Deaderick and Weston: thow-away picks? Probably not

[BelichickFan]

If they wanted Mesko, which they ostensibly did, taking him at that spot was the only choice.

Clearly. I just didn't like the pick in a deep draft, he seem like he has a humongous upside but a lot lower floor than most punters taken that high. I've wanted a top punter for a long time and he'd better be a top ten punter within a year or two to warrant such a high pick.

 

[patfanken]

I wouldn't have objected if Sapp were chosen at 113, either, esp. after Bill blew the Kindle opportunity by choosing Gronk at 42 instead. There is no way I would've taken 2 TEs within our first 6 picks; the choice within those first 6 picks should've been either Gronk or Hernandez, not both. There was plenty of time & picks to grab another TE later in the draft.

I wouldn't have been upset if we had taken Kindle instead of McCourty, but in retrospect, I think it was the right move. A CB of McCourty's caliber will have a much bigger IMMEDIATE mpact on the Pats D than an OLB project, regardless of the talent, is going to take time to make an impact.

Also I think you missed on the importance of getting BOTH the TEs, though I doubt BB thought he'd have the opportunity. I am among those who think that BB has decided to rework the offense philosophy this season. I think teams have started to catch up with the spread offense that has worked so well for the past 3 years. I think Gronk and Crumpler gives us the best opportunity in years to line up with 2 TEs, BOTH who are good blockers, and BOTH who have receiving skills.

2 TEs, 2 WRs and a RB is a very difficult formation to defend. Its balanced. As the DC, you really can't afford to go to a nickel or dime package. The mismatches would be 2 big, so you have to keep all your LBs in. Because the formation is balanced you can't overload one side. Any motion by a TE or WR would immediately tip of the coverage.

Here's were the drafting of Hernandez comes in to the picture. He, like Dallas Clark is a great mismatch if he lined up on a LB in athleticism, and he can out muscle a DB. He gives us a very real, but different kind of threat in the slot. Besides being a great blocking threat.

The TE had disappeared over the last few years. It can be argued that the fault was in the system, or the fault was in the TEs, but the fact remains, the TE was effectively written out of the offense. THIS will change and the unlikely opportunity to get Hernandez in the 4th made it possible.

BTW- it is my impression that there will be better impact pass rushing prospects in next year's draft than were available when the Pats were going to draft THIS year. Better that we got the secondary solidified (and I think its going to be a great one) over the last 2 years, and grab that special pass rusher next year. And who is to say that Cunningham won't be as good a prospect as Kindle. They have very similar numbers, and Cunningham doesn't come with the injury risk

 

[the wrothbroughterer]

I wouldn't have been upset if we had taken Kindle instead of McCourty, but in retrospect, I think it was the right move. A CB of McCourty's caliber will have a much bigger IMMEDIATE mpact on the Pats D than an OLB project, regardless of the talent, is going to take time to make an impact.

Also I think you missed on the importance of getting BOTH the TEs, though I doubt BB thought he'd have the opportunity. I am among those who think that BB has decided to rework the offense philosophy this season. I think teams have started to catch up with the spread offense that has worked so well for the past 3 years. I think Gronk and Crumpler gives us the best opportunity in years to line up with 2 TEs, BOTH who are good blockers, and BOTH who have receiving skills.

2 TEs, 2 WRs and a RB is a very difficult formation to defend. Its balanced. As the DC, you really can't afford to go to a nickel or dime package. The mismatches would be 2 big, so you have to keep all your LBs in. Because the formation is balanced you can't overload one side. Any motion by a TE or WR would immediately tip of the coverage.

Here's were the drafting of Hernandez comes in to the picture. He, like Dallas Clark is a great mismatch if he lined up on a LB in athleticism, and he can out muscle a DB. He gives us a very real, but different kind of threat in the slot. Besides being a great blocking threat.

The TE had disappeared over the last few years. It can be argued that the fault was in the system, or the fault was in the TEs, but the fact remains, the TE was effectively written out of the offense. THIS will change and the unlikely opportunity to get Hernandez in the 4th made it possible.

BTW- it is my impression that there will be better impact pass rushing prospects in next year's draft than were available when the Pats were going to draft THIS year. Better that we got the secondary solidified (and I think its going to be a great one) over the last 2 years, and grab that special pass rusher next year. And who is to say that Cunningham won't be as good a prospect as Kindle. They have very similar numbers, and Cunningham doesn't come with the injury risk

There really are a lot. It's tough to say how many there will be but if you look at just the number of DEs and OLBs who measure at 6'3"+ and 240lbs+ there are a lot of prospects for 34OLB. Whether or not those guys can run in the 4.40-4.70 in the 40 with good short shuttle times remains to be seen. CBS has a pretty good draft database that I've been using, but I don't think that the 40 times and they have listed are accurate.

 

[BritPat]

Wroth, check out NFL Draft Scout instead. Best Draft site out there.

 

[captain stone]

I wouldn't have been upset if we had taken Kindle instead of McCourty, but in retrospect, I think it was the right move. A CB of McCourty's caliber will have a much bigger IMMEDIATE mpact on the Pats D than an OLB project, regardless of the talent, is going to take time to make an impact.

I may not have made myself clear enough in my earlier post, but I also would not have chosen Kindle at 22. Bill made the right move by choosing a CB instead. Btwn McCourty & Kyle Wilson, I would've leaned toward Wilson because of his superior punt return abilities, though I do like McCourty's physicality better than Wilson's.

I also agree w/ your take on the multiple possibilities at TE; I just wish that Bill could've drafted another pass-rusher with all of those picks.

 

[Criptonite]

That and picking Cunningham (rated by most public draft experts as a 4th round pick) early are two quibbles -- but who would guessed how Brace and Vollmer would turn out (a miss and a hit).

I had a lot of interest in Cunningham pre-draft as a potential fit for us as a rush OLB, so maybe I can offer a little insight. I was watching him closely because he was said to be just under 6'4" and could supposedly run a 40 in the 4.6s at 270lbs. There was only a few guys in the draft that fit that bill and most were idiots off the field. Cunningham was actually coming into the draft very underrated. A minor shoulder surgery forced him to miss the senior bowl practices and the game. Then he missed the combine and the Florida pro day. So scouts were not getting the benefit of all those extremely important events. Like you said, many experts had him rated as a 4th rounder. I think that was very much based on the unknown. It's hard to invest a top draft pick in a guy like that. The first workout he had was only 2 weeks before the draft. And there he got injured again, pulling his quad. That caused his nearly 5 second 40 time. But in that 40, he ran an amazing 10 yard split time of 1.57 seconds. He also had a great broad jump and vertical, which showcased his athleticism. Most importantly, he was said to have been phenomenal in all the drills at DE and at OLB.

So by the time Cunningham was able to show scouts what he could do, the draft was right around the corner. In that last week or so, the draft experts who were still updating their sites began to push him up their boards into the 2nd round. IMO, the Cunningham selection wasn't a reach at all. It was just that he was late to join the party. He and Sapp were the only players in the draft who I felt had the size, speed, skills and intelligence to be a fit in our D. Hopefully he works out. But if not, I think there will be many more options in the next draft.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Wroth, check out NFL Draft Scout instead. Best Draft site out there.

Just wanted to point out that CBS Sports and NFL Draft Scout are run by the same service and therefore share numbers and rankings.

 

[BritPat]

Just wanted to point out that CBS Sports and NFL Draft Scout are run by the same service and therefore share numbers and rankings.

They do, but there's much more detail and info on NFL Draft Scout

 

[patchick]

They do, but there's much more detail and info on NFL Draft Scout

Can you make NFLDraftScout work these days? It seems basically dead to me.

 

[AzPatsFan]

I had a lot of interest in Cunningham pre-draft as a potential fit for us as a rush OLB, so maybe I can offer a little insight. I was watching him closely because he was said to be just under 6'4" and could supposedly run a 40 in the 4.6s at 270lbs. There was only a few guys in the draft that fit that bill and most were idiots off the field. Cunningham was actually coming into the draft very underrated. A minor shoulder surgery forced him to miss the senior bowl practices and the game. Then he missed the combine and the Florida pro day. So scouts were not getting the benefit of all those extremely important events. Like you said, many experts had him rated as a 4th rounder. I think that was very much based on the unknown. It's hard to invest a top draft pick in a guy like that. The first workout he had was only 2 weeks before the draft. And there he got injured again, pulling his quad. That caused his nearly 5 second 40 time. But in that 40, he ran an amazing 10 yard split time of 1.57 seconds. He also had a great broad jump and vertical, which showcased his athleticism. Most importantly, he was said to have been phenomenal in all the drills at DE and at OLB.

So by the time Cunningham was able to show scouts what he could do, the draft was right around the corner. In that last week or so, the draft experts who were still updating their sites began to push him up their boards into the 2nd round. IMO, the Cunningham selection wasn't a reach at all. It was just that he was late to join the party. He and Sapp were the only players in the draft who I felt had the size, speed, skills and intelligence to be a fit in our D. Hopefully he works out. But if not, I think there will be many more options in the next draft.

Interesting. That is what I felt too. The Patriots were obvious interested in Sapp too, and spent several hours in an exhaustive interview with him just pror to the Draft. Whatever happened, I guess they decided he didn't fit.

As regards Crabel two years ago, he was also almost 6-5, had played DE and some OLB, and had run in the high 4.5s But he was light, and they must have felt he needed to "beef up".

 

[patchick]

I just thought I'd circle back to this thread, since I hadn't seen 7th-round picks draw this much ire since Matt Cassel. Eight players were named in the thread as worthier alternatives to Deaderick, Weston & Robinson:

Blair White, Scott Long, Chris McGaha, Seyi Ajirotutu, Lonyae Miller, AJ Jefferson, Tim Hiller, Andre Dixon

The good news for fans of the above is that 7 of the 8 are now available. Only Jefferson currently has a job.

So I think the Pats earn a thumbs up for coming away with Deaderick -- not to mention Dane Fletcher, who was waved away as irrelevant in this thread, too.

 

[Criptonite]

I just thought I'd circle back to this thread, since I hadn't seen 7th-round picks draw this much ire since Matt Cassel. Eight players were named in the thread as worthier alternatives to Deaderick, Weston & Robinson:

Blair White, Scott Long, Chris McGaha, Seyi Ajirotutu, Lonyae Miller, AJ Jefferson, Tim Hiller, Andre Dixon

The good news for fans of the above is that 7 of the 8 are now available. Only Jefferson currently has a job.

So I think the Pats earn a thumbs up for coming away with Deaderick -- not to mention Dane Fletcher, who was waved away as irrelevant in this thread, too.

I guess I can chime in since I was behind the Deaderick, Robinson and Weston picks and a big fan of the Fletcher pickup . I'm glad to see we are going forward with Deaderick. I wouldn't be surprised to see him with significant playing time late in the season. I'm glad we'll get to keep Weston another season. He seemed to fall way behind early due to his issue with his working papers. Robinson did just what we needed him to do. We'll see what the staff really thinks of him if he's brought back to the PS in the coming days. We're not using Fletcher how I thought, but the team likes what they see. I'm still thrilled with that pick up as I viewed him as the top UDFA once the draft concluded. I wasn't a fan of the Welch pick, but I didn't mind taking on a project since we were seemingly deep at tackle at that time. The Larsen pick is still a poor choice IMO. With the Mankins situation looming, I didn't get going for a project guard/center. I would have much preferred a guy like Jeff Byers who didn't have as high upside, but was more polished and gameready. I believe I heard Byers got cut too. Still, it would have been nice to have had him in camp to compete with Ojinnaka and Wendell for those backup spots.

 

[BritPat]

Ajirotutu, Long, Hiller and White should all be contacted.

 

[Snake Eyes]

Ajirotutu, Long, Hiller and White should all be contacted.

I don't know much about the others but I definitely agree on Hiller.

 

[Off The Grid]

I'm high on BOTH of these Cats.

My Write Up on Kade Weston, Pre-Draft:

At 6’5” + 325 pounds, Kade Weston has NO business BLASTING a 4.99 40, but that’s exactly what he DID!! And at that same Pro Day, his work on the D Line Drills was so exemplary that it drew applause.

He needs a lot of work on his technique, but he has a TERRIFYING blend of Size, Strength, and Speed, and if he is properly coached ~ where better than New England? ~ he could become a PULVERIZING weapon as a blasting Tackle and as an OVERWHELMING Edge Rusher: Jarvis Green on ROIDS!!

And Deadrick is a GREAT story: Getting out to practice just 3 days after being shot by a criminal says it ALL: The man is DEDICATED to his mates, and that IS the Patriot Way!!

I still say we need an Alpha Right End...But we have GREAT Depth on the D Line, now, and that's a VERY good step in the right direction.

Two questions:

Do you feel that Weston is stout enough at the POA to become an effective backup NT for Wilfork?

And do you feel that Deaderick is athletic enough to effectively slide across the LOS as a 3-4 DE?

My apologies, Brother Stone: I don't know how I missed this.

My LONG-belated answers:

Weston: NO, frankly. I see him as more of a Swing End/Situational Tackle Jarvis Green type, as was my earlier impression.

Deaderick: ABSOLUTELY!! In fact, I see him as solid starting Right End, potentially, and think he might make a big impact by the end of the year.

 

[Off The Grid]

Ajirotutu, Long, Hiller and White should all be contacted.

Concur on ALL counts!!

And Andre Dixon, too!!

 

[Snake Eyes]

Apparently we had Hiller over for a workout recently.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Apparently we had Hiller over for a workout recently.

Yup, Levi Brown too.

 

[Off The Grid]

Apparently we had Hiller over for a workout recently.

Oh, yeah?? Missed that.

Nice catch.

 

[PatsFanStnfrd]

Deadrick is a starter now, with a couple of good game performances under his belt. Good show lat Sunday. He is humble too judging from his interviews with Rappaport and Reiss.

Of the UDFA WRs mentioned above, Ajirotutu is a star in San Diego and Blair White might be on the field for the Colts this week.