EVERYTHING is interconnected...

[DaBruinz]

The guy took six months to recover from a "tweaked" hamstring and you want me to bank on a 3-month recovery from ACL surgery?

Are you on the Pats medical staff? How about Pats management? If you answered NO to both of those, how the hell do you know what the severity of Jackson's injury and how long it took him to "recover" from the injury? How do you know he didn't have other injuries? Also, did you ever stop to think that he may have re-injured it? Nope. Didn't think so. Basically, you are spewing BS about something you know nothing about.

I want Chad Jackson to contribute as much as anyone, but I'm just trying to be realistic. Obviously, missing the off-season last year left him in a position where Belichick would not put him on the field (except for reverses). If he misses off-season again (as I expect he will), I don't see him contributing in 2007.

That's just it. You aren't being realistic. You are being over-reactive and theorizing without any of the facts other than the snippits that the media gives us. And we just know how accurate they are about injuries to the Patriots, don't we?

Like I was saying, take away Troy and Chad Jackson and we currently have three receivers: Caldwell, Gaffney, and Welker. Bam Childress and Kelvin Kight are JAGs. Camp fodder. About as much chance of being productive NFL players as Michael Bishop. Figments of our fanboy wishful thinking imaginations.

*sigh* Obviously, you don't bother to look at the whole picture of this team's passing offense. So be it. But you just make yourself look foolish when you ignore it.

BTW, Kelvin Kight and Bam Childress may just be JAGS, but Kight stayed with the team and didn't get cut once last year after he was re-signed from the practice squad. Kight was good in the running game as a blocker and was good on special teams. You might want to refresh yourself with the other 1/3 of the game you seem to be ignoring.

Schemewise. We lost the run-stopping role of a middle linebacker when Seau went down. This forced Bruschi to move from a roaming playmaker to a stay at home run stopper. Thus, we lost the safeties who would cover the deep middle zones and the ILB who would disrupt the short middle zones. The triple whammy of injuries right up the gut of the defense killed the Pats.

The team did a remarkable job of not breaking (largely with superb red zone defense), but was unable to stop the "bend" part and get a good offense off the field. Usually against a team like the Colts or the Chargers, it takes a big play to come up with a third down stop. The Pats simply couldn't do it and it cost us a shot at the SuperBowl.

The question is, what does Belichick realistically expect to get from the injured players: Harrison, Wilson, and Seau? Is he counting on their returns? Does he think they can stay on the field? Or, are we going to see some serious retooling? I don't know the answers to thos questions.

Seau is a UFA. So, he won't be back unless the Pats sign him.
I can't say what BB expects from Harrison and Wilson. What I expect from Harrison is for him to come back and be the leader on the field and continue to mentor Sanders. As for Wilson, I think this is his make or break year. He had 2 really good years, but since he broke his arm in SB39, he's not been the same player. He appears gunshy. Hopefully he can get over it. If not, then I expect the Pats to let him walk at the end of the season.

 

[hwc]

Are you on the Pats medical staff? How about Pats management? If you answered NO to both of those, how the hell do you know what the severity of Jackson's injury and how long it took him to "recover" from the injury? How do you know he didn't have other injuries? Also, did you ever stop to think that he may have re-injured it? Nope. Didn't think so. Basically, you are spewing BS about something you know nothing about.

None of us know. I'm just tellin' ya how I view Chad Jackson based on what we do know:

1) He missed all of last year's training camp.

2) He contributed bupkis for the Pats and basically was never on the field despite a dire shortage of receivers.

3) He had ACL surgery in February and will, at the very least, miss the entire off-season program.

If you want to annoint him, fine. IMO, that's wishful thinking. Until I see him on the field as a productive contributor, I'm going to assume that he doesn't exist for the Pats in 2007. I hope I'm proven wrong, but based on what we know, I'm not prepared to pencil him in.

It is what it is.

As of today, I think the Pats have three NFL wide receivers on the roster: Caldwell, Gaffney, and Welker. I'm really excited about the Welker signing. However, there is a long way to go to assemble a complete WR corps that can withstand some dings.

 

[DaBruinz]

None of us know. I'm just tellin' ya how I view Chad Jackson based on what we do know:

1) He missed all of last year's training camp.

2) He contributed bupkis for the Pats and basically was never on the field despite a dire shortage of receivers.

#2 is false. Jackson was doing what the Patriots asked him to do. He returned some punts. He was out there on some return coverages AND he was out there on running plays blocking. That isn't bubkis. Just because it doesn't meet YOUR expectations, doesn't mean that it didn't meet the Patriots expectations. Also, when were the Pats short receivers?

BTW, how about you go and review how many receivers actually contribute in their 1st year. Its not a lot.

3) He had ACL surgery in February and will, at the very least, miss the entire off-season program.

If you want to annoint him, fine. IMO, that's wishful thinking. Until I see him on the field as a productive contributor, I'm going to assume that he doesn't exist for the Pats in 2007. I hope I'm proven wrong, but based on what we know, I'm not prepared to pencil him in.

Show me where I have annoited him in ANY of my posts? You can't. Also, how do you figure that he'll miss the entire off-season program? That doesn't start until March 19th. I can guarantee you that he's doing REHAB as we speak and that there are parts of the off-season program he will be doing as part of his re-hab.

OH, Chad Jackson's surgery occured 4 days after the AFCCG. That means it was the end of January, not in February.

It is what it is.

As of today, I think the Pats have three NFL wide receivers on the roster: Caldwell, Gaffney, and Welker. I'm really excited about the Welker signing. However, there is a long way to go to assemble a complete WR corps that can withstand some dings.

I'm not saying that the WR corps is complete by any stretch of the imagination. However, I don't necessarily believe that Stallworth is the answer and is a player that the Pats absolutely NEED.

 

[hwc]

#2 is false. Jackson was doing what the Patriots asked him to do. He returned some punts. He was out there on some return coverages AND he was out there on running plays blocking. That isn't bubkis.

Notice what's missing from your list of Jackson's contributions: RECEIVING.

From what I saw, Bellichik basically would not put the guy on the field as a receiver. Why? I don't know. I would assume that, for whatever reason, Belichick didn't think he could produce as a receiver.

Personally, I don't think spending the off-season rehabbing an ACL is going to give the kid what he needs to be a productive NFL receiver in 2007. I would not, at this point, count him a contributor to the Patriots wide receiving corps. Hopefully, I'll be pleasantly surprised. Meanwhile, I expect the Pats to sign another veteran and draft a WR.

 

[Ring 6]

I dont get the venom directed at Chad Jackson.
He struggled through some injuries, and being a rookie. Overall, he had a decent season for a rookie.
He got on the field, made some plays, and contributed on special teams.
What is the big deal? What did you expect, 100 catches?

Chad Jackson's rookie year is a wash to me. The chance of him delievering on his potential is not higher or lower after that first year. In other words he pretty much did what he should have been realistically expected to do.

What pi$$e$ me off is that people who had unreasonable expectations now want to A) throw him under the bus, inferring that he is a ****y because he was injured, stupid, lazy or anything else they can think of that is negative, and B) jump to the conclusion that his injury is the most severe it could possibly be, only so that they can defend their position that they are angry at him for not living up to their unrealistic expectations.

Take a step back, and imagine that you are a Patriot player, and playing for the Patriots mean that the average fan of the team will treat you as Chad Jackson is being treated, and you can expect that players will leave NE like their pants are on fire when they become FAs because the fans have unreasonable expectations, irrationally rip players, and appreciate nothing.
It occurs to me that the same fans who throw players unreasonably under the bus are the same ones that question whether the Pats organization treats the players well, and whether players will leave because of that treatment. Truly a bizzare set of logic.

 

[Ring 6]

Notice what's missing from your list of Jackson's contributions: RECEIVING.

From what I saw, Bellichik basically would not put the guy on the field as a receiver. Why? I don't know. I would assume that, for whatever reason, Belichick didn't think he could produce as a receiver.

Personally, I don't think spending the off-season rehabbing an ACL is going to give the kid what he needs to be a productive NFL receiver in 2007. I would not, at this point, count him a contributor to the Patriots wide receiving corps. Hopefully, I'll be pleasantly surprised. Meanwhile, I expect the Pats to sign another veteran and draft a WR.

I saw him on the field. I saw him catch passes. To imply that BB thought he was so bad he was afraid to put him on the field is bs.
Chad Jackson was a rookie. Veteran players were higher on the depth chart. He was mostly 4th on the dc, and probably 3rd a few games between Gabriel being out and Gaffney being in. Why is that bad for a ROOKIE?
Why would doing exactly what reasonable expectations say he should be a death knell for his career?

What are the things that you would think he is doing in the off-season, the things he 'needs to be a productive NFL player in 2007' that he won't be doing?
50% of NFL players rehab injuries in the off-season. 99% of NFL players workout either rehabbing or otherwise until July when they go to camp. What are all these other players doing that Chad Jackson won't be?
I am at a loss to understand how an injury that you have no clue of the timetable of rehab, or what type of rehab he will be doing is keepin ghim away from these things he is supposed to be doing, much less what these things are.

 

[wdkantro2]

In the past, there was always the threat of throwing a quick hit underneath to one of our speedy guys to compensate for the blitz. While I agree with the moves they made in terms of the "big picture" there is no doubt that the lack of a reliable option allowed teams to tee off on Brady.

 

[patsox23]

Just wanted to weigh in and say how great a thread this is. Patfanken and AJ always bring it. Thanks for the insights I'm too lazy, and less savvy, to post.

 

[JDP111]

... Its late at night and something Rod Woodson said got me thinking. He made the comment that although Brady wasn't sacked much this year, he got hit more than had in recent years, so there may be a need to add OL help in the draft.

Somehow that didn't compute. While not a probowl LT, Light DID make it to Hawaii as an injury replacement, so he doesn't suck. Mankins should have made the Probowl, and you could make a case for Koppen as well, They just extended Neal, so we know they think highly of them, and we have THREE excellent RTs in waiting.(Britt, OCallahan, & Kaczur) One will win and the other 2 plus Russ Hockstein will back up, with Billy Yates doing post grad work at Scharnecchia U for no name Linemen. I don't think we need help there this year...at all. But still Woodson's words rang true. Brady DID seem to get hit more this year, and it got to making me think WHY, and here is what I came up with.

I have defended the WRs all season. Remember we had the 7th best scoring offense in the league, and they racked up a lot of yds during the playoffs. Pretty good for no name WRs, BUT they are what they are. As the season wore on, more and more teams came at Brady with complex Blitz packages than ever before. WHY?? It was a combination of things. Because the WRs weren't quick enough to get separation off the line in blitz control. Because of a lack of familiarity that extended all year (it got better, and I believe we still would have seen a big difference THIS year, even if nothing changed in the personel) AND because Troy Brown had lost too many steps and wasn't as effective in the slot.

Now, again, it wasn't that it was TERRIBLE, just not good enough to make teams pay a big enough price for blitzing, so that they'd stop or slow down. Hence, more blitzing, Brady takes more hits....again not many more sacks, just more hits.

NOW we can see WHY the Pats put such a premium on Welker. Here is guy who will EXCELL against blitzing teams that have to cover him one one one in the slot. Clearly the Pats feel he has the quickness to get off the LOS, he has the smarts to read the defenses, and the toughness to play in the middle. Evidently, they determined that he was the one guy in FA who could improve this critical part of the game and make teams PAY for blitzing.

If he does his job well, then teams will have to blitz less in order to get more men in coverage and Brady doesn't get hit as much as he did last season. It wasn't that the OL sucked, it was they were just facing many more blitzes...and when you blitz, you have less time, and when you have less time, your QB WILL get hit.

Add the RIGHT player, within the RIGHT system, and he not only affects the passing game, but aids in the pass blocking as well. If you think of it this way, getting Welker and paying the price we did to acquire him, makes more sense. We needed a certain kind of WR who could make teams pay for blitzing to much.

Now Im sure that Welker in the slot isn't the only way the Pats can make defenses not want to blitz. You could see it later in the year, when BOTH Gaffney and Caldwell beat their men deep on 9 routes only to have Brady miss them. With another year of preparation, I believe that they will make that connection more often.

You can say the same thing about AD on Defense. Its not just that he will bring his obvious physical skills to the game, by having HIM and a lot of our DB depth back, we will be able to show defensive packages that were thrown out the last 2 years because of all the injuries, The Defense finally has a big 3 in the DL, LBs, and Secondary (Seymour, AD, Samuel) that forces an offense to find each of these elite players on each level of the defense. Sort of like the same kind of problems a great offense who has a great QB, RB, & WR Big Three, would present to a defense. EVERYTHING SEEMS TO INTERCONNECT.

I also think its interesting how the game is evolving so that having a blazing fast safety can impact the game more than the traditional impact positions of CB, OLB, and DE. In other words the great athletes are now playing or being converted to S. Back when I was a SS, that was where you put the guys who were good but not great athletes. The "great" athletes you put a CB. Not any more. More and more you take your CBs and turn them into Safeties. But that's a topic for another thread.

Jeess its March and I'm already getting excited to see how this team will evolve. Good night

Good post. Regarding the Safety, I could care less how fast he is. I want a cerebral guy that knows where to be on the field, and can blow up the ball carrier/WR. Speed is just an added bonus if the S has good football IQ. I want a safety that quickly ID's a play, and doesn't get caught out of position.

 

[Captain Cliche]

Last season I thought the Pats would not miss Branch. That receiver was a "plug and play" position as Miguel suggested....a product of the system.

That assessment was wrong. In the past, it was a joy to see Brady get a little time in the pocket to watch the passing game develop. I'd count 3...4...5...and I just knew the defense was going to pay and he was going to nail a receiver on the fly.

That didn't happen last season. I saw many times where the OL gave him plenty of time and nothing happened. He ate the ball, threw out of bounds, or sometimes threw an interseption. Sure, there was a lack of familiarity, but you get 5 seconds in the pocket and somebody better get open.

The Patriots organization also realize this. Welker this year, Stallworth offers, a run at Mason last year, a high pick for Jackson. You need some talent, not just a group of jags in a good system with the best quarterback. As good as Brady is, he still needs some talent to throw to. We saw that last year.

 

[hwc]

I dont get the venom directed at Chad Jackson.

It's not venom. It is what it is.

The question is whether or not Chad Jackson will contribute to the Pats receiving corps in a meaningful way in 2007.

He had 13 catches last year. Including 3 in the final five December games and 0 in three postseason games. It's not like he was on even a minor upswing to end the season.

From a non-contributing baseline, he had offseason ACL surgery.

I'm just not seeing the basis for fans believing that Jackson will be a significant contributor in 2007.

Look, I feel sorry for the guy. Missing all of training camp killed him last year. Missing the off-season again this year is the last thing on earth that he needed as he tries to jump start his NFL career. But, it is what it is.

 

[jczxohn1]

Teams wondering how to beat the Pats next year need only watch 4 games. The second Jets game, the second Miami game , and both Indy games. Whatever our faults were, they were there in glaring illumination. I don't have Tivo or NFL network and only watched each game once, but the images that come back to haunt me are:
Slow developing running plays (ex: the job Sanders did on Maroney)
Non-developing pass plays (ex: First 1/2 of season much worse than 2nd, but Sanders defense on Troy was a classic)
Soft defense in the middle against the run ( ex:Jones-Drew making Bruschi look like a blocking dummy)
Slow or out-of-position secondary ( ex: other than Asante, too many YPC, too many "chasing" tackles, not enough point-of-catch stops
Overall, we appeared to be a powerful but slow, lumbering team

AD and Welker won't solve every thing but should address a great deal of what I saw as disturbing. A healthy Hartwell in the middle would be great, too. After much ruminating, my draft wishes, in order, would be:
1a-SS or FS -need more speed
1b-CB --to start in 2008. IMO, no deal for Asante, need to draft his replacement
3-ILB --need some youth from a higher gene pool --speed
4-WR --many want one higher, it'll have to wait
Players that won't perform as hoped next yr--Harrison, Bruschi, Wilson
Questionables--Light, Mills, O'Callahan, Gardner, Jackson, Gay, Izzo

 

[patpatriot]

Great topic.

Almost every WR in the NFL has the basic physical skills that are in the area of good enough. But, the difference is TECHNIQUE. That includes technique in beating the jam, precise route running, proper catching skills. These are not inborn abilities but abilities that are learned and COACHED.

Really Andy? How do you coach a vetran guy who had 2 critical drops in the biggest game of the year? Would Givens or Branch have dropped those balls?...I don't think so. Does a QB hesitate just slightly to throw to a guy who chokes in critical situations? I'll leave it fore you to answer that question.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Really Andy? How do you coach a vetran guy who had 2 critical drops in the biggest game of the year? Would Givens or Branch have dropped those balls?...I don't think so. Does a QB hesitate just slightly to throw to a guy who chokes in critical situations? I'll leave it fore you to answer that question.

Odd isn't it, a kid who spent four years in the Chargers' big game choke system would have a minor melt down in a big game. AJ's correct in saying coaching can make a difference, good non-coms and officers have turned around personnel mucked up by less able leaders often enough - I've seen it and I've seen those same "ball droppers" (for lack of a better term) perform flawlessly under pressure conditions easily as tough as an AFCCG.

 

[Miguel]

Last season I thought the Pats would not miss Branch. That receiver was a "plug and play" position as Miguel suggested....a product of the system.

I do not recall making that type of suggestion. I doubt that I would have made such a suggestion.