Moss this season...

[wiggins!]

I've got to vent. Sorry. Shoot me.

This goes out to media mainly and also people on this board.

To those who wondered why Randy Moss hadn't been putting up the numbers like he did last year, to those who didn't think Randy Moss was trying hard enough and to those who just wanted Matt Cassel to force the ball in - throw it to moss at all costs - here's the new message for all of you:

STFU

Again, if you didn't hear that loudly enough the first time - S-T-F-U.

You have proven you don't know jack sh&T about football. You have proven that all you're concerned about is a contrieved story line or your precious fantasy numbers.

Simple fact, Moss has been getting double and sometimes triple teamed all year long.

Simple fact, far too many people wanted to ignore this (both in the media (felger) and on this board).

Simple fact, Cassel was told / understands not to force the ball into double coverage as that leads to turnovers.

Final simple fact, if you play single coverage on Moss, Cassel will quickly become the best quarterback in the NFL and Moss will have a bronze bust in Canton before the season is done.

Enough. I don't want to hear anymore about how Moss hasn't been trying hard or that he's not getting enough balls. Yesterday (sunday) was proof enough of how this season has played out - if you've been paying attention - and unfortunately I don't think everyone has been.

 

[DarrylS]

Re: Moss this season.....

Single coverage helps a whole lot also..

 

[wiggins!]

Re: Moss this season.....

Single coverage helps a whole lot also..

Final simple fact, if you play single coverage on Moss, Cassel will quickly become the best quarterback in the NFL and Moss will have a bronze bust in Canton before the season is done.

Maybe I didn't make it clear enough that was the point of the rant!

 

[BlitzFritz]

Re: Moss this season.....

good point. nice passions.
can i add one other thought?

now that BB/JM have gradually built Cassel's confidence up and are opening him up more, they might even throw to Randy once in awhile when he's doubled now, for specific routes (slants, outs)

 

[swheeler23]

Re: Moss this season.....

Moss is the mvp of this 2008 team. Without Moss no one would be talking about how great Cassel is. He opens up the entire offense .Moss can change a defense just by going on the field.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Moss this season.....

Some fair points to be sure but if you also can't see the difference beyond coverage yesterday then you're as guilty as those you choose to tell off. Moss' effort has not been lacking but his focus has been inconsistent on a team that needed that more than ever. He snapped out of it mid afternoon yesterday and it showed. He fought to make catches thereafter even against single coverage, and when he does that he can even beat double and triple coverage on occasion - as he did through the first 12 weeks of 2007. That's why he's a HOF'er. For this team to succeed in the face of all that has befallen it this year he has to be that player pretty much every week. That will elevate the performances of those around him (in part because it aleviates the pressure on them to do more than their job to try to fill the voids). Like Bill always says, just do your job and we will win...

 

[swheeler23]

Re: Moss this season.....

Some fair points to be sure but if you also can't see the difference beyond coverage yesterday then you're as guilty as those you choose to tell off. Moss' effort has not been lacking but his focus has been inconsistent on a team that needed that more than ever. He snapped out of it mid afternoon yesterday and it showed. He fought to make catches thereafter even against single coverage, and when he does that he can even beat double and triple coverage on occasion - as he did through the first 12 weeks of 2007. That's why he's a HOF'er. For this team to succeed in the face of all that has befallen it this year he has to be that player pretty much every week. That will elevate the performances of those around him (in part because it aleviates the pressure on them to do more than their job to try to fill the voids). Like Bill always says, just do your job and we will win...

I couldnt see yesterdays game. My comment was based on the entire season.

 

[mgteich]

Re: Moss this season.....

Moss had many catches in double coverage last year. Brady was willing to risk the pick.

 

[wiggins!]

Re: Moss this season.....

"Moss' effort has not been lacking but his focus has been inconsistent on a team that needed that more than ever."

Mo, you make a good point with this one. It's not defendable but I think it's understandable and it's something that every great athlete has to overcome.

There are times when I'm watching the games and I know the ball is going to moss and moss knows the ball isn't going to moss. And this has happened more often than not this year and when it does go to him, there have been times where he's had a case of the drops. No question.

I was ranting on the overriding point of "just throw it up to randy" or the "he's not trying" crowd.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Moss this season.....

Some fair points to be sure but if you also can't see the difference beyond coverage yesterday then you're as guilty as those you choose to tell off. Moss' effort has not been lacking but his focus has been inconsistent on a team that needed that more than ever. He snapped out of it mid afternoon yesterday and it showed. He fought to make catches thereafter even against single coverage, and when he does that he can even beat double and triple coverage on occasion - as he did through the first 12 weeks of 2007. That's why he's a HOF'er. For this team to succeed in the face of all that has befallen it this year he has to be that player pretty much every week. That will elevate the performances of those around him (in part because it aleviates the pressure on them to do more than their job to try to fill the voids). Like Bill always says, just do your job and we will win...

Just to take this further, all one needs to do is get the tape of the San Diego tape and compare it to the tape of yesterday's Miami game. Some of you may remember the Moss defenders pulling "but he's fooling the db by not jumping for the ball" out of their backsides when people questioned Moss' effort on the deep balls thrown to him that game. Well, taking a look at the Deep throw down the left sideline in the Miami game, we see Moss actually jumping for the ball. So much for fooling the defender.

There's a difference between dogging it and not giving maximum effort and focus. I don't think any honest evaluator can make the claim that Moss was giving maximum effort and focus earlier in the season, especially give BB's comments about the team soon after that game.

 

[JSn]

Re: Moss this season.....

Just to take this further, all one needs to do is get the tape of the San Diego tape and compare it to the tape of yesterday's Miami game. Some of you may remember the Moss defenders pulling "but he's fooling the db by not jumping for the ball" out of their backsides when people questioned Moss' effort on the deep balls thrown to him that game. Well, taking a look at the Deep throw down the left sideline in the Miami game, we see Moss actually jumping for the ball. So much for fooling the defender.

There's a difference between dogging it and not giving maximum effort and focus. I don't think any honest evaluator can make the claim that Moss was giving maximum effort and focus earlier in the season, especially give BB's comments about the team soon after that game.

Watch the game again. On easier catches he still didn't show his hands until the last second. I'm not saying he was always playing 100%, but he was playing.

 

[Fixit]

Re: Moss this season.....

I've noticed that the only time he draws a flag for defensive PI is when he makes the catch. Otherwise, he might have to get stabbed to see a flag.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Moss this season.....

Watch the game again. On easier catches he still didn't show his hands until the last second. I'm not saying he was always playing 100%, but he was playing.

That's the point, actually. He adjusted and put in the effort on the difficult catch in a way he didn't in the Chargers game. As I noted, there's a difference between dogging it and just not giving it your maximum effort and attention. Looking at the two games, the difference is like night and day.

 

[PrairiePat]

Re: Moss this season.....

How do you explain the TD last year against Miami when Brady just threw it up to the endzone and Moss did the hide-the-hands thing, no jump, and caught it for the TD? Dogging it then too? How about the Buffalo TD catch last year along the right sideline when he did the exact same thing?

Different situations require different tactics. Sometimes the defender just makes a play - it happens. Sometimes the defender is in position, and maybe Moss feels he can make a play by out jumping him - maybe it's even based on the defender he's playing against. How do you know otherwise for sure?

Yesterday Moss got the better of the Miami guys, who were sometimes in pretty good position on the throws. Sometimes he doesn't. It's pretty arrogant to assume you know that he was 'dogging' it on those other plays.

 

[Leave No Doubt]

Re: Moss this season.....

Moss had many catches in double coverage last year.

Yup he did, in fact didn't teams have to triple him to completely shut him down? Obviously it depended on how good the players were but still you're right. Moss parted the seas last season.

I'm not complaining about him btw; he's made some amazing catches this season and we really can't discount the initial Cassel effect on the entire offense.

The most important thing is the whole offense is really coming together nicely, no doubt in large part due to the leadership evolution of Matty Ice

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Moss this season.....

How do you explain the TD last year against Miami when Brady just threw it up to the endzone and Moss did the hide-the-hands thing, no jump, and caught it for the TD? Dogging it then too? How about the Buffalo TD catch last year along the right sideline when he did the exact same thing?

Different situations require different tactics. Sometimes the defender just makes a play - it happens. Sometimes the defender is in position, and maybe Moss feels he can make a play by out jumping him - maybe it's even based on the defender he's playing against. How do you know otherwise for sure?

Yesterday Moss got the better of the Miami guys, who were sometimes in pretty good position on the throws. Sometimes he doesn't. It's pretty arrogant to assume you know that he was 'dogging' it on those other plays.

Belichick himself called out the team not long after the Chargers game, and Moss has been a changed man since then.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Moss this season.....

That's the point, actually. He adjusted and put in the effort on the difficult catch in a way he didn't in the Chargers game. As I noted, there's a difference between dogging it and just not giving it your maximum effort and attention. Looking at the two games, the difference is like night and day.

Are you still spouting this damn nonsense? Seriously, you are judging the difficulty of the catch based on the outcome. I'm pretty sure I'll take Moss' judgement over yours on how to play a ball in the air 110 times out of 100. But you continue to criticize the guy for not being perfect, I mean damn we need something to kvetch about.

 

[dhamz]

Re: Moss this season.....

There is a difference between execution and effort or "focus."

The interception early in the game wasn't a lack of effort or focus but a play he just didn't make or if you prefer a play the other guy did make. It was the same type of play his detractors here and in the media have been pointing at all year. How did Randy Moss get outfought for a ball by a lesser player - clearly he is not putting forth the effort, he isn't focused.

They just can't point to it today because it looks absurd to call him out for lack of effort because of his execution on other plays yesterday.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Moss this season.....

There is a difference between execution and effort or "focus."

The interception early in the game wasn't a lack of effort or focus but a play he just didn't make or if you prefer a play the other guy did make. It was the same type of play his detractors here and in the media have been pointing at all year. How did Randy Moss get outfought for a ball by a lesser player - clearly he is not putting forth the effort, he isn't focused.

They just can't point to it today because it looks absurd to call him out for lack of effort because of his execution on other plays yesterday.

Exactly, and it all boils down to unreal expectations and his negative reputation sparked by his always-taken-out-of-context quote.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Moss this season.....

Exactly, and it all boils down to unreal expectations and his negative reputation sparked by his always-taken-out-of-context quote.

No, it doesn't, except for those like yourself and dhamz who refuse to acknowledge the fact that something hasn't been right with this offense since last December... And anyone who dares point that out is accused of using terms like dogging it although they've made no such claims. This is why we can't have rational discussions here, entrenched opinions based on an irrational determination to perceive some subjects as off limits...