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Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by mayoclinic, Oct 25, 2012.

  1. Avenger

    Avenger Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    #11 Jersey

    Hightower is going to end up being one of the best LBs in the NFL, IF McCourty stays at safety a McCourty/Wilson combo looks like it will be really good, with Ebner being the 3rd safety off the bench once he develops. Jelani Jenkins from Florida would be a good rotational piece in the LB corps where we have coverage needs, which would allow us to take Spikes out and slide Hightower or Mayo into the middle and put Jenkins into coverage.
     
  2. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    There are a lot of interesting LBs in the 230-235# range with coverage ability coming out or eligible for 2013, should BB be inclined to finally go that way:

    - Alec Ogletree*, Georgia. Great range, playmaker, converted safety. Top 30-40 pick.
    - Jonathan Brown, Illinois
    - Arthur Brown, Kansas
    - Jelani Jenkins, Florida
    - Alonzo Highsmith, Arkansas - injured, could be day 3 bargain value sleeper
     
  3. patsfaninpa

    patsfaninpa In the Starting Line-Up

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    Sure, try to plug the holes. But, I'm wondering if Belichick is just spread too thin. Coaching, contracts, drafting, trades. I'm assuming we're a 4-3 team for good. We need a dt, de, olb and at least one safety. We have 3 linebackers whom are probably best suited to be mlb's. I just can't wrap my head around that one. I'm inclined to go after a dt or safety first. There is some younger talent at de; Cunningham, Bequette and Francis to compete at LDE. I don't even discount Hightower ending up there. If he's 270, that's too big for lb. He can't run his combine 4.68 now. I'd love to see a forty between him and Spikes. Would be a lot closer than the Spikes haters would like to admit. Hightower at LDE might make a nice hybrid for a 4-3/3-4 mix. He can do both. I don't know what to make of the mess in the secondary. Talib will probably walk. Right back where we started. Right now I'd probably go with Matt Elam and an OLB. Arthur Brown or Khasem Greene. If a good dl prospect available in the second, you take him of course. I'd consider Gerald Hodges in the third then. Defense, defense, defense. Speed, speed, speed. When I see a lot of you guys mocking us Jon Cooper, I start turning greyer and greyer. A rg helps this team about as much as a better long-snapper.
     
  4. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If the Pats wanted to move Hightower up to LDE as a hybrid and then draft a guy like Alec Ogletree, that would be an interesting approach. I'd have to give that some thought.
     
  5. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #24 Jersey

    One of the reasons I liked Hightower last year was because of his ability to rush the QB although I was thinking more as a blitzer. He does have a very good bull rush.
     
  6. captain stone

    captain stone Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    No Jersey Selected

    A couple of months ago, I read an article about diet & training regimens as the Combine approaches.
    Some players, especially the bigger O/D-Linemen & LBs, drop weight and practice 40-yard dashes;
    as soon as the Combine/ProDay/private workouts are concluded, they revert to their previous,
    heavier weight. The first guy of whom I thought was Hightower. He ran a bit better than expected,
    but now does not look as light or nearly as fast as he did then. He doesn't even look as good as he did
    before his hamstring injury, when he chased down Fitz from behind during the first Buffalo game.
    Too bad; he started to show signs of being a play-maker before making that play.
    Reminds me of Myron Pryor v Minnesota in 2010, or Mike Wright @ PitsDirt later that season.

    I was on board the Hightower pick (especially after DeCastro was taken 1 pick earlier), but I expected
    much more from him that I've seen thus far. Bill might as well blitz him (& Spikes) more often,
    because he's too slow to cover anyone right now.
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2012
  7. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I have to say, much as I'm intrigued by Ansah, if the Pats could somehow figure out a way to land Sheldon Richardson + Alec Ogletree I think they would have all the bases covered for their front 7. At 6'4" 295# Richardson is athletic enough to play outside as a big 4-3 LDE or 3-4 DE, or inside as a pass rushing DT, with Ninkovich, Cunningham, Bequette or Hightower moving up on the edge. And Ogletree has the range and athleticism at LB to complement our other guys. But I expect it would be difficult to land either one of those 2 guys if they come out, much less both of them.
     
  8. Avenger

    Avenger Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job

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    #11 Jersey

    It kind of seams like our defense is more of a 2-5-4 with the OLBs on the line as DEs with the linebackers being all inside guys.
     
  9. jsull87

    jsull87 In the Starting Line-Up

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    I really do agree with the margins between good and great being so small especially on D. If this offseason we chose Bryant over Fenene i think this front 7 would be really very very good. Add in someone like gholdson at saftey and i really think we'd have a case for a top D
     
  10. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #24 Jersey

    Well you know what I think about BB and smaller DY's/LBers, so I won't labour the point.

    I do see it as being possible to get both Richardson and Ogletree to play along, although I think Richardson would be the harder get as he'll go before we pick. But Ogletree does have character concerns, he's not a great 3-4 guy and there are a bunch of fast good coverage LBers in this draft so I could definitely see him falling to the late second. Lavonte David, after all, was picked #58.
     
  11. jsull87

    jsull87 In the Starting Line-Up

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    What are you talking about?

    I dont get people on this board sometimes... you say you were high on him and say he looked like a playmaker and faster at the beginning of the season. Then say now that you think he looks slow and you expected more...

    The reason he looks slower than that start of the season you mention in your very post... he hurt his hamstring you mention this in your own post.

    The hype on Hightower was how well he could cover backs and TE's for a guy his size. Don't judge him on his play slowly coming back after injury.

    Look Hightower in my opinion had one of his poorer games against Buffalo i think all the LB's didn't have their finest games sans another big play from Spikes. But lets give the guy some time to let his hamstring ( a notoriously slow healing injury) heal.
     
  12. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'd be thrilled to get Ogletree in the 2nd. But if I were the Bears or Ravens looking for a long term successor to Urlachor or Lewis, I'd grab the kid in the late 1st.
     
  13. ForThoseAboutToRock

    ForThoseAboutToRock Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    #50 Jersey

    When you guys are looking at DE/DT prospects for the Patriots, are you translating their skills to a 2-gap style? Do many DE/DT prospects in college play a 2-gap technique?

    Now that I'm curious, what have we seen this year from Ninko and Jones? Are they ever 2-gapping, or are they situationally swapping between 1 and 2 gap technique? When Cunningham comes in as a 3rd down rushing DT, is he primarily playing a single gap?

    I recall seeing Ansah play earlier this year and remember thinking "wow, bet at least a few of the guys on the patsfans draft board are all about this guy." It often seems to me that there is a D lineman each year who starts being hyped in the mid-late 1st round, and through hype, workouts, etc. ends up being taken mid 1st. I recall JJ Watt being somewhat like this. Chandler Jones sorta the same thing. Here's hoping Ansah lasts to when the Patriots pick!
     
  14. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    Amen, brother! That he plays all over the D-line makes him even more attractive for me, he's going to be a special one.
     
  15. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #3 Jersey

    The problem is not that BB hasn't been able to find good ones late (Wright, Pryor)—it's that they haven't been able to stay healthy.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  16. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #24 Jersey

    Saw him drop in to coverage against Idaho. looked smooth and quick doing so. Perhaps we could play him at LB!!
     
  17. ForThoseAboutToRock

    ForThoseAboutToRock Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    #50 Jersey

    Ezekiel Ansah vs Notre Dame 2012 - YouTube

    BYU @ Notre Dame

    Showing his versatility:

    0:46 - lines up as NT in 3 man line - takes on a double team, not a lot of penetration

    Next play - lines up as 3/4 DE, first attempts to set the edge, but the play runs behind him, and he quickly recovers and takes the back down for minimal gain.

    Next play he's sort of lined up as 3/4 DE (face to face with the R Tackle)- but he's standing up and there is no WOLB on his side. One of the linebackers blitzes directly at the RT, drawing the attention of both the RT and RG. Ansah momentarily looks to be planning to run around the tackle towards the QB, but then either by plan or by diagnosis -sprints around both blockers to the inside (A gap) and tackles the runner.


    Kinda crazy to see plays like these back to back to back. NT on one play, then showing some nice footwork and speed both inside of the tackle box and stretching towards the sideline.

    For the rest of the video, you get to see him lining up at the LDE spot, often facing double teams or having the play run away from him. There is a goal-to-go stand in there (5:24) where they single team him on 3 consecutive runs and he pretty well blows up his blocker and forces the FG - looks like 2 gapping to me.
     
  18. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #24 Jersey



    New and better Ansah

    Ezekiel Ansah vs Washington State (2012) - YouTube
     
  19. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    My biggest worry is that he is going to go way too early in the 1st round, before we'll have a shot at him. I'm saying it now, on the record, he will be better than JPP.
     
  20. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #24 Jersey

    The only way he doesn't go top 15 I believe is he doesn't live up to expectations at the combine. I think, unless he looks terrible at the Senior Bowl, he'll get a pass due to his already factored in rawness and it'll only be shorter arms, poor vert etc at the combine that drops him.

    I'm just re-watching last years first round (still shocked by Pats trading up twice :eek: ) and teams really did go for athleticism.
     

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