NFLPA to file grievance for Hernandez' bonus

[PatsWickedPissah]

Apparently some don't understand that the distinction is irrelevant in this context. None of the arguments stated have anything to do with weather the NFLPA represents Hernandez or not. Accused vs convicted is meaningless. There are plenty of convicted felons represented by the NFLPA.

So based upon what you wrote anyone accused should be summarily dropped by the NFLPA.
Unions exist as the necessary counterpoint to unbridled management power.

 

[BSR]

If Hernandez is entitled to that money, despite whatever your personal feeling toward him, I don't have a problem with the NFLPA's actions. Now, if you were to ask me if I thought Hernandez deserved that money then we'd be having a different discussion.

Hernandez has a contract with the Patriots and he can go after that money himself. He doesn't need the NFLPA and I have yet to hear a coherent argument as to why they should continue to represent Hernandez.

As I asked before, what happens if the NFLPA expels Hernandez from the union and refuse to represent him?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

NFL Personal Conduct Policy - NFL Nation Blog - ESPN

Quoting Management's policy is irrelevant to what the Player Union's policy is

 

[IllegalContact]

Why? A lawyer can fire his client. Under what law does it say that a union can't expel a member?

Probably in the charter of the union itself.......the unions job is to make sure it's members are treated according to the rules stipulated in the CBA ....

Lawyers who fire clients run out of clients very quickly....I know I old never hire a lawyer who did that even once.....no use for uh a piece of crap....unions who turn and run at the sign of trouble don't stay unions.

Your notion is what I would call completely spineless.......

 

[BSR]

So based upon what you wrote anyone accused should be summarily dropped by the NFLPA.
Unions exist as the necessary counterpoint to unbridled management power.

Anyone charged with murder...yes. Is there some sort of downside to that? Does that somehow give management more power?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Anyone charged with murder...yes. Is there some sort of downside to that? Does that somehow give management more power?

Does not compute
Try logic vs raw emotion
It helps

 

[BSR]

Probably in the charter of the union itself.......the unions job is to make sure it's members are treated according to the rules stipulated in the CBA ....

Lawyers who fire clients run out of clients very quickly....I know I old never hire a lawyer who did that even once.....no use for uh a piece of crap....unions who turn and run at the sign of trouble don't stay unions.

Your notion is what I would call completely spineless.......

Or it means that the lawyer is willing to walk away from an unethical situation.

Again, the NFLPA is there to help a player deal with issues relating to CBA not help them with their murder charges. They should have dumped him as soon as he was charged with murder.

 

[ausbacker]

Hernandez has a contract with the Patriots and he can go after that money himself. He doesn't need the NFLPA and I have yet to hear a coherent argument as to why they should continue to represent Hernandez.

As I asked before, what happens if the NFLPA expels Hernandez from the union and refuse to represent him?

As long as Hernandez retains an NFLPA membership they are well within their rights to represent his interests. You're allowing your personal feelings to cloud your judgement. For the record, we're in agreement in regards to Hernandez and what he "deserves" (which is nothing). Unfortunately, the law doesn't care for that.

 

[BSR]

Quoting Management's policy is irrelevant to what the Player Union's policy is

What are you talking about? He was referencing the CBA which directly relates to management's policy.

 

[BSR]

Does not compute
Try logic vs raw emotion
It helps

Can you give me a logical answer then?

 

[BSR]

As long as Hernandez retains an NFLPA membership they are well within their rights to represent his interests. You're allowing your personal feelings to cloud your judgement. For the record, we're in agreement in regards to Hernandez and what he "deserves" (which is nothing). Unfortunately, the law doesn't care for that.

Of course they have the right to represent him but in this day and age people should be asking should they more and more.

As for the law not caring for that, are you implying there is an actual law that requires them to represent him? If so, I would like to know what it is because as far as I know there isn't.

 

[patchick]

Hernandez has a contract with the Patriots and he can go after that money himself. He doesn't need the NFLPA and I have yet to hear a coherent argument as to why they should continue to represent Hernandez.

It goes like this:

• At the time he signed his contract, he was a dues-paying member of the NFLPA.
• At the time he showed up for offseason workouts, he was a dues-paying member of the NFLPA.
• At the time the Patriots cut him, he was a dues-paying member of the NFLPA.

Ergo, the NFLPA has a legal, contractual obligation to represent him in his dispute over his workout bonus.

The union is perfectly free to kick him out now, but they can't rewrite history to retroactively dodge their obligations.

 

[50-yard-line]

The baseball players union is damaging whatever credibility is left of their sport by letting Arod play right now. He's a cheater, clearly, and he's AFFECTING games (cost the Sox last night, didn't he?).

Same here - I echo the earlier sentiments that this is a nightmare for the NFLPA, and will bring nothing good to the game or the players.

 

[ausbacker]

Of course they have the right to represent him but in this day and age people should be asking should they more and more.

As for the law not caring for that, are you implying there is an actual law that requires them to represent him? If so, I would like to know what it is because as far as I know there isn't.

BSR, you're being unreasonable.

 

[BSR]

It goes like this:

• At the time he signed his contract, he was a dues-paying member of the NFLPA.
• At the time he showed up for offseason workouts, he was a dues-paying member of the NFLPA.
• At the time the Patriots cut him, he was a dues-paying member of the NFLPA.

Ergo, the NFLPA has a legal, contractual obligation to represent him in his dispute over his workout bonus.

The union is perfectly free to kick him out now, but they can't rewrite history to retroactively dodge their obligations.

While I am not 100% on your first points I can buy the argument. My problem is with the last sentence. Why haven't them kicked him out yet? They should have done so as soon as he was charged?

 

[BSR]

BSR, you're being unreasonable.

Am I? Then maybe I am not conveying my point effectively enough. All I am saying is that the NFLPA should enorce a code of ethics as a requirment of membership. Is that really unreasonable?

 

[ausbacker]

Am I? Then maybe I am not conveying my point effectively enough. All I am saying is that the NFLPA should enorce a code of ethics as a requirment of membership. Is that really unreasonable?

I don't disagree with you but you're putting forward ethics as a reason to strip Hernandez of something that he may be entitled to. The NFLPA is acting within their rights. Whilst I don't agree with it (given my personal feeling toward what Hernandez represents) I am fine with the move.

 

[IllegalContact]

Or it means that the lawyer is willing to walk away from an unethical situation.

Again, the NFLPA is there to help a player deal with issues relating to CBA not help them with their murder charges. They should have dumped him as soon as he was charged with murder.

Everyone gets it.....you hate the guy.......but.........

There's nothing unethical about this.

It is called due process.......you sound clueless as to how things actually work.

Does a guy like that deserve the backing? Probably not.....but it is the purpose of the union to make sure the stipulations of the CBA are followed to the benefit of all their members.

In our culture, he is entitled to that representation. Just the way it is and you can't do anything about it

 

[IllegalContact]

Am I? Then maybe I am not conveying my point effectively enough. All I am saying is that the NFLPA should enorce a code of ethics as a requirment of membership. Is that really unreasonable?

Their code of ethics is to do their best for the players......not to pick and choose who no longer gets to benefit.

Should his lawyers quit?

 

[BSR]

Everyone gets it.....you hate the guy.......but.........

There's nothing unethical about this.

It is called due process.......you sound clueless as to how things actually work.

Does a guy like that deserve the backing? Probably not.....but it is the purpose of the union to make sure the stipulations of the CBA are followed to the benefit of all their members.

In our culture, he is entitled to that representation. Just the way it is and you can't do anything about it

You have totally missed my point. I don't hate the guy at all. I feel nothing towards him at this time and my point as little to do with him other than his circumstances.

As for it being a matter of due process I don't see how one has anything to do with the other. On the one hand we have a murder case that still needs to be tried. On the other we have an association of NFL players that has the right to expel members and I am raising the question as to why it shouldn't expel this particular member.

Many here are acting like the players association should be ambivalent to the activities of its membership. Why? Its an association of football players. The comparisons to the obligations of lawyers and public defenders are faulty. The NFLPA isn't protecting the players constitutional rights, they are simply there to negotiate a CBA and see to its enforcement for its membership. That membership shouldn't be something automatic it should have stipulations like almost organizations do.

The NFL has a major issue right now with the illicit activities of its players. After years of the NFL trying clean it up there were a ridiculous number of arrests this past off season. The NFLPA's reaction to these arrests? Nothing. Their reaction to Hernandez's murder? Nothing. Sorry, but I don't think its acceptable. With Hernandez's actions being the most grievous you would have thought that it would have garnered some sort of reaction from the NFLPA, but it didn't. Granted I can understand that the answer may not be to expel him immediately but there should be something. Is he on probation? Is his membership in jeopardy in any way? If Hernandez doesn't earn ejection from the union then what does? At some point the NFLPA as an association of players has to look at themselves and ask what more they can do. Right now everyone is giving them a free pass.