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Dennard arrested for DUI


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BTW...sorta tangential BUT...what happens now if you swapped your Hernandez jersey for a Dennard one?...get a do over?
 
As Florio points out on PFT in the latest post, the conditions of Dennard's probation very well may have restricted him from any alcohol consumption whatsoever, so that may point to some bad times ahead just in that regard alone...

Please tell me that you didn't give Florio a click for that information.
 
The only reason that he received the Failure to Comply citation was that the officer claimed Dennard didn't blow hard enough into the breathalyzer. And that, to me, sounds like a ton of BS on the officer's part. I've never heard that there was a specific strength you had to blow into the breathalyzer for it to give an accurate reading. The breathalyzer isn't like a lung capacity meter where you have to blow your hardest for as long as possible..

Yes, there is a minimum amount that you have to blow into a breathalyzer. Short version is that I believe it measures concentration in a volume of air. If you don't provide sufficient volume, it won't register. Might have something to do with making sure that the breath is coming from deep in your lungs, which provides a more accurate reading ??
 
Right, the inability (or assumed inability) to consume alcohol may be the biggest factor that we're dealing with here.

Keep in mind that the original case involved alcohol and a bar fight, so I think it's a valid concern to worry that there is a "no alcohol" clause in the probation terms. That could warrant a revocation of his probation, especially considering how tough they played things the first time through out there.

Guess you missed the part where there was no clause prohibiting Dennard from drinking alcohol in his probation. Typical. You believe Florio over Jeff Howe.
 
Guess you missed the part where there was no clause prohibiting Dennard from drinking alcohol in his probation. Typical. You believe Florio over Jeff Howe.

You're a trip, dude.

Why don't you simply state that we know for sure (I hadn't heard otherwise), instead of acting like a douchebag? I hadn't heard Jeff Howe's comments, and apparently neither did a lot of people or they wouldn't have been asking about it. Thinking that someone may have a no-alcohol clause in their probation that stemmed from a barfight is pretty reasonable, no?

What does "typical" even mean? I wished you well multiple times when you got married, and have always treated you respectfully. Unfortunately, you don't share the same respect to others, and your true colors have really been showing lately.

You were 100% wrong about Hernandez being charged and the "fabrication of the media" conspiracy theory, and you've been wrong on many other accounts too (as we all are sometimes). You could use a lesson in humility and respect to others, and you take any kind of negative Patriots related information WAY too seriously--it's almost weird.
 
Please tell me that you didn't give Florio a click for that information.

For what it's worth, it has been something we've been discussing here on the forum.

I think it's pretty reasonable to feel that someone may have a no alcohol clause in their probational terms, especially considering that his original charge stemmed from a barfight.

I may indeed have read Florio's comments at some point, as I do check the site every day--but this is not exactly an original thought.

I've seen a ton of defendants have no alcohol clauses as part of their restrictions, particularly those that stem from fights and bars.

If Jeff Howe personally read the restrictions of Dennard's probationary contract or has some inside source then no one here was aware of that as current as about an hour ago, and if they were they certainly didn't share that info.

I never once stated that he definitely had that clause--who the hell would really know aside from the P.O. and or the judge/Dennard? I simply stated that may end up coming into play, which is entirely reasonable.
 
Yes, there is a minimum amount that you have to blow into a breathalyzer. Short version is that I believe it measures concentration in a volume of air. If you don't provide sufficient volume, it won't register. Might have something to do with making sure that the breath is coming from deep in your lungs, which provides a more accurate reading ??

Volume is different than pressure. The amount you blow into the machine is the volume. The pressure is how hard the air pushes against the objects. One is measure in Cubic Feet or Cubic Meters (or their deliniations) and the other is measured in Pound per Square Inch, Pascals, or Millibars.

According to the company that makes most of the breathalyzers, taking a deep breath and exhaling it normally is all that is needed, provided that the person has the mouthpiece properly in their mouth to ensure that outside air does not enter the machine. That is the responsibility of the administering officer.

Per the citation, Dennard supposedly didn't blow hard enough. Not that he didn't provide enough air to the machine. That would imply that there is a minimum PSI needed. Not a minimum volume needed. According to Dennard, the machine got a reading, both times, that was below the legal limit.

It sure sounds to me like the officer made something up to put Dennard in a bind because of being on probation instead of Dennard having actually done something wrong.
 
For what it's worth, it has been something we've been discussing here on the forum.

I think it's pretty reasonable to feel that someone may have a no alcohol clause in their probational terms, especially considering that his original charge stemmed from a barfight.

I may indeed have read Florio's comments at some point, as I do check the site every day--but this is not exactly an original thought.

I've seen a ton of defendants have no alcohol clauses as part of their restrictions, particularly those that stem from fights and bars.

If Jeff Howe personally read the restrictions of Dennard's probationary contract or has some inside source then no one here was aware of that as current as about an hour ago, and if they were they certainly didn't share that info.

I never once stated that he definitely had that clause--who the hell would really know aside from the P.O. and or the judge/Dennard? I simply stated that may end up coming into play, which is entirely reasonable.

Jeff Howe tweeted it 3 days ago, July 11th, at 2:52 pm.

https://twitter.com/jeffphowe/status/355414195833028609

Alfonzo Dennard's probation orders do not prohibit him from drinking, according to a Lancaster County Court spokesman.

I'm sorry if no one else has decided to report it. That doesn't make it any less true. Hell, it just speaks of shoddy reporting on the part of the other reporters. But that is par for the course. Especially when it comes to anything dealing with the Patriots of late.
 
According to Dennard, the machine got a reading, both times, that was below the legal limit.

And according to both officers involved, Dennard was swerving, smelled like alcohol, and failed the field sobriety tests. The only way to tell for sure if from the video evidence, which is installed in many/most police cars and used as prosecuting evidence in court. That will be their most damning evidence, and the only way that this question will be answered.

Not sure how familiar you are with criminal activity, but the old "not blowing hard enough" trick is used very commonly in regards to giving DUI tests.

An NFL athlete in great shape should have no problem submitting a breath sample into a machine. Of course the machine gave a reading that was low since not enough of a breath sample was given, that's how it works.

What did you expect Dennard to say? "I was smashed?" Of course his story is going to be different. That's why they have court, evidence, testimony etc. Unfortunately for him, he's on the wrong side of things even if it is a "set up" as you seem to think.

In reality, they don't need any video evidence. The fact that they'll have 2 sworn officers giving their side of things will be plenty, along with the fact that he supposedly failed the sobriety test, smelled like alcohol, and was committing an infraction to begin with re: swerving.

His only real shot is getting the probable cause of the traffic stop thrown out, especially since he didn't give a blood test or an accurate reading. In the meantime he has his violation of probation hearing to deal with, so this isn't even his biggest worry at the moment.

All we can do is hope that it all works out.
 
Jeff Howe tweeted it 3 days ago, July 11th, at 2:52 pm.

https://twitter.com/jeffphowe/status/355414195833028609



I'm sorry if no one else has decided to report it. That doesn't make it any less true. Hell, it just speaks of shoddy reporting on the part of the other reporters. But that is par for the course. Especially when it comes to anything dealing with the Patriots of late.

If that is the case then I agree 100% that it should have been reported by many other outlets.

All I can do is read the forum's news headlines, hear what other posters are talking about, and read other news outlets regarding football. I couldn't possibly spend any more time talking about Pats related issues. If others didn't know it, it wasn't reported on the main site's news feed etc--then you can simply point it out, which I am glad that you did.

At any rate, there's nothing wrong with bringing up the possibility. It was certainly a reasonable thought considering his original charges, so don't jump on me personally for bringing something up that many other posters were discussing.
 
And this is Jeff Howe's original article about Dennard from your same timeframe (3 days ago), which examines how his potential cut would effect the salary cap and paints an extremely bleak picture, so let's not act like Howe was all over this news from the get go:

The Blitz with Jeff Howe & Karen Guregian | Boston Herald

If he dug up some new information since then, good for him for getting to the bottom of things, but one can only read so many articles and discuss it so long. If no one else comments about it, then we can't spread any new information amongst ourselves until we know.

The prospect of him not having a no-alcohol restriction in his probation terms is good news, but we're hardly in the clear yet. It will be a long 2 1/2 weeks before we find out what kind of implications this will have on his probation. All we can hope for is that the judge is in a good mood and allows the process to play out. In many instances he will check into the report himself (or obviously his staff will). If he feels the evidence and case is damning, he may indeed take action on the 31st, so we'll know much more about what kind of case the Nebraska cops have in regards to the DUI on 7/31 just based on the judge's actions.

If there is enough question as to his guilt or innocence then he will likely allow the situation to play out before taking action against him for violation of probation, so let's keep our fingers crossed.
 
You're a trip, dude.

Why don't you simply state that we know for sure (I hadn't heard otherwise), instead of acting like a douchebag? I hadn't heard Jeff Howe's comments, and apparently neither did a lot of people or they wouldn't have been asking about it. Thinking that someone may have a no-alcohol clause in their probation that stemmed from a barfight is pretty reasonable, no?

I did state it. Earlier tonight.
http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...-dennard-arrested-dui-page55.html#post3487307

Maybe you should look in the mirror before saying I'm acting like a douchebag when I'm really not. If I had been, I'd have been calling you an idiot or a moron or other some such name.

What does "typical" even mean? I wished you well multiple times when you got married, and have always treated you respectfully. Unfortunately, you don't share the same respect to others, and your true colors have really been showing lately.

Sorry, but this is just plain ol' BS on your part. You have not always treated me respectfully. In fact, you were pretty disrespectful in your reply to me. Had I called you a douchbag, moron, or idiot, I'd understand it. However, all I did was point out how you'd ignored by previous posts about Jeff Howe.

You were 100% wrong about Hernandez being charged and the "fabrication of the media" conspiracy theory, and you've been wrong on many other accounts too (as we all are sometimes). You could use a lesson in humility and respect to others, and you take any kind of negative Patriots related information WAY too seriously--it's almost weird.

How could I have been "100% wrong about Hernandez" when I never stated a position on the Hernandez issue and, in fact, took a "Wait and See" approach. And there was plenty the media fabricated. You just chose to ignore it.

Have I been WRONG? Sure. Plenty. And I've admitted to it. PLENTY. People just have chosen to ignore those times when I've admitted to it..
 
Volume is different than pressure. The amount you blow into the machine is the volume. The pressure is how hard the air pushes against the objects. One is measure in Cubic Feet or Cubic Meters (or their deliniations) and the other is measured in Pound per Square Inch, Pascals, or Millibars.

According to the company that makes most of the breathalyzers, taking a deep breath and exhaling it normally is all that is needed, provided that the person has the mouthpiece properly in their mouth to ensure that outside air does not enter the machine. That is the responsibility of the administering officer.

Per the citation, Dennard supposedly didn't blow hard enough. Not that he didn't provide enough air to the machine. That would imply that there is a minimum PSI needed. Not a minimum volume needed. According to Dennard, the machine got a reading, both times, that was below the legal limit.

It sure sounds to me like the officer made something up to put Dennard in a bind because of being on probation instead of Dennard having actually done something wrong.

I didn't major in physics in college, so this might come across as a stupid question, but isn't volume of air related to pressure in a timed event ? If you don't blow hard enough, wouldn't that be "not providing enough air to the machine" ?
 
And according to both officers involved, Dennard was swerving, smelled like alcohol, and failed the field sobriety tests. The only way to tell for sure if from the video evidence, which is installed in many/most police cars and used as prosecuting evidence in court. That will be their most damning evidence, and the only way that this question will be answered.

Not sure how familiar you are with criminal activity, but the old "not blowing hard enough" trick is used very commonly in regards to giving DUI tests.

The "not blowing hard enough" to try and trick a breathalyzer is a myth. The issue isn't PSI, but VOLUME. And they are two totally different things as you know.

Can You Trick a Breathalyzer?


In reality, they don't need any video evidence. The fact that they'll have 2 sworn officers giving their side of things will be plenty, along with the fact that he supposedly failed the sobriety test, smelled like alcohol, and was committing an infraction to begin with re: swerving.

No, they didn't say he was swerving. They said he was straddling the line. And just because 2 sworn officers say something doesn't mean a damn thing. They do need the video evidence to corroborate their story.


His only real shot is getting the probable cause of the traffic stop thrown out, especially since he didn't give a blood test or an accurate reading. In the meantime he has his violation of probation hearing to deal with, so this isn't even his biggest worry at the moment.

All we can do is hope that it all works out.

I disagree. The traffic violation is one thing. The DUI and "Refusal to Take a Chemical Test" is another.

Nebraska is an "implied consent" state. And contrary to Pat68, Nebraska CAN ask you to take a breathalyzer or blood test PRIOR to your arrest. However, you can refuse either before or after and they cannot force you, though it does result in suspension of your license.

Nebraska DWI/DUI: Refusal to Take a Blood, Breath or Urine Test | drivinglaws.org

Nebraska Legislature
Nebraska Legislature

I noticed that the police report said that the standard FSTs were given at the scene, though no mention of pass or fail of those tests are in the report. I question what they mean by "adequate breath sample" at the station. The office models are typically top of the line and require the least amount of volume of exhaled CO2 to work.

Now, Dennard could have been belligerent by the time they got to the station and just flat out refused because he knew he passed the FSTs.

But, as you said, we can only hope it works out.
 
I didn't major in physics in college, so this might come across as a stupid question, but isn't volume of air related to pressure in a timed event ? If you don't blow hard enough, wouldn't that be "not providing enough air to the machine" ?

I took these definitions directly from Dictionary.com

Volume - the magnitude of the three-dimensional space enclosed within or occupied by an object, geometric solid, etc

Pressure - the exertion of force upon a surface by an object, fluid, etc., in contact with it

When talking about fluids such as air, you can have a large volume the exerts a low pressure or a low volume that exerts a high pressure. Or anything in between. It is only when the large volume is compressed that the pressure goes up.


In this case, if I were to take a deep breath and exhale slowly, then they could claim I "wasn't blowing hard enough" even though how hard I am exhaling is NOT what will make a difference to the machine according to the company that makes most of them. The machine works based on the volume of breath you exhale, not how hard you exhale it.
 
The "not blowing hard enough" to try and trick a breathalyzer is a myth. The issue isn't PSI, but VOLUME. And they are two totally different things as you know.

Can You Trick a Breathalyzer?




No, they didn't say he was swerving. They said he was straddling the line. And just because 2 sworn officers say something doesn't mean a damn thing. They do need the video evidence to corroborate their story.




I disagree. The traffic violation is one thing. The DUI and "Refusal to Take a Chemical Test" is another.

Nebraska is an "implied consent" state. And contrary to Pat68, Nebraska CAN ask you to take a breathalyzer or blood test PRIOR to your arrest. However, you can refuse either before or after and they cannot force you, though it does result in suspension of your license.

Nebraska DWI/DUI: Refusal to Take a Blood, Breath or Urine Test | drivinglaws.org

Nebraska Legislature
Nebraska Legislature

I noticed that the police report said that the standard FSTs were given at the scene, though no mention of pass or fail of those tests are in the report. I question what they mean by "adequate breath sample" at the station. The office models are typically top of the line and require the least amount of volume of exhaled CO2 to work.

Now, Dennard could have been belligerent by the time they got to the station and just flat out refused because he knew he passed the FSTs.

But, as you said, we can only hope it works out.

I am a breathalyzer virgin (I've only undergone the roadside sobriety test). I have zero personal experience to draw upon. However, I would suspect you are right about 'tricking' the breathalyzer.......actually I should say I hope you are right. Because if force of exhale has a direct effect on the BAC reading (which suggests to me it is also a variable effect), IMHO the test itself is more suspect than it should be. 'You're not exhaling hard enough' is such a relative/judgment thing.

The link for cheating the breathalyzer you put up didn't work for me (fyi, it took me to a page rated by WOT as not entirely safe of spyware). However I did find an Arizona attorney's blog on the subject of tricking the breathalyzer. The Secret to Fooling a Breathalyzer Test: Vary Your Breathing Pattern and Avoid a DUI or DWI - Yahoo! Voices - voices.yahoo.com
While I could not find a specific reference on this webpage to trying/testing the method of 'don't exhale very hard', it did speak fairly widely on various tests they tried to see what could change the BAC reading. It did say breathing techniques were the only thing they found to have an effect. Yet, interestingly, making the test read a higher BAC was almost always the result. Here is what it said about getting a lower BAC "Hyperventilating for 20 seconds was the only technique to result in a lowered BAC". Of course I can't say this issue is addressed because it had no specific reference to the exhale force. Yet I'll temporarily assume that is the case considering they tried so many techniques to trick it that they would have mentioned 'exhale with as minimum force as possible to lower BAC'.

So what we have is two tests disregarded by the policeman. This suggests this was about disagreeing (for whatever his reasons) with the results. Further, someone mentioned Dennard failed the roadside test. But I also recall reading somewhere that, it was claimed, he passed the roadside test. To me what happened during the roadside test part is huge. Because if didn't pass it, the policeman seems to be on solid ground regarding disregarding the test results. But if he did pass the roadside test (whatever passing is equivalent to), considering two breathalyzer tests were passed, this case deserves close inspection for its validity. I know some cop cars carry cameras (from watching TV :D). I hope the roadside test was in its field of view. IMHO if it shows him performing it well, this case becomes weak.
Look, it's completely unfair to paint all police with one broad brush. Within a group of 1000 people, you will get varying types of good or bad behavior depending on the person. I have always believed that most police have a strong sense of fairness underneath it all. However, at least where I grew up but I suspect most everywhere, when you attack a cop (in this instance a punch), you are now very much 'noted' (and that is putting it nicely) among the police brotherhood. So if he passed the roadside test too, I now begin to suspect an element of this 'noting' is involved.

Edit: I did one more search and found this: Because holding your breath will increase the BAC reading while hyperventilating before blowing will lower BAC, Cops want you to take a deep breath and blow hard (I interpret his suggestion to mean the police want to get a bit of the 'holding your breath' effect). He also point blank says the test "do not require the person to blow hard". He claims the requirements of the test are about a 7 second uninterrupted exhale....with a "normal" exhale....like into a straw. IF that is correct, to me that suggests the force of exhale needed for a true reading is not big at all. It also suggests police want to achieve the upper level of the reading (with the proviso that of course they do..... as well as what I was reading is from a lawyer). It also suggests that if Dennard was truly not blowing hard enough, he was REALLY not blowing much at all.
Which begs the question, in this day of technology, they can't put a sensor on there that measures the force of exhale which will cause the reading to say 'insufficient air flow"?
 
Guess you missed the part where there was no clause prohibiting Dennard from drinking alcohol in his probation. Typical. You believe Florio over Jeff Howe.

I searched throughout the internet for the terms of his probation, I was not able to find them as the post conviction documents were sealed upon request of the defense. Where did you find or hear the terms of his probation?
 
Respectively (I will follow Supa's excellent example of respectful posts, it is why I enjoy reading him so much) that turns out not to be the case. Your definition of pressure is close enough. However, "the amount you blow into the machine" is not volume, it is mass or number of molecules, directly proportional to both volume and pressure, inversely proportional to temperature. As an example, if you add air to your tire, the volume remains approximately the same, but the mass of air (or number of molecules) increases.

I never thought that elementary thermodynamics (and the ideal gas law) would ever be the subject of a PatFans post, I thought it was about football :D



Volume is different than pressure. The amount you blow into the machine is the volume. The pressure is how hard the air pushes against the objects. One is measure in Cubic Feet or Cubic Meters (or their deliniations) and the other is measured in Pound per Square Inch, Pascals, or Millibars.

According to the company that makes most of the breathalyzers, taking a deep breath and exhaling it normally is all that is needed, provided that the person has the mouthpiece properly in their mouth to ensure that outside air does not enter the machine. That is the responsibility of the administering officer.

Per the citation, Dennard supposedly didn't blow hard enough. Not that he didn't provide enough air to the machine. That would imply that there is a minimum PSI needed. Not a minimum volume needed. According to Dennard, the machine got a reading, both times, that was below the legal limit.

It sure sounds to me like the officer made something up to put Dennard in a bind because of being on probation instead of Dennard having actually done something wrong.
 
if i were a betting man, i'd lay money that this gets thrown out of court, and that he MIGHT get nailed on a traffic violation


police use any excuse to pull people over at 2am......which i am ok with, within reason


police pull this car over....recognize the name....think no animosity exists?


dennard passes road side tests.....so they give him a breathalyzer

he passes twice....they claim he didn't do the test properly, arrest him anyways, and than do NOT administer a blood test?

any lawyer worth a damn, looking at the history in this case, gets this thrown out pretty easily


unless there's video that shows him failing field sobriety tests, or clearly messing with the breathalyzer, or refusing blood test, this is a no-brainer



based on what i've seen so far, i am not sure what to think....but the above scenario is very plausible imho
 
Respectively (I will follow Supa's excellent example of respectful posts, it is why I enjoy reading him so much) that turns out not to be the case. Your definition of pressure is close enough. However, "the amount you blow into the machine" is not volume, it is mass or number of molecules, directly proportional to both volume and pressure, inversely proportional to temperature. As an example, if you add air to your tire, the volume remains approximately the same, but the mass of air (or number of molecules) increases.

I never thought that elementary thermodynamics (and the ideal gas law) would ever be the subject of a PatFans post, I thought it was about football :D

P*V=n*R*T 10 characters
 
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