Brady vs Ben?

[TIMEsteelersfan]

Rookie stats are a little misleading. They're nice and all but anyone can have a good/great year. I hate making baseball comparisons but look at Eric Hinske of the Red Sox. He was rookie of the year a few years back now he's a borderline major leaguer.

Ben's a good QB but still doesn't have the resume that Brady does. In a few more years, maybe but right now your top three QB's in the League are Brady, Manning and Farvre/Romo.

Rookie stats misleading? Anyone can have a good/great year? Ben blew away just about every rookie record there is, nobody has ever even been close to doing what he did. No way Romo is better than Ben, but I'll give you Favre... he is the man. Manning, Brady, Favre in no particular order, then Ben. Why is everyone on the Romo bandwagon? The guy has barely played 16 games, no way he's better than Ben.

 

[Deus Irae]

Rookie stats misleading? Anyone can have a good/great year? Ben blew away just about every rookie record there is, nobody has ever even been close to doing what he did. No way Romo is better than Ben, but I'll give you Favre... he is the man. Manning, Brady, Favre in no particular order, then Ben. Why is everyone on the Romo bandwagon? The guy has barely played 16 games, no way he's better than Ben.

Ok, you seem to have a cognitive dissonance issue here. If you're pimping Ben because of his rookie season, you have no 'right' denigrating Romo's first 16 games. It's simple common sense. And, through his first 16 games as an NFL starter, Romo's been a better quarterback than Ben.

 

[Wildo7]

Rookie stats misleading? Anyone can have a good/great year? Ben blew away just about every rookie record there is, nobody has ever even been close to doing what he did. No way Romo is better than Ben, but I'll give you Favre... he is the man. Manning, Brady, Favre in no particular order, then Ben. Why is everyone on the Romo bandwagon? The guy has barely played 16 games, no way he's better than Ben.

I remember thinking that Ben was way overrated his rookie year because it didn't seem that he did that much to ensure Steelers wins, but rather just handed the ball off to Bettis and never made stupid decisions. His numbers weren't that impressive and he never had any plays that you could say won games for them. And Brady's 2001 SB campaign, which I would say is more impressive than Ben's in terms of the responsibilities and plays he had to make. Plus that was basically Brady's rookie year also because he hadn't played at all the year before.

Now I think he's slightly underrated maybe because he was so terrible last year I think that people felt the bubble had burst. But you still don't know with him. He could be a major league choke artist. How could you not take the QB who has proven time and time again that he is the farthest thing from a choke artist you can get?

 

[oldskool138]

Rookie stats misleading? Anyone can have a good/great year?

Yes and yes. Rookie stats are not always a good barometer of future performance. In the NFL, if teams aren't familiar with a QB's cadence, playcalling and audibles because of the lack of film or scouting then the edge would go to the rookie QB.

Ben has a lot of raw talent and is still harnessing it. One day, he may reach Brady's (read: Hall of Fame) level. He (Ben) is a top 5 QB in the in League right now.

 

[TIMEsteelersfan]

You guys make some solid points... and no, I'm not "pimping" Ben based on Rookie stats alone. He's won a championship, he's won playoff games... Romo hasn't done either... in fact he's lost the only big game he was ever in.

It's way to early in Romo's career to compare him with Ben, and it's way too early in Ben's career to compare him with Brady.

 

[shmessy]

youngest to ever win a superbowl

......with a 10 QB rating.

 

[TIMEsteelersfan]

......with a 10 QB rating.

Sure, his rating sucked, but despite that he made some very key plays in the game that allowed us to win. Always remember that it's a passer rating, not a QB rating. There's more to playing QB than just throwing the ball. Though that doesn't excuse his terrible passing numbers in that game.

 

[cartmen]

i love how they say he cant handle pressure and say Ben handles it like a man!!! Brady is known for having the best pocket pressence since Marino! He sees the field as well as Manning and throws the ball as accurate as Aikmen. Ben is a very good QB and will go down as the best QB from that draft by alot but come on please dont put him up there with Brady and Peytondont be that dumb Steelers fans. On a side note I play Paintball with Frank the Tank on that forum so I wasn't shocked to see his dumb comments but the rest blew me away

 

[Wildo7]

It's way to early in Romo's career to compare him with Ben, and it's way too early in Ben's career to compare him with Brady.

Except that wasn't the question. The question wasn't who is more accomplished it was all things being equal, who you'd rather have start. Brady has made plays that I don't think Ben is capable of and shows more skills that I think are more vital to a QB, namely precision passing and clutch playmaking ability to "take over a game". Mobility is way overrated in the QB position (see Michael Vick) and Brady's mobility may not be as great as Ben's but he exhibits a greater elusiveness and pocket presence while still being able to make a play. Romo seems to me, to show similar skillsets to Ben though, to be honest, I've seen Romo make some better plays and seems to be able to "take over the game" as opposed to BR managing the game and playing well enough to not lose it for them. So I'm sorry, but from what I've seen skill-wise, I'd take Romo over Ben at this point.

 

[abejarano12]

I work with a few Steeler fans and they really believe Ben is better than Brady! Hey, I really like Roethlisberger, I do, but even he knows he is not in Brady's league!!!!

I agree. Ben is good but he is not Tom Brady. Everyone says that Brady might be the best ever, even better than Montana when people say that you know that your doing something right.

 

[TIMEsteelersfan]

Except that wasn't the question. The question wasn't who is more accomplished it was all things being equal, who you'd rather have start. Brady has made plays that I don't think Ben is capable of and shows more skills that I think are more vital to a QB, namely precision passing and clutch playmaking ability to "take over a game". Mobility is way overrated in the QB position (see Michael Vick) and Brady's mobility may not be as great as Ben's but he exhibits a greater elusiveness and pocket presence while still being able to make a play. Romo seems to me, to show similar skillsets to Ben though, to be honest, I've seen Romo make some better plays and seems to be able to "take over the game" as opposed to BR managing the game and playing well enough to not lose it for them. So I'm sorry, but from what I've seen skill-wise, I'd take Romo over Ben at this point.

No, No, No, No. Mobility is not over rated... scrambling is over rated. Mobility just means you can move inside the pocket and outside the pocket to buy time for something to open up. Scramblers are escaping pressure with a run first mentality, mobile QB are always looking downfield while they're moving... very valuable and certainly not over rated skill.

Secondly, you're opinion of Ben playing well enough to not lose would have been great a few years ago... that's not him anymore. He's carried this team a lot during the games we couldn't run the ball in. Look at the numbers, there's been a number of games we couldn't run the ball and Ben has carried us to victory. That notion is outdated. Romo has the better o-line by a ton too, Ben is running for his life 2 out of 3 times he drops back. Put Romo behind our line and he's medoicre.

If I'm starting a franchise tomorrow and have to choose between Romo and Ben, I take Ben all day... it's a no brainer.

Sorry to get side tracked though, this was a Brady/Ben thread... my bad.

 

[Wildo7]

No, No, No, No. Mobility is not over rated... scrambling is over rated. Mobility just means you can move inside the pocket and outside the pocket to buy time for something to open up. Scramblers are escaping pressure with a run first mentality, mobile QB are always looking downfield while they're moving... very valuable and certainly not over rated skill.

Secondly, you're opinion of Ben playing well enough to not lose would have been great a few years ago... that's not him anymore. He's carried this team a lot during the games we couldn't run the ball in. Look at the numbers, there's been a number of games we couldn't run the ball and Ben has carried us to victory. That notion is outdated. Romo has the better o-line by a ton too, Ben is running for his life 2 out of 3 times he drops back. Put Romo behind our line and he's medoicre.

If I'm starting a franchise tomorrow and have to choose between Romo and Ben, I take Ben all day... it's a no brainer.

Sorry to get side tracked though, this was a Brady/Ben thread... my bad.

Well then Brady has more mobility than Ben by that definition, because Brady has the footwork to maneuver inside the pocket and escape pressure while Ben will just run out to the sideline and throw it either out of bounds or to the WR down the line. I think this is one of the biggest misconceptions about the whole "mobility" argument.

 

[Wildo7]

"Yeah and if you get a couple good hits on him he starts throwing way off the mark or falls down like a little girl so he doesn't get hit any more."

This is a quote from that Steelers board. Have they ever watched him play. He's tough as nails. He gets absolutely hammered then pops right up and makes great plays. He doesn't "throw way off the mark" or "fall down like a little girl" are you serious? These people are just dumb saying sh!t like this. (not you TimeSteeler, you seem decent though)

And Romo v. Ben is really hard for me to say I guess, I honestly haven't seen enough of either one to be honest.

 

[TIMEsteelersfan]

Well then Brady has more mobility than Ben by that definition, because Brady has the footwork to maneuver inside the pocket and escape pressure while Ben will just run out to the sideline and throw it either out of bounds or to the WR down the line. I think this is one of the biggest misconceptions about the whole "mobility" argument.

Wow... I take nothing away from Brady, but you're a homer if you think Brady is more mobile than Ben. You're analysis of ben just now couldn't possibly be further from the truth... I don't see how anyway. Watch some footage guy, it's not even close. Brady's the better QB no doubt, but mobility is the one thing Ben absolutey does betterthan Brady and you can't even give him that? C'mon man... try to stop hating on the guy for a minute and see things for what they are.

 

[Buchanty]

Of course Pats fans are going to pick Brady and the Steelers fans Ben, its not just homerism however for it is based on the realization of how important both players are to their teams. In my mind these two epitomize the "team-oriented" quarterback more than any others in the league, and if we didn't have Tom, Ben would be my first choice of QB's. They are both brave and play with a fire that is hard to extinguish.

As far as value to the team it really is a matter of whether that team can cover the QB's weaknesses thereby maximizing his strengths. I think the Pats have made Tom one of the greatest at the position, and the Steelers are getting there with Ben but still have a long way to go. He has already proved to be the best QB in his draft (Rivers is a long distant second, and I dont expect Manning or Losman to be around much after their five year contracts are up in 2009).

I believe that Ben has another SB in him, but not sure he has two. He has size and strength on his side, but I do fear that his style, especially when running forward, will attract the heavier hits and possible concusions to which he is now prone.

 

[ALP]

wut a pointless pointless question...why is it pointless? easy, because THE ANSWER IS OBVIOUS

 

[bradmahn]

Wow... I take nothing away from Brady, but you're a homer if you think Brady is more mobile than Ben. You're analysis of ben just now couldn't possibly be further from the truth... I don't see how anyway. Watch some footage guy, it's not even close. Brady's the better QB no doubt, but mobility is the one thing Ben absolutey does betterthan Brady and you can't even give him that? C'mon man... try to stop hating on the guy for a minute and see things for what they are.

Brady moves around in the pocket better than anyone in the game. He doesn't have to run around it to be mobile, but he has great awareness and consistently buys time by sidestepping and shuffling in the pocket. Ben's faster and a better runner, but if you're strictly talking about moving in the pocket and keeping plays alive, it's Brady without a doubt. I've seen Ben shrug defenders off (which was pretty badass), but he's got nothing on Brady in this regard.

 

[Wildo7]

Wow... I take nothing away from Brady, but you're a homer if you think Brady is more mobile than Ben. You're analysis of ben just now couldn't possibly be further from the truth... I don't see how anyway. Watch some footage guy, it's not even close. Brady's the better QB no doubt, but mobility is the one thing Ben absolutey does betterthan Brady and you can't even give him that? C'mon man... try to stop hating on the guy for a minute and see things for what they are.

I said by your definition which is ability to elude being sacked. BR can scramble better than Brady.

 

[TIMEsteelersfan]

Brady moves around in the pocket better than anyone in the game. He doesn't have to run around it to be mobile, but he has great awareness and consistently buys time by sidestepping and shuffling in the pocket. Ben's faster and a better runner, but if you're strictly talking about moving in the pocket and keeping plays alive, it's Brady without a doubt. I've seen Ben shrug defenders off (which was pretty badass), but he's got nothing on Brady in this regard.

That's half of the mobilty deal... he may move better inside the pocket, but not much better than Ben. Where Ben is top notch inside and outside the pocket. No comparison on this issue.

 

[Joker]

Just stop you shameless hack...Ben Rothlisberger can't carry Brady's jock.

Nitwit