13 Rookies Could Make The 53-man Squad

[mgteich]

Priorty of need is another issue entirely. However, there are easily 13 roster spots that could be filled or upgraded.
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9 rookies made the 53 man squad last year, plus 2 to the PS and 2 to IR. I see 13 POTENTIAL roster spots again this time.

OFFENSE (8)

WR (2)
We have Moss, Edelman and Tate. 2 more could easily make the team. The current squad has Stanback and Patten in those roster spots.

TE (2)
We have Crumpler. We could carry 2 or 3 TE's.

RB (2)
We have a reasonable rotation in Maroney, Taylor and Faulk. Morris and/or Green-Ellis could be upgraded, without pressure on the rookie. We coulld add a rookie for almost any role. After all, we have exactly zero running backs signed for 2011.

OL (1)
We could bring in someone who might beat out LeVoir or Connelly for a roster spot. Besides, Mankins is no lock to play this year, and certainly no lock for 2011. Next year, we have exactly zero signed OG's that we can count on as starters.

QB (1)
We carried three last year, including Hoyer and Stanback. A rookie could be added.

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DEFENSE (4)

DL (1)
We've lost Green. We need a 3rd DE.

ILB (1)
Mayo, Guyton and McKenzie could be fine. However, there could a 4th roster spot (the special team spot which Alexander holds). Beside, it is prudent to have another player as insurance in case McKenzie doesn't work out.

OLB (2)
We carry 5-6 (including DE/OLB passrushers). We have Banta-Cain, Woods, and Ninkovich.
We lost or will lose Burgess and Thomas. We have Crable. We need two OLB's to compete with Crable for the two roster spots.

CB (1)
We're counting on Bodden, Butler and Wilhite.
We have Springs, Wheatley and Arrington compete for the other two roster spots. We certainly could use a quality rookie.

S (0)
We're all set with Meriweather, Sanders, McGowan and Chung. We even have Lockett (a competitor for a ST roster spot) if necessary.

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SPECIAL TEAMS (1)
We're in pretty good shape with Aiken, Slater, Lockett, Alexander, and Arrington competing for a couple of roster spots.

P (1)
Let the competition begin! Belichick likes seasoned vets and will bring one in. A rookie could win the spot, or at least a Practice Squad spot.

 

[DaBruinz]

You seemed to have over-looked the safety position.

Meriweather, McGowan, Sanders, Chung, Lockett.

 

[cstjohn17]

Priorty of need is another issue entirely. However, there are easily 13 roster spots that could be filled or upgraded.
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Let the competition begin! Belichick likes seasoned vets and will bring one in. A rookie could win the spot, or at least a Practice Squad spot.

Yep, nice post. Rookies versus veteran JAGs let the cage match begin.

This is a larger number than is typical for the Pats, most years the first 45 roster spots are pretty much known before training camp even begins.

In certain areas there is a clear need to upgrade the starters (my list in order of need / position value)

• OLB - bigger Vrabel, McGinest type
• 3-4 DE - stout enough to hold up against the run
• OLB - smaller TBC \ Colvin type
• WR\KR - a 3rd WR that can be a return threat would be ideal
• TE - cupboard is bare but TEs are a dime a dozen unless they are elite
• OG - not much depth
• RB - we have a stable of average players, if china doll Morris could stay healthy I would make him the starter
• ILB - run stopper
• P - dime a dozen

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I agree and would up the OL to (2) with the (1) QB likely heading to the PS.

It's been a damned if you do damned if you don't kind of off season for this team on this board. Criticized for not drafting better and then criticized for not trading away draft picks for more veterans... The year after Indy won it all they fielded a team with 19 roster players coming out of a shallow draft who had never set foot on the field and they made the playoffs and the following season they made the Superbowl.

Early on Bill needed cagy veterans to help him install the system and scheme here. What you need to remain competitive once that foundation is set is solid drafting and just selective additions via trade or FA to bridge the gaps between drafts which are never consistently populated to the extent you can draft 'em all (for this complex a scheme). Once in a while you are in a position of need where taking a risk is a worthwhile endeavor. Doesn't mean that becomes the mantra or you undertake to increasingly elevate the risk. This year is like a season where opportunity knocks (deep draft and several legitimate roster spots for starters (DE, OLB, TE, WR, WR, TE) and primary backups or rotational guys (OL, DL, ILB, OLB, CB) as opposed to few starting spots and basically looking at draftees potentially upgrading the inactive list and riding the pine or hoping they can make it to the PS.

We traded back judiciously when value was lean so we would have extra picks and flexibility in situations like this. I hope we find ways on Thursday and Friday to create even more flexible opportunities. Then maybe in 2011 we barely have room for 2 or 3 in a shallow draft but one where we have 3 picks in the top 64 and you're really in a position to go BPA and FA (in a deep class there too) to bridge any gap.

 

[mgteich]

I see no needs there or even opportunities; do you? I'll add the position to the original post.

You seemed to have over-looked the safety position.

Meriweather, McGowan, Sanders, Chung, Lockett.

 

[SeauOUCH]

I see no needs there or even opportunities; do you?

McGowan played great the 1st 6 games or so then played AWFUL & lost his starting spot. Combine this with his bizare yelling after the game at one of our reserve OL who absolutely crushed a Jet DB makes me think he was one of the guys who poisoned our locker room.

We need to cleanse our locker room of bad seeds, our locker is full of young guys we don't need them learning from vets with bad attitudes.

I think ( hope ) Chung is gonna make big strides this year, I love his attitude. The blitz when he CRUSHED Henne was a thing of beauty ( even though it got called for a 15 yard flag )

 

[Feep50]

Yep, nice post. Rookies versus veteran JAGs let the cage match begin.

This is a larger number than is typical for the Pats, most years the first 45 roster spots are pretty much known before training camp even begins.

In certain areas there is a clear need to upgrade the starters (my list in order of need / position value)

• OLB - bigger Vrabel, McGinest type
• 3-4 DE - stout enough to hold up against the run
• OLB - smaller TBC \ Colvin type
• WR\KR - a 3rd WR that can be a return threat would be ideal
• TE - cupboard is bare but TEs are a dime a dozen unless they are elite
• OG - not much depth
• RB - we have a stable of average players, if china doll Morris could stay healthy I would make him the starter
• ILB - run stopper
• P - dime a dozen

This is an excellent sum up. The original post is quite good also. I wholeheartedly agree with both you fine gentlemen........

OLB/DE Beast/WR in that order for me too

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

McGowan played great the 1st 6 games or so then played AWFUL & lost his starting spot. Combine this with his bizare yelling after the game at one of our reserve OL who absolutely crushed a Jet DB makes me think he was one of the guys who poisoned our locker room.

We need to cleanse our locker room of bad seeds, our locker is full of young guys we don't need them learning from vets with bad attitudes.

I think ( hope ) Chung is gonna make big strides this year, I love his attitude. The blitz when he CRUSHED Henne was a thing of beauty ( even though it got called for a 15 yard flag )

I expect McGowan or Sanders, or both to get traded during the draft. I would love to see McGowan moved for a 5th, but I doubt that is going to happen.

 

[MaineMan]

McGowan played great the 1st 6 games or so then played AWFUL & lost his starting spot. Combine this with his bizare yelling after the game at one of our reserve OL who absolutely crushed a Jet DB makes me think he was one of the guys who poisoned our locker room.

We need to cleanse our locker room of bad seeds, our locker is full of young guys we don't need them learning from vets with bad attitudes.

I think ( hope ) Chung is gonna make big strides this year, I love his attitude. The blitz when he CRUSHED Henne was a thing of beauty ( even though it got called for a 15 yard flag )

McGowan is an excellent tackler and plays the run extremely well. However, he not only sucks in coverage, he makes matters worse by mis-reading and screwing up the communications among other secondary guys. This downside (same issue that ultimately resulted in him being let go by Chicago, IIRC) didn't seem to show up as starkly early in the season (obscured by other issues on the defense). However, as the season wore on, his detraction in coverages lead to several long pass plays and at least two gift TDs that I know of.

Chung appears to be developing into a solid hitter and very good tackler. If he can cover as well, I think that bumps McGowan down to #4 behind Sanders (certainly at least adequate in coverage and against the run, a solid veteran who I really wouldn't want to lose quite yet). If Lockett shows more than just serious aggression and special teams flair in camp, McGowan could slide down to a #5/special teamer and even off the roster if we draft a safety. And I think we should. I'm far from being as confident as most folks in our roster there.

 

[cstjohn17]

I expect McGowan or Sanders, or both to get traded during the draft. I would love to see McGowan moved for a 5th, but I doubt that is going to happen.

Santonio Holmes went for a 5th, no way Sanders or McGowan would even get a 7th round pick. Plus Safety is the one position the Patriots have a little bit of depth (this pretty much assures that they take a Safety in round 1).

 

[Nonentity]

If McGowan slides to #4 by the end of training camp, I want him off this roster. His name was mentioned far too often in connection with the locker-room chemistry issues last season. Springs can play safety if he has to.

 

[supafly]

If McGowan slides to #4 by the end of training camp, I want him off this roster. His name was mentioned far too often in connection with the locker-room chemistry issues last season. Springs can play safety if he has to.

We had a widely circulated poll here last year which allowed posters to vote for offensive and defensive MVP. The poll was taken after week 8 or 9, and was for the first half mvps, McGowan was a runaway winner hands down.

His strengths include raw talent type hard hitting, a distinct nose for the ball, and good run support. Those are things that are natural, and cannot come from coaching. His weaknesses seemed to be in pass coverage, and defensive route reading--things that should be able to be coached up.

Not only may he not fall to #4, but there may not even be a true "#4" safety. Our safeties were often rotated last year in regard to specific gameplanning, and I wouldn't be surprised if it happened this year too. Besides, we have seen absolutely nothing so far to prove one way or another whether Chung can cover or not, if anything he seemed to have some notable problems in coverage too. (which is understandable for a rookie)

Not only that, but Springs can barely play the position he is used to playing. What makes you think he can just all of the sudden move to safety? Nothing more than some other older CB's have done it--that's the only reasoning.

And besides the 'partial' story of McGowan chirping to our OLman (one specific issue) about his obvious dirty leg-whip, what "other" stories have you heard about him being a problem in the locker room chemistry? You stated that "his name was mentioned far too often in connection with locker room chemistry issues,"--I'd like to hear them.

 

[Nonentity]

I remember a story from last year about the Patriots locker room after one of the defeats. Apparently some of the newer players were laughing and joking around after one of the defeats, which is about as un-Patriot as it gets. An ex-player in the media was appalled, probably either Bruschi or Harrison but I have no idea which. And if I remember right, McGowan was one of the named players.


I can't find the story on a 30 second google search, but I suspect others may remember the same story and can think of some decent search terms to bring it up. It sticks fairly vividly in my mind.

 

[Nonentity]

Oh, and as for Springs - the Redskins had started playing him as a safety in some of their packages before he was cut as part of their salary-cap purge. And when he visited with the Eagles in free agency, he was earmarked as a safety there.

Shawn Springs meets with Philadelphia Eagles - ESPN

Springs said the Eagles would move him to safety. He'd probably compete with second-year pro Quintin Demps for a starting spot opposite Quintin Mikell. Asante Samuel and Sheldon Brown are the starting cornerbacks and Joselio Hanson is the nickel back.

"When I played for Washington, I was all over the field," Springs said. "I wasn't a full-time safety, but we had a lot of packages where I was like a safety."

Springs already visited New England and indicated he had another trip planned.

 

[supafly]

Oh, and as for Springs - the Redskins had started playing him as a safety in some of their packages before he was cut as part of their salary-cap purge. And when he visited with the Eagles in free agency, he was earmarked as a safety there.

Shawn Springs meets with Philadelphia Eagles - ESPN

Fair enough, nice job providing a link.

I'm not totally sure that just because Philly may have used him there, he'd be a good fit here, although I'm sure he could play safety without too many problems. (after a couple of games)

It's been said since day 1 that he 'could' play safety here if needed, so it's not like you're the only person who has brought it up. I'm just saying that so far, he's proven that he's still injury prone and somewhat inconsistent here, not to mention that he's needed badly for CB depth. If we pick up a higher round CB on draft day (rd 3-4 or above) I'd be OK with him moving to safety.

 

[supafly]

I remember a story from last year about the Patriots locker room after one of the defeats. Apparently some of the newer players were laughing and joking around after one of the defeats, which is about as un-Patriot as it gets. An ex-player in the media was appalled, probably either Bruschi or Harrison but I have no idea which. And if I remember right, McGowan was one of the named players.


I can't find the story on a 30 second google search, but I suspect others may remember the same story and can think of some decent search terms to bring it up. It sticks fairly vividly in my mind.

All I know is that from day one, McGowan was highly thought of by Belichick, and many here had him on the bubble for the 53 man roster--while Belichick stated that he was pretty much a lock to make the team during the 4th preseason game. To me, that says that Belichick was happy with his work ethic etc throughout training camp. He constantly had a nose for the ball in TC, and caused a fumble and an INT during preseason.

Here's a link from mid-November where Jeff Howe from NESN states that he's the toughest player on the entire team:

Patriots Preparing for 'Rivalry of the Decade' Battle With Undefeated Colts - New England Patriots - NESN.com

Then, for reasons still unknown to me, many here had Chung ahead of him as the 3rd safety. I suppose since he was a high draft pick, but it seemed more than logical that Chung would be blended in a la Meriweather etc. McGowan then proved everyone wrong again by playing some significant reps in game 1 vs. BUF.

He was named practice player of the week from the get go, setting the tone for the season up front:

It Is What It Is McGowan takes home championship belt

He then did an incredible job of shadowing future HOF'er Tony Gonzales in week 3 against ATL in one of the teams' best defensive performances of the year. Belichick again went out of his way to prasie McGowan up and down, stating his importance week in and week out, not only on defense, but also special teams:

Blindside Hit: New England Finds Replacement on D in Unheralded Brandon McGowan | Bleacher Report

The article even goes on to call him a leader in the locker room, and a potential replacement for Rodney Harrison. You can't even question McGowan's presence during the first 9 or 10 games. It's true that the New Orleans game sticks out as one where he was particularly out of place, but then again, who wasn't? The Saints offense made the entire secondary look horrible. For those who say that McGowan 'disappeared' during the second half, look at the 2nd half kickoff vs. the NYJ where he lays out the ball carrier and causes an opening half fumble--yet again.

When you are 4th overall in tackles (66) on a team that lacks experience, and is in a rebuilding phase, I really don't see how you want to get rid of a good ball player like McGowan. IMO, we need more Brandon McGowan's on this team. Guys who can hit like mack trucks and who are constantly giving their 'all' on every play.

If you're going to single out McGowan, there's another Brandon who's out of position a lot, and who isn't half the tackler that McGowan is. When you consider that Chung isn't ready yet, and Sanders is up/down a lot, I don't think replacing McGowan is the answer. Especially when it's the only position that is really 'set' on the entire team (besides obviously QB). I personally don't have any idea what you are referring to when you state that he's a locker room problem, I think if anything he's the exact opposite.

 

[supafly]

I remember a story from last year about the Patriots locker room after one of the defeats. Apparently some of the newer players were laughing and joking around after one of the defeats, which is about as un-Patriot as it gets. An ex-player in the media was appalled, probably either Bruschi or Harrison but I have no idea which. And if I remember right, McGowan was one of the named players.


I can't find the story on a 30 second google search, but I suspect others may remember the same story and can think of some decent search terms to bring it up. It sticks fairly vividly in my mind.

Coincidently, the player you are referring to is your answer at safety. It was Shawn Springs.

He was also talked about negatively when he and Adalius were going back and forth in front of the media regarding Adalius' unexplained absence. A reporter asked AD if he thought he should apoligize to his players, and Springs interrupted while walking through. Apparently, he had a smirk on his face and he and AD exchanged some sarcastic 'sorries' to each other.

It wasn't McGowan who you heard bad things from, it was actually Springs. There was even a thread or two in this forum regarding the matter. Here is what comes up when you do a google search on 'shawn springs problem in the locker room' :

Shawn Springs, New England Patriots, NFL - CBSSports.com FootballDec 27, 2009 ... Shawn Springs NFL Football player profile pages at CBSSports.com. ... He's under contract, but he didn't seem a great fit in the locker room. ... Sorry, there was a problem submitting your post, please try again. ...
Shawn Springs, New England Patriots, NFL - CBSSports.com Football - Cached

If you do a search on this forum, I'm sure you will find something, as I remember talking about it a few months ago. Apparently, you mixed up your 'bad apple' player. It isn't McGowan at all, it was Springs.