Mike Giardi Tonight on ST: Re: Signing the "Big Three".

[fnordcircle]

Let me know if they sign somewhere else and then I'll start posting about how they're actually scrubs.

 

[BTTA]

A person who actually covers the Pats as a JOB has zero idea what players might think?

Pretty much, yes. Talking to the press about their contract situation is all risk and no reward for those guys, so they don't do it unless they have impulse control problems.

 

[Galeb]

Let me know if they sign somewhere else and then I'll start posting about how they're actually scrubs.

No worries. I won't be able to read those posts anyway because I have you on ignore.

 

[Rusty Griswold]

I think they can sign all 3. I don't see why not, especially with so many contracts off the books next year. They need to work on Hightower first and go from there. Collins next and then get Butler right after that.

Sucks that they probably won't be able to compete for Sheard, especially if they win another SB.

 

[Rusty Griswold]

One more time, just for the he'll of it. They only have to sign one of them. Butler is a restricted free agent, in 2017, he's not going anywhere. All they have to do is sign either Hightower or Collins, they can franchise the other. And they are going to have 70 million to work with.

The Patriots are in great shape, stop pulling the fire alarm.

I agree. BB Knows what he's doing. He'll quietly get Hightower done before the season (Julyish), Collins likely right as the season kicks off and they'll work on Butler after the season.

My lone fear is not being able to keep Sheard. They have McClellin in here as leverage on that and on Nink, for that matter, but they'll play the Nink thing by ear. He's not going to want to leave. Heck, a 1 year extension for him right now might make a lot of sense.

 

[Ivan]

I think Sheard, Collins, and Ryan will be the most difficult to re sign. Hightower won't be easy but I think he's the new captain of their defense and they will get it done. I don't worry about Ninkovich at all, like Amendola he just wants to win and will be easy to re sign. I'm also not worried about Butler because they have all the leverage and can keep him through 2018 just by using the RFA and franchise tags. He will be 29 by the time he actually can go into free agency and they will be BC able to sign him before that happens. It's a long list but they will get it done.

 

[JarOfMayo51]

I wouldn't be shocked to see a McCourty trade at some point, which could lead to signing all 3. I like McCourty and am not advocating trading him, but it would fit BB's MO. Every player I can think of that BB has signed for absolute top of the market money weren't on the team for duration of the contract. Mankins and Seymour were traded and the Pats declined Wilfork's option. If the Pats keep McCourty, I can't see them signing all 3.

Mccourty is still on his prime though, but they better not let Harmon walk if this is a strategy they go with or we'll be back to desperately looking for a FS as teams are bombing deep on us every week

It'd a passing league so I don't see them getting rid of McCourty just for that reason. . There are only like 6 or so good free safeties on the nfl and we have one of them at a prime age

 

[Froob]

I think Sheard, Collins, and Ryan will be the most difficult to re sign. Hightower won't be easy but I think he's the new captain of their defense and they will get it done. I don't worry about Ninkovich at all, like Amendola he just wants to win and will be easy to re sign. I'm also not worried about Butler because they have all the leverage and can keep him through 2018 just by using the RFA and franchise tags. He will be 29 by the time he actually can go into free agency and they will be BC able to sign him before that happens. It's a long list but they will get it done.

I think Ryan is gone for sure. We have too much depth up and coming to afford the big 3 + Ryan. I think Butler is going to be reasonable, he just seems like a kid grateful to be here and not the "feed my family" type of guy not that there's anything wrong with wanting your fair pay either.

 

[BobDigital]

Luke Kuechly signed a 5 year 62 Million dollar deal (so 12.4M per year) The Pats have about 70M in cap space. Hightower/Collins are going to get similar to that but a little less cause frankly Kuechly is a little better than both.

Josh Norman is making 15M a year and Revis/Peterson/Sherman make 14M Butler should get about that but maybe a tad less.

So lets say per year

Hightower 11.5M
Collins 11.5M
Butler 13M
Sheard (he is not one of the absolute top at his position but lets call him about 8M)

That is 44M so call it 45 just cause.

If you do these contracts long term and the cap keeps going up they are very doable.

 

[Ivan]

Luke Kuechly signed a 5 year 62 Million dollar deal (so 12.4M per year) The Pats have about 70M in cap space. Hightower/Collins are going to get similar to that but a little less cause frankly Kuechly is a little better than both.

Josh Norman is making 15M a year and Revis/Peterson/Sherman make 14M Butler should get about that but maybe a tad less.

So lets say per year

Hightower 11.5M
Collins 11.5M
Butler 13M
Sheard (he is not one of the absolute top at his position but lets call him about 8M)

That is 44M so call it 45 just cause.

If you do these contracts long term and the cap keeps going up they are very doable.

Disagree on Butler unless you are talking about 2019. He's an RFA and has not established himself as elite. Here's a really good player but he's not getting that kind of money until after 2017 when they would have to tag him.

 

[Galeb]

Mccourty is still on his prime though, but they better not let Harmon walk if this is a strategy they go with or we'll be back to desperately looking for a FS as teams are bombing deep on us every week

It'd a passing league so I don't see them getting rid of McCourty just for that reason. . There are only like 6 or so good free safeties on the nfl and we have one of them at a prime age

I don't think they'd move McCourty without an adequate replacement which means certainly not this year. After looking at the link @patsbrazilpatriots posted, they wouldn't likely move him till 2018 at least. Either way, I'm neither advocating a trade of McCourty nor saying it is likely, just that I wouldn't be shocked.

It can easily be argued that both Wilfork and Mankins had lost a step by the time they were moved. BB wasn't keeping Seymour in on 3rd and long when he traded him, so he likely thought Seymour was declining as well. If McCourty keeps playing at a high level, he'll likely see the end of his contract, but if his play declines significantly, I suspect they'll move him after 2018.

The main point was, that if McCourty stays on the roster, it's unlikely that BB will extend 3 guys on defense with top tier contracts.

 

[fnordcircle]

No worries. I won't be able to read those posts anyway because I have you on ignore.

WHAT THE ****?! But why?! T_T ;_;

 

[Simple Jack's Brother]

Disagree on Butler unless you are talking about 2019. He's an RFA and has not established himself as elite. Here's a really good player but he's not getting that kind of money until after 2017 when they would have to tag him.

Even if Butler won't get that kind of money, and i agree, he's not at that level yet, it demonstrates that the pats should be able to pay all 3 and still have money leftover to spend on the rest of the roster.

 

[Deus Irae]

Really. Huh. We have people around here (including myself) throw BS against the wall and people respond/agree/critique.

A person who actually covers the Pats as a JOB has zero idea what players might think? This isn't a soley Pats decision is it? A good sense of trends etc?

Nice to see people who have work connections to form their opinions are obviously useless compared the to the geniuses and well connected individuals on this forum, right?

Outside of breaking news, what areas of Patriots coverage are there where Patsfans.com doesn't have people who are better options to read than the reporters?

Two easy examples:

Salary cap - Miguel
Film breakdown - Unoriginal (not around nearly enough anymore)

 

[hornetfb85]

 

[BobDigital]

Disagree on Butler unless you are talking about 2019. He's an RFA and has not established himself as elite. Here's a really good player but he's not getting that kind of money until after 2017 when they would have to tag him.

Assuming his play keeps up i think that is what he is worth. Last year he was overall one of the top 10 CBs in the NFL. If he does that again this year then that is what he will be paid. Now they don't have to pay him next year if they don't want to and can keep him for relatively cheap but 13M is what he will make give or take unless he takes a discount IMO.

Here is a list of the top paid CBs. You can tell me what you think he is worth

Cornerback Contracts and Salaries | Over The Cap

The I can only think of 5 or 6 CBs I would want over Butler last year so he should probably be one of the 6 or 7 highest paid overall.

 

[Ivan]

Assuming his play keeps up i think that is what he is worth. Last year he was overall one of the top 10 CBs in the NFL. If he does that again this year then that is what he will be paid. Now they don't have to pay him next year if they don't want to and can keep him for relatively cheap but 13M is what he will make give or take unless he takes a discount IMO.

Here is a list of the top paid CBs. You can tell me what you think he is worth

Cornerback Contracts and Salaries | Over The Cap

The I can only think of 5 or 6 CBs I would want over Butler last year so he should probably be one of the 6 or 7 highest paid overall.

I don't think the Patriots will ever you're him 13 million unless it's a franchise tag after 2017. Imo they may offer him 32/4 after this season and if he doesn't want it he will have to 2 more years to hit free agency. Belichick doesn't like to pay players early but he does make exceptions, we will see if Butler becomes one of them?

 

[zimmy]

Kraft said we let Revis go so we could sign these guys. Then we traded Jones so we could sign these guys.

Now we still can't sign them?

They are the three best players on the D. We should be able to fit a couple of $10m deals under the cap.

Butler has no leverage at all. We have him more or less under contract for 2 more years for about $4m total. If he wants to get paid now he's gonna have to accept a discount. As an undrafted rookie he should jump at any guaranteed money we throw at him. The NFL can change quickly….

Sign one of High/Collins and tag the other next year.

 

[Ivan]

Kraft said we let Revis go so we could sign these guys. Then we traded Jones so we could sign these guys.

Now we still can't sign them?

They are the three best players on the D. We should be able to fit a couple of $10m deals under the cap.

Butler has no leverage at all. We have him more or less under contract for 2 more years for about $4m total. If he wants to get paid now he's gonna have to accept a discount. As an undrafted rookie he should jump at any guaranteed money we throw at him. The NFL can change quickly….

Sign one of High/Collins and tag the other next year.

I think Kraft meant it the problem is that teams like the Jags and Giants blew up free agency with idiotic deals like the Malik Jackson and Vernon deals. Even Marvin Jones got payed big money and he's a 2WR.

If the LBs want 50-60 for 5-6 they will get them done, if they want 80-90 they won't, and I don't blame them.

 

[mgteich]

One more time, just for the he'll of it. They only have to sign one of them. Butler is a restricted free agent, in 2017, he's not going anywhere. All they have to do is sign either Hightower or Collins, they can franchise the other. And they are going to have 70 million to work with.

The Patriots are in great shape, stop pulling the fire alarm.

OK. So
Collins franchised at $14.5M
Hightower signed for $10M
Butler matched at $10M

I guess this works for some folks.