Center

[mgteich]

I've seen different 3rd centers being projected to us. Is Stork healthy? Is Andrews not capable of a backup roster spot?

I understand picking a center late as coma competition and fodder. The 3rd round seems early.

 

[JayNM]

If he can't improve his wobbly head, he needs to go. Fortunately, Scar is back and his rookie season was very promising, plus this particular defect is very corrigeble. I still think he could became a Pro-Bowl level Center.

I think the reason Centers are being mocked to us is due the fact that our O-line was absolute garbage last season. Some say injuries were the main or even the sole reason for that. I don't quite agree with the statment, but, again, Scar is the GOAT when it comes to training O-lines, so I don't mind giving him a go with all the young players we have there before giving up on them (Except for Cannon. He sucks).

 

[JMC00]

Some say injuries were the main or even the sole reason for that. I don't quite agree with the statment

Really?

Just look at the first part of the season. 30 points every week then the injuries started to pile up and the OL was constantly changing due to those injuries(Solder went out in Week 5, Cannon got hurt, Mason and Jackson missed time, Stork had to play a game at RT, Waddle was put in at LT after Vollmer got injured playing LT and then got injured in the same game, Kline was playing solid and then got injured and wasn't the same)

Almost everything that could go wrong from an injury stand point went wrong for them.

 

[jah]

Center is definitely one of the tougher positions for the Patriots to evaluate in 2016. You've got two players who, at different times, have performed both as plus-starters and severe liabilities, each with 2 years or less of NFL experience and no real hype coming out of college. Is that a need? If so, is it more pressing of a need than positions with clear-cut holes (rather than question marks such as here)?

Fortunately, I don't have to answer any of those questions.

 

[JMC00]

Bryan Stork manhandling Michael Bennett is a big reason why the Patriots won another SB

 

[Koma]

I've seen different 3rd centers being projected to us. Is Stork healthy? Is Andrews not capable of a backup roster spot?

I understand picking a center late as coma competition and fodder. The 3rd round seems early.

Coma competition? Is there any positive that can come out that for the offensive line?



I know, I know. Damn autocorrect

 

[farn]

Not ready to give up on Stork. 2014 turned around when he and Browner came back to action.

 

[JayNM]

Really?

Just look at the first part of the season. 30 points every week then the injuries started to pile up and the OL was constantly changing due to those injuries(Solder went out in Week 5, Cannon got hurt, Mason and Jackson missed time, Stork had to play a game at RT, Waddle was put in at LT after Vollmer got injured playing LT and then got injured in the same game, Kline was playing solid and then got injured and wasn't the same)

Almost everything that could go wrong from an injury stand point went wrong for them.

Really.

I remember reading plenty of pieces saying that Brady was releasing the ball at astounding low 2 something seconds, by far the fastest of the NFL. Plus, there were some topics about how this offense was mascarading the O-line woes by just get ridding of the ball so quickly.

Then we had the whole "Rotation" on the interior O-line, with players subing in and out, leaving the opposing teams wondering of what to do. Then, before we had a shortage of people, it wasn't working as well as before.

Third, we had 2 rookies as guards, plus a rookie center in-and-out of rotation. Like many rookies, they were raw, they commited mistakes. Once defense coordinators noticed their weaknesses, they exploited them, which compromised even more the whole rotation scheme thing

Fourth, even if we needed to rely on subs and they supposedly were injured, it is inexcusable how poorly some of those guys performed. Stork gave way the count on multiple occasions. I think i could've played better than Cannon.

Finally, if the coaching staff agreed with you and thought that the o-line sucked because solely because of injuries, DeGuglielmo's contract would have been extended. Instead, we pried Scar back from retirement.


Don't get me wrong, injuries were definetely part of the problem. But I can't agree that they were solely the reason of the suckiness. Brady was rushed, hit or sacked almost every single play. No exaggeration on my part. It was enfuriating and worrysome. We couldn't rely on our O-line to hold anyone for more than 2.5 seconds. I'm curious to see if Scar can correct those issues, because there were many. Luckily most of our line is young, so I believe we can get better.

 

[PP2]

I've seen different 3rd centers being projected to us. Is Stork healthy? Is Andrews not capable of a backup roster spot?

I understand picking a center late as coma competition and fodder. The 3rd round seems early.

Projected by who?

 

[mgteich]

Projected by who?

I've seen it 3 times in the last week or so, most recently by Draftek, which does NOT project, but indicates that are giving us the consensus pick.

 

[woolster22]

Center is definitely one of the tougher positions for the Patriots to evaluate in 2016. You've got two players who, at different times, have performed both as plus-starters and severe liabilities, each with 2 years or less of NFL experience and no real hype coming out of college. Is that a need? If so, is it more pressing of a need than positions with clear-cut holes (rather than question marks such as here)?

Fortunately, I don't have to answer any of those questions.

Stork entered the draft as the Rimington award winner (most outstanding center), and many draftniks were a little surprised he was available to us when he was. To take it a step further, who was the last center that came out of college with "hype"? Most OG/C are unheard of to the casual fan, and that's once they made the team as a starter.

 

[Tony2046]

Really.

I remember reading plenty of pieces saying that Brady was releasing the ball at astounding low 2 something seconds, by far the fastest of the NFL. Plus, there were some topics about how this offense was mascarading the O-line woes by just get ridding of the ball so quickly.

Then we had the whole "Rotation" on the interior O-line, with players subing in and out, leaving the opposing teams wondering of what to do. Then, before we had a shortage of people, it wasn't working as well as before.

Third, we had 2 rookies as guards, plus a rookie center in-and-out of rotation. Like many rookies, they were raw, they commited mistakes. Once defense coordinators noticed their weaknesses, they exploited them, which compromised even more the whole rotation scheme thing

Fourth, even if we needed to rely on subs and they supposedly were injured, it is inexcusable how poorly some of those guys performed. Stork gave way the count on multiple occasions. I think i could've played better than Cannon.

Finally, if the coaching staff agreed with you and thought that the o-line sucked because solely because of injuries, DeGuglielmo's contract would have been extended. Instead, we pried Scar back from retirement.


Don't get me wrong, injuries were definetely part of the problem. But I can't agree that they were solely the reason of the suckiness. Brady was rushed, hit or sacked almost every single play. No exaggeration on my part. It was enfuriating and worrysome. We couldn't rely on our O-line to hold anyone for more than 2.5 seconds. I'm curious to see if Scar can correct those issues, because there were many. Luckily most of our line is young, so I believe we can get better.

Part of the problem with playing on the road vs home was the silent snap count. 3 of the 4 losses the Pats had were on the road. I can't find any "hits per game" stats but I'm sure he felt more pressure during the silent count and that is because of a lack of continuity because of injuries. IMO

 

[supafly]

Part of the problem with playing on the road vs home was the silent snap count. 3 of the 4 losses the Pats had were on the road.

Past 3 years on the road:

14-12 record total, including a 17-16 win @NYJ as the game that kept them above .500.

2013--4-5 road record

2014--5-3 road record (had HFA)

2015--5-4 road record

Just something to keep in mind for those who automatically expect to win on the road. The numbers are a bit surprising. I don't know if you'd tie the subject of a silent count in there or not. That depends on why you think they're losing those games.

 

[Ivan]

Bryan Stork manhandling Michael Bennett is a big reason why the Patriots won another SB

I'm, beginning to think many here have Alzheimer's.

 

[goheels22002]

I understand picking a center late as coma competition and fodder.

No, I'd say the 1990 New England Patriots vs. the 1996 New York Jets would be a coma competition and fodder. It would take a gifted doctor with the finest technology to find any signs of life in Rod Rust and Richie Kotite.

http://deadspin.com/the-16-worst-coaches-in-modern-nfl-history-512701096

 

[JayNM]

Part of the problem with playing on the road vs home was the silent snap count. 3 of the 4 losses the Pats had were on the road. I can't find any "hits per game" stats but I'm sure he felt more pressure during the silent count and that is because of a lack of continuity because of injuries. IMO

It's true, but it is still inexcusable IMO. the guy is a professional player. I fell like is similar to a poker player to scratch the head everytime he has a good hand. You just can't be that predictable.

 

[Tony2046]

Past 3 years on the road:

14-12 record total, including a 17-16 win @NYJ as the game that kept them above .500.

2013--4-5 road record

2014--5-3 road record (had HFA)

2015--5-4 road record

Just something to keep in mind for those who automatically expect to win on the road. The numbers are a bit surprising. I don't know if you'd tie the subject of a silent count in there or not. That depends on why you think they're losing those games.

I agree that road games are tough. ( They are 14-10 over the last 3 seasons but your point still stands)

2013--4-4 road record
2014--5-3 road record
2015--5-3 road record

Interesting quote from Brady after the AFCCG.

But there are limitations to what Tom Brady can do before the snap when he’s away from Gillette.

“It’s definitely silent count there,” Brady said Thursday, referring to relying on a timed snap as opposed to verbal signals. “And I think a big part of it is just the verbal cadence and how that relates to where the tackles and tight ends are. The center can hear you, I’d say, pretty much the entire game when you’re under center. But everybody getting off on the same count is really important. At home it’s easy because it’s verbal and the communication is pretty easy. When you go on the road, you still want everyone on the offense to go on the right rhythm and really jump the count, but you can only do that on a silent count, because no one can obviously hear me verbally when we’re on the road.”

Dealing with noise in Denver will be tough for Brady (<<Link)

( I wonder if the young guys were keying their snap off of the football instead of the silent headcount off of the head bob during the AFCCG. )

Either way I think line communication, including the silent count, is a big part of why it is tough to win on the road and I imagine even tougher when you have an injury carousel inhibiting continuity throughout the season.

 

[PP2]

I've seen it 3 times in the last week or so, most recently by Draftek, which does NOT project, but indicates that are giving us the consensus pick.

If I were you, I wouldn't take their word for gospel. Center is the least of our problems.

 

[Kontradiction]

Stork has had a lot of concussions throughout his high school, college, and now pro career. He definitely did not look like the same center in 2015 that he was in 2014 and I have to wonder if they are starting to take their toll on him. If the Pats don't think he can regain the form that he showed his rookie year then I definitely think a center selection is in the cards in the draft. I don't particularly believe that Andrews is the solution as a starter either. He's a nice back-up to have, though.

 

[jah]

Stork entered the draft as the Rimington award winner (most outstanding center), and many draftniks were a little surprised he was available to us when he was. To take it a step further, who was the last center that came out of college with "hype"? Most OG/C are unheard of to the casual fan, and that's once they made the team as a starter.

He had about as much hype as a center could have, I'll give you that. But he dropped to the 4th because of athleticism concerns, IIRC. The alleged "lack of potential" is what I meant to highlight.