot. It has happened countless times in draft history to countless players, so I wouldn't put much stock in Wheatley's boast that he has 6 teams telling him they will draft him in round 2.

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/football/nfl/draft/gosselin_rankings.html