3-game review: offensive line

[RobertWeathers]

I do not think the o line is playing better than last year. I think they are more assignment sound than last year.

Thuney has been lights out incredible and having solder back is beyond huge.

Mason is a future all pro and karras our future center.

Cannon is still jag, but a better jag than last season.

What does that mean? Is the line playing better or not?

 

[pctronics0072]

Great post.

Solder is playing incredibly well however he allowed a couple of hits vs AZ. He should be on the list.

Thuney has also been very good.

I'm not sold on Shaq but hes been ok.

Andrews has been ok

Cannon...ugh. He hasn't been abysmal but.....it is what it is.

Solder did not play in az. He was inactive .

 

[Kontradiction]

So Marcus Cannon still essentially sucks. That's not news. Andrews has been flat out impressive, though, at center. He's really grown into the position. He was handling Wilfork one on one a lot the other night in pass protection. Even though Wilfork is not in his prime anymore, that is no small feat. It allowed the Pats to consistently double team Watt, effectively rendering him useless.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Solder did not play in az. He was inactive .

Ugh. That's right.

Well at least he didn't allow any sacks.

 

[goheels22002]

What does that mean? Is the line playing better or not?

No question in my mind that the O-Line is better this year under Scarnecchia. The guy that the main combatants in this thread failed to point out is how important Develin is in the blocking scheme. He led Blount on several rushes the other night, especially those going after JJ Watt. Watt was barely mentioned - two tackles.

Develin is so important, and when Brady gets back, he becomes a genuine wheel route option in short yardage.

 

[Haley]

There were a couple of nice GIFs in this NESN article.

Mostly I liked this one GIF because it showed not just JJ Watt getting shut down, as the article points out, but also Andrews handling Big Vince by himself:

 

[shmessy]

There were a couple of nice GIFs in this NESN article.

Mostly I liked this one GIF because it showed not just JJ Watt getting shut down, as the article points out, but also Andrews handling Big Vince by himself:

Isolate, focus and watch Cannon in that gif.

At the snap - he has to watch Watt, Simon and McKinney on his side - he knows Bennett is taking off on a pass route. He backs up, reads the rush correctly and then focuses like a laser beam on Watt.

Look at how far he goes to fight through a 4-player pick and where he finally escorts Watt into the turf.

That is GREAT work right there. He was on Watt like an anvil.

I don't have the gif, but also the block Mason laid on the Brissett TD is epic.

OL is not QB. Sometimes, people would do well to get their noses out of stat books and actually watch the action on the field.

Is Cannon perfect? Not at all.
Does he need to work on his consistency? Yes.
Is he talented and improving? Definitely.

 

[AtomicDawg]

I don't have the gif, but also the block Mason laid on the Brissett TD is epic.

Here ya go:

 

[zydecochris]

FWIW: I just watched a segment with Zoe and Chatham that basically gave Cannon two thumbs up.

Personally I felt that Cannon has played much better compared to last year and that is without Gronk.

More importantly this O line as a whole has played well. Running game and Protection have both improved over last year.

Btw: Zoe and Chat also attributed the O line improvement to the return of Devlin and Scar.

As you say Tony, I can't figure out how anyone could be anything but ecstatic about the play of the OL this year compared to last year. Let's compare: at LT Soldier is back and playing great (IMHO if he hadn't been injured last year the Pats would have a 5th ring); Thuney has stabilized the LG position and is a revelation; Andrews has made a second year jump and is bigger and stronger; Mason/Karras are at least stabilizing run blocking; and Cannon is IMHO clearly playing better than last year for whatever reason. They have played well against three of the best DL's in the NFL. What is not to like?

Moreover, and this is an important point, they have done well without Brady at QB. Beyond being the GOAT (which I think is now generally accepted) and still the best QB in the game (which I think is clear, some don't agree), I have always been of the mind that the best offensive lineman the Patriots have is Brady. That is, his ability to read the defense, make the calls, and get the ball out fast makes the OL look better than it is. However, the OL has looked really good with JimmyG and Brisket. Is the improvement 100% due to improvements in personnel and the return of Scar? Or, is having a QB who is a running threat a factor in this improvement also? It will be really, really interesting to see how the OL performs when Brady returns.

 

[mgteich]

So could you find me a team who happens to have a better 3 OT on the roster?

better than Solder, Cannon and Fleming?

 

[mgteich]

Cannon is playing fine, and will get better, especially when Gronk is back. Our OL is a very solid one, with Develin and blocking TE's to help.

 

[Deus Irae]

I just wanted to point out that Mason's been playing with that bum hand, so anything but the broadest evaluation of him is a waste of time.

 

[Tony2046]

As you say Tony, I can't figure out how anyone could be anything but ecstatic about the play of the OL this year compared to last year. Let's compare: at LT Soldier is back and playing great (IMHO if he hadn't been injured last year the Pats would have a 5th ring); Thuney has stabilized the LG position and is a revelation; Andrews has made a second year jump and is bigger and stronger; Mason/Karras are at least stabilizing run blocking; and Cannon is IMHO clearly playing better than last year for whatever reason. They have played well against three of the best DL's in the NFL. What is not to like?

Moreover, and this is an important point, they have done well without Brady at QB. Beyond being the GOAT (which I think is now generally accepted) and still the best QB in the game (which I think is clear, some don't agree), I have always been of the mind that the best offensive lineman the Patriots have is Brady. That is, his ability to read the defense, make the calls, and get the ball out fast makes the OL look better than it is. However, the OL has looked really good with JimmyG and Brisket. Is the improvement 100% due to improvements in personnel and the return of Scar? Or, is having a QB who is a running threat a factor in this improvement also? It will be really, really interesting to see how the OL performs when Brady returns.

I agree.

Bennett has been a real plus, imo, in the blocking scheme. He and Gronk along with Brady and his quick reads back on the field together is going to be something special.

 

[RobertWeathers]

No question in my mind that the O-Line is better this year under Scarnecchia. The guy that the main combatants in this thread failed to point out is how important Develin is in the blocking scheme. He led Blount on several rushes the other night, especially those going after JJ Watt. Watt was barely mentioned - two tackles.

Develin is so important, and when Brady gets back, he becomes a genuine wheel route option in short yardage.

Yep. The line is playing better and they aren't as predictable. They are more physical. With Develin in there and Blount as threats to run and can block the dline needs to think about the run and they face a second level of blockers.

 

[AtomicDawg]

Cannon is playing fine, and will get better, especially when Gronk is back. Our OL is a very solid one, with Develin and blocking TE's to help.

Au contraire...although not 100%....Gronk IS back, at least to his GOAT blocking self. For eg:

 

[BradyFTW!]

I just wanted to point out that Mason's been playing with that bum hand, so anything but the broadest evaluation of him is a waste of time.

Agreed, I spent a few hours last night and today looking at line play over the first 3 games, and I'm cautiously optimistic re: Mason. He's struggled a bit, but I think a lot of it can be attributed to effectively playing with one hand.

After doing that deep dive, I feel better about Thuney and Solder than I did before. Feel worse about Cannon than I did before, and I already wasn't high on him. Andrews has been steady overall - has a few negative plays to his credit, but nothing I'm too worried about. Bennett has been beaten a little more frequently than I realized, but he's holding up very well for a TE so I've got no complaints.

 

[BradyFTW!]

To those who think Cannon hasn't been a liability, here's my case to the contrary:





In week 1, he was awful. In week 2, he was almost as bad. Week 3 was an improvement, but still had as many negatives as positives. Cannon wasn't asked to do much in pass protection, largely because we didn't pass much. Had some good plays, but also surrendered a QB hit and shared the blame in one sack.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Yep. The line is playing better and they aren't as predictable. They are more physical. With Develin in there and Blount as threats to run and can block the dline needs to think about the run and they face a second level of blockers.

One development that I've liked a lot is that Blount has made some really good plays in pass protection, as well. It's getting to the point that his presence on the field doesn't declare the offense's intentions nearly as much as it did a couple years ago.

 

[Fantomex]

Check out @jeffphowe's Tweet:

 

[long distance]

To those who think Cannon hasn't been a liability, here's my case to the contrary:





In week 1, he was awful. In week 2, he was almost as bad. Week 3 was an improvement, but still had as many negatives as positives. Cannon wasn't asked to do much in pass protection, largely because we didn't pass much. Had some good plays, but also surrendered a QB hit and shared the blame in one sack.

Looked like a promising thread. Turns out the point of the thread is that you feel good about yourself.
I feel better about Cannon though.

1. Stats are always deceiving. Plus partial - one tends to take the stat that goes with his thoughts.
2. Cannon is not standing alone. He's part of the group. That group is not only OL.
He did well and much better than expected here.
3. OL is the best surprise in my book. But its not only credit to OL men and Dante. Credit should also go to BB, McD, gameplan and two guys that were not there last year: Bennett and Develin.