Wickersham book discussion

[goheels22002]

Kraft: "Bill was an idiot savant... I gave him this opportunity"

Well, it takes one to know one. Maybe Mr. Kraft ought to stop throwing stones after getting caught having his Bentley waxed at the Orchids of Asia on his way to the AFC Championship game. If Belichick is an idiot savant, his boss is just an idiot.

The joys of unattributed quotes.... Seth Wickersham (emphasis on "sham") has a history of profiteering on 7th-grade gossip about the Patriots. He was a douche about Deflategate, and he's a douche about this.

 

[goheels22002]

Thought I’d make one topic for this where it all can go in here.

NFL Rumors: Why Bill Belichick, Eric Mangini Nearly Had Fistfight In 2008

Bill Belichick reportedly nearly had a fistfight with former Patriots defensive coordinator Eric Mangini at the 2008 league meetings.

nesn.com

Belichick nearly had a fist fight with Eric the Rat?

“At the 2008 league meetings, Belichick and then-New York Jets head coach Eric Mangini nearly had a fistfight,” ESPN wrote. “After a dinner for head coaches, Julie Mangini, wife of Eric, bumped into Belichick and said hi, trying to ease tension after the post-Spygate fallout. Belichick blew her off, and when she told Eric what had happened, he charged across the room and needed to be held back by other coaches from swinging at Belichick. ‘Hey Bill, (expletive) you!’ Mangini yelled.”

The thought of Mangini charging across a room makes me think it was more likely that he wanted to be the first guy at the Golden Corral Chocolate Wonder Fall than start a fight with Bill Belichick. Wickersham is so full of sh*t.

 

[StrawHatPatriot]

"There was a story - in free agency, one of the teams, they were interested, and all of a sudden, they weren't interested at the very end," Brady said. "I was sitting there thinking, 'You're sticking with that mother****er? Are you serious?'"

The 43-year-old added: "When I look back, I'm like, 'There's no ****ing way I would've went to that team.' But they said they didn't want me, and I know what that means, I know what that feels like. And I'm going to **** you up because of that."

I dont think he's talking about SF/JimmyG. He said no way he would have went there. Maybe TEN?

SF could still fit. The team did deteriorate with injuries. And he probably doesn't trust Shanahan.

Whenever a player hinted at his or the Patriots' confidence to the media, Belichick would humiliate him before the team. "We don't need any more State of the Unions. Shut the f--- up. How about that? Just shut the f--- up." On some days, he left players more confused than angry. The offense kept fumbling in practice, so Belichick ordered all of the footballs soaked in water. "Wet that s--- up," Belichick said.

Belichick dismissed anything positive an outsider might say about the team -- or for that matter, even an insider. In early November, Stallworth was making an appearance at a local event, when a reporter from the Boston Herald showed up. The reporter was working on a glowing story on Randy Moss's unprecedented year. Stallworth had been avoiding the reporter for days, worried that if he spoke publicly about anything other than the next game, Belichick would notice -- and would let him have it in front of the entire team. The reporter told Stallworth that every other Patriots receiver had cooperated, so Stallworth decided to give a few kind quotes about Moss.

The day the story ran, Belichick arrived at the team meeting holding it. He was in a foul mood. "What was one of the first things I told you f---ing a--holes at the first meeting? Speak for yourself. There's one group that doesn't understand what the f--- that means -- the receivers."

There was nowhere for the wideouts to hide. What had been said couldn't be unsaid. They had no choice but to take what was coming. Belichick proceeded to rip each receiver who was quoted in the story by name, as if checking a list. Welker. Stallworth. Jabar Gaffney. When Belichick reached Chad Jackson, a disappointing second-round draft pick from 2006, he said, "Chad Jackson, you haven't done s--- all year. You're not talking to the media the rest of the year." After a few minutes, Belichick added, "I told you ass----- to speak for yourself."

-------------------------
Really sounds like Bill was walking a fine line in the locker room and he wasn't far off from losing his players. It really is amazing BB could keep this exact same attitude for so many years and players still buy in to his way.

It's easier to this as a coach when you have someone like Brady that can get others to buy in, and you have undrafted free agents who have no other choice.

This year is interesting. We don't have Brady, and we don't have Cam who the players like. We have a rookie QB, who, although good, doesn't come across as energetic, and have a bunch of new guys.

Bill's coaching philosophy works, but it still relies too much on having Brady.

 

[‘Mondre]

If the Brady stuff is true that’s upsetting

 

[sieglo]

• Toward the end of the dynastic run, Belichick commissioned an internal study to examine the traits of transcendent athletes. Jordan, Bryant, Woods and Brady were interviewed, among others. The study revealed that while the motivations of the rest of the elite athletes centered around the themes of rage and manufactured conflict, Brady was different. He felt most at the peak of his powers "not when he was measuring the size of the chip on his shoulder, but when he was in a loving and supportive environment," Wickersham writes

So Brady wanted to be coddled?

Brady is a Jedi versus others who are Sith.

 

[Reubski23]

If the Brady stuff is true that’s upsetting

? what Brady stuff

 

[farn]

? what Brady stuff

None of it is upsetting. None. There were two decades of winning + 6 SB rings. The only upsetting parts are the lost SBs. Who cares about the real, or perceived, drama ?

None of these people are our friends. None. They play for the team we (some of us) root for and we want them to win. Let’s see how this rebuild goes. If they win, it’s awesome. If not, it’s frustrating. The in house drama is fine - as long as they win.

 

[sb1]

Found this nugget in the clip of the preview re Deflategate:
"...but then Goodell noticed how the quarterback discussed in detail how he made sure the refs saw a sheet of paper with the rules highlighted after the Jets game."

That was the game where they overinflated the footballs because let's face it neither the refs or the league gave a crap about this stuff before Deflategate and they don't give a crap about it today. I think all of us figured any adjustments that were made to the footballs after that came from that Jets game and this confirms it to me.

 

[sb1]

Wickersham also says what a lot of us know - Deflategate wasn't about an equipment violation. This was payback. Triggered by some anonymous "influential owner".

"Aaron Rodgers admitted within days of the AFC Championship Game that he preferred overinflated footballs and often filled them up past the permissible 13.5 psi just to see if he could get away with it. But the other force was so powerful that it was beyond the control of the league's most powerful team: payback. The widespread perception that Roger Goodell had given the Patriots a break on Spygate, followed by the league's stonewalling of Arlen Specter's investigation, shaped owner's expectations about how this new matter (Deflategate)- though laughable on its face - needed to be handled. The day after the AFC Championship game, an influential owner called Goodell, demanding the league outsource the investigation, a sentiment shared by many colleagues..."

"influential owner" to me would be Rooney, Johnson, Mara or Jerruh. Or even Ross, who already worked with Ted Wells.

 

[203Pat]

View attachment 36401

How would Wickersham know that Brady sensed this? Very possible and believable that he really did but seems like an embellishment to me...

I don't like the Drew slander two decades later.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Wickersham also says what a lot of us know - Deflategate wasn't about an equipment violation. This was payback. Triggered by some anonymous "influential owner".

"Aaron Rodgers admitted within days of the AFC Championship Game that he preferred overinflated footballs and often filled them up past the permissible 13.5 psi just to see if he could get away with it. But the other force was so powerful that it was beyond the control of the league's most powerful team: payback. The widespread perception that Roger Goodell had given the Patriots a break on Spygate, followed by the league's stonewalling of Arlen Specter's investigation, shaped owner's expectations about how this new matter (Deflategate)- though laughable on its face - needed to be handled. The day after the AFC Championship game, an influential owner called Goodell, demanding the league outsource the investigation, a sentiment shared by many colleagues..."

"influential owner" to me would be Rooney, Johnson, Mara or Jerruh. Or even Ross, who already worked with Ted Wells.

My money is on ****face Mara.

 

[203Pat]

Whenever a player hinted at his or the Patriots' confidence to the media, Belichick would humiliate him before the team. "We don't need any more State of the Unions. Shut the f--- up. How about that? Just shut the f--- up." On some days, he left players more confused than angry. The offense kept fumbling in practice, so Belichick ordered all of the footballs soaked in water. "Wet that s--- up," Belichick said.

Belichick dismissed anything positive an outsider might say about the team -- or for that matter, even an insider. In early November, Stallworth was making an appearance at a local event, when a reporter from the Boston Herald showed up. The reporter was working on a glowing story on Randy Moss's unprecedented year. Stallworth had been avoiding the reporter for days, worried that if he spoke publicly about anything other than the next game, Belichick would notice -- and would let him have it in front of the entire team. The reporter told Stallworth that every other Patriots receiver had cooperated, so Stallworth decided to give a few kind quotes about Moss.

The day the story ran, Belichick arrived at the team meeting holding it. He was in a foul mood. "What was one of the first things I told you f---ing a--holes at the first meeting? Speak for yourself. There's one group that doesn't understand what the f--- that means -- the receivers."

There was nowhere for the wideouts to hide. What had been said couldn't be unsaid. They had no choice but to take what was coming. Belichick proceeded to rip each receiver who was quoted in the story by name, as if checking a list. Welker. Stallworth. Jabar Gaffney. When Belichick reached Chad Jackson, a disappointing second-round draft pick from 2006, he said, "Chad Jackson, you haven't done s--- all year. You're not talking to the media the rest of the year." After a few minutes, Belichick added, "I told you ass----- to speak for yourself."

-------------------------
Really sounds like Bill was walking a fine line in the locker room and he wasn't far off from losing his players. It really is amazing BB could keep this exact same attitude for so many years and players still buy in to his way.

This is the type of stuff that doesn't work when you're not winning.

 

[sb1]

WHat did the other owners want to happen after Spygate? For the Pats to be stripped of all their titles and the franchise to fold? LOL

 

[Ryan]

Unless Wickersham was given locker room access all these years or he's been interviewing former players with amazing memories, I don't see how he gets these quotes without at least some filling in the blanks or some exaggeration. Which means he's likely doing the same for everything else. I'm not saying some of this stuff didn't happen in some form, but it's likely not as he describes.

 

[Tottie]

When the NE OGs retire maybe we'll find out what really happened and I'm not talking about deflated balls or advanced signal scouting, I'm talking the politics behind the scenes. The league would be better off is purchasing a team was simply an investment and these diaper wearing billionaires didn't have access to anything.

 

[Steve102]

None of it is upsetting. None. There were two decades of winning + 6 SB rings. The only upsetting parts are the lost SBs. Who cares about the real, or perceived, drama ?

None of these people are our friends. None. They play for the team we (some of us) root for and we want them to win. Let’s see how this rebuild goes. If they win, it’s awesome. If not, it’s frustrating. The in house drama is fine - as long as they win.

This might be the most level headed take on this board, ever.

 

[203Pat]

WHat did the other owners want to happen after Spygate? For the Pats to be stripped of all their titles and the franchise to fold? LOL

I think they wanted Bill gone for good.

 

[archstanton543]

WHat did the other owners want to happen after Spygate? For the Pats to be stripped of all their titles and the franchise to fold? LOL

I'm with you on that. Goodell handed down historically hard penalties and that wasn't enough? I guess they wanted BB and/or TB banned for a year or for life or something?

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

I think they wanted Bill gone for good.

Ironic that flash forward a few years to this year and maybe half the Forum now agrees with the owners for the good of the 32!

 

[farn]

This is the type of stuff that doesn't work when you're not winning.

Ok. Were they winning ? Yes. Cool. Only thing that matters.

« this type of stuff doesn’t work when the ONLY THING THAT HAS EVER MATTERED… »

winning. Love winning.