"It's for the cover up, not the crime" What cover up? Who did a cover up?

I keep seeing this line repeated throughout the media and by other fans, that the Patriots are being punished for their coverup of the deflated balls. But doesn't the Wells Report, for all it's shortcomings, SPECIFICALLY, exonerate the Patriots organization from any wrongdoing? So clearly they didn't cover anything up. And how did Brady cover anything up? By keeping his phone, which he was by all legal rights allowed to do? How is that a cover up? The ball boys sure didn't cover anything up since all their txt messages were all around.

Seriously, what the f**k is even going on anymore, I'm losing my mind.

And I LOVE the implication that somehow everyone would have been easier on the Pats if Brady came out and said that he cheated during the during the weeks before the Super Bowl. Yes I'm sure the punishment would have just been a little slap on the wrist there right?

And please, don't just post some wise ass remark, I'm genuinely interested in what the hell these people are thinking.

Baltimore's attempt to cover up the fact that Ray Rice tried to kill women with Mike Tyson haymakers.

Oh, wait, I forgot they didn't get punished for that.

TOM DIDN'T GIVE ESPN HIS CELL PHONE. HE'S A BAD MAN

Same crap by jackie mac , ben volin etc. they all assume he is guilty for some reason and shouldve admitted his guilt. The pressers before the SB didnt help where he tried to deflect unsuccessfully . If he had come out screaming like BB was in that mona lisa vito presser maybe it wouldve helped his image a bit.

Ya I don't get this narrative. Anyone saying it just looks like an idiot.

SVN said:

Same crap by jackie mac , ben volin etc. they all assume he is guilty for some reason and shouldve admitted his guilt. The pressers before the SB didnt help where he tried to deflect unsuccessfully . If he had come out screaming like BB was in that mona lisa vito presser maybe it wouldve helped his image a bit.

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Isn't that then same thing socialists do? No evidence, just some slights conjecture and circumstantial evidence. What I say goes. Just admit you did it. Go ahead. Because we know you did it. If you don't you don't we will hurt you. Go look at how many people the Nazis arrested on innuendo and false truths that were never heard from again. It's quite scary if you think about it.

ViperGTS said:

Isn't that then same thing socialists do? No evidence, just some slights conjecture and circumstantial evidence. What I say goes. Just admit you did it. Go ahead. Because we know you did it. If you don't you don't we will hurt you. Go look at how many people the Nazis arrested on innuendo and false truths that were never heard from again. It's quite scary if you think about it.

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That's characteristic of the uniquely hyper-authoritative type of pseudo-communist ruling known as Stalinism, not socialism, and yes there is a huge difference.

And the Nazi's were not socialists and in fact were as ideologically opposed to them as you could imagine. There was at one point a socialist element within the party but after a little event in 1934 called The Night of the Long Knives that was the end of that. And before you say that it's in their name would you call North Korea a democracy because their official name is the "Democratic Republic of Korea"? Of course not.

VectorPrime said:

That was under the uniquely hyper-authoritative type of pseudo-communist ruling known as Stalinism, not socialism, and yes there is a huge different.

And the Nazi's were not socialists and in fact were as ideologically opposed to them as you could imagine. There was at one point a socialist element within the party but after a tinsey little event in 1934 called The Night of the Long Knives that was the end of that. And before you say that it's in their name would you call North Korea a Democracy because their official name is the "Democratic Republic of Korea"? Of course not.

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It's been a while since I studied it back in college. Anyway, here's nice article that's seems to be what based I my opinions on back then.



http://www.nationalreview.com/article/372197/nazis-still-socialists-jonah-goldberg

ViperGTS said:

It's been a while since I studied it back in college. Anyway, here's nice article that's seems to be what based I my opinions on back then.



http://www.nationalreview.com/article/372197/nazis-still-socialists-jonah-goldberg

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No offense to you but Jonah Goldberg is considered nothing more than a joke within scholarly circles. While the study of Fascism is almost uniquely complicated and nuanced within the study of political history, with many legitimate schools of thought on the subject, he specifically has been completely discredited in his field by academics from both sides of the spectrum. Scholars who believe in the Marxist interpretation that fascism is the logical end result for a hyper capitalistic state and scholars who believe that fascism was a unique political phenomenon that occurred as a reactionary response to European liberalism and can not fairly be considered conservative in the traditional sense all safely agree on one thing; Jonah Goldberg is a hack. He's sort of the David Irving of 20th century political thought.

Totalitarianism is a political system in which the state holds total authority over the society and seeks to control all aspects of public and private life wherever possible.



a more modern example perhaps?...OK....

This is all way beside the damn point and I only started it because it's 3 am and I'm ridiculously tired but I can't sleep because I am so pissed off at everything that is going on. Sorry.

So, can anyone point to the stage in the investigation where the coverup is said to have occurred? When did the obstruction occur? And by whom? If they argue that Brady was obstructing the investigation, (lets forget for a moment about the moral and legal rights that Brady has as a US citizen) then on what grounds do they punish the organization? Suspend him for 6 games then and don't mess with draft picks, that would at least make some sort of logical sense.

The "coverup" is the failure to allow the NFL to interview McNally for a fifth time, supposedly after they had received the texts. This appears to be a lie because the Patriots delivered Jastremski's phone (and others) to the NFL's forensic experts on January 21 or 22, before the investigation started.

TomPatriot said:

The "coverup" is the failure to allow the NFL to interview McNally for a fifth time, supposedly after they had received the texts. This appears to be a lie because the Patriots delivered Jastremski's phone (and others) to the NFL's forensic experts on January 21 or 22, before the investigation started.

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Is that timeline accurate?

VectorPrime said:

Is that timeline accurate?

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It's from Wells' report, except for the 4 interviews, which is what the Pats claimed and no one denies,

VectorPrime said:

Is that timeline accurate?

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It would really be helpful and likely revealing to see a timeline of all these events.

Cover up reason for harsh punishment is bs. If they did anything and admitted it, I bet the punishment would have been even worse. That is where you would have seen godells full wrath.

VectorPrime said:

Is that timeline accurate?

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I'd have to look at the report but even from memory back then it was stated that the Pats were cooperating and had turned over cell phones and others electronic devices. Probably why Kraft had enough after 4 times. I bet once they realized they didn't have anything, they came back to the texts to try and implicate them at that point. It was all calculated.

Pats are getting punished for the cover up, well why wasn't the NFL punished last fall for that pathetic cover up job they did with the Ray Rice thing.

I do not get the cover up part of this, Don Yee said that Brady sat with the "Grand Inquisitors" for 5+ hours and answered all their questions, but #12 did not give up his cell phone..

Who in their right mind would give up their cellphone to folks are notoriously famous for bumbling personal information?? How about if there were personal texts between he and his wife, and the inquisitors started to giggle?? The NFL promised "safeguards", WTF #12 is supposed to just trust them??

the failure of Tom Brady to produce any electronic evidence (emails, texts, etc.), despite being offered extraordinary safeguards by the investigators to protect unrelated personal information

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Remember when the Ravens owner tried to bury the whole Ray Rice thing? I know it was long ago, so it's hard for Goodell to be consistent. Oh, I forgot. He passed the punishment for the Patriots off on someone else. I'm sure he had no say in anything. Anyone believe that?

http://deadspin.com/espn-rice-believes-ravens-owner-tried-to-bribe-him-in-1637019552

I am sure you can find many more examples of teams trying to get out of punishment for their players.

There was not cover-up. Tom Brady is innocent. The balls were in the expected PSI range....there was no tampering. This is all just complete BS.