You guys need to rebuild

[Garbanza]

funny post... givens=barely a #2 nfl WR.. willie=oldest LB in the NFL... sorry, career over...AV= LOL... 2 kicks... that's it... great move to dump him.

This post is a joke, right?

Why can't some of you just be honest?

 

[shakadave]

Retracing the history of this thread, SteelCity came in politely with a respectful question, and was insulted and trashed until he eventually threw down his politeness and --- then I didn't even read the last page worth. Yeah, we're in a bad mood today. No, we don't need to take it out on visiting post-ers.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

I can't believe all they key guys you guys have just lost.........

Givins is such a big game receiver.

Willie is huge in big games..... he causes so much havoc rushing the passer from just about any front 7 position. He is another big gamer.

Adam V.......... This guy's big game credentials are outstanding.

I hope nobody get offended by my post because I was just thinking about how great those players were in big games. Losing one of those guys would be a huge loss but losing all of them???? Wow....

No fans know more about replacing top players in FA than the Steelers. The good news here is Belichick seems to always pull the right strings. I think they can rebuild while staying a SB contender, but it's clear the Pats are eyeing something.

 

[SEA HAWKER]

Yeah stillers.com is a place that is full of nut cases, not just SteelerAl. There actually are a lot of similarities between bruinz and Al though. Its just sad that these guys go overboard all the time. Like I said before, guys like that need to calm down a bit and try not to take this stuff so seriously. You guys have some good posters here who no doubt have to deal with this guy everyday and I'm sure it wears on your nerves a little bit.

Its the same way on the steeler boards with these psychos.

Bruinz......... I'm not your enemy dude. I have no animosity towards you. Maybe a little pity, but no animosity.

The steelers suffered losses and they will hurt the team. But in all honesty, I can't equate those losses with the 3 big patriots. I'm just being honest.

Really, I think it sucks that the patriots lost those guys because they are guys that you identify with the patriots.

Shut your mouth Steel City. We beat you in the Super Bowl. Thank the refs for the trophy. Your team and all AFSt!nk teams suck.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Retooling...

Belichickfan....

I have always been very impressed with those 3 guys. In my opionion they were critical to the pats success in recent years.

I don't get how anybody can act like losing these 3 is nothing.....

Do you really think givens isn't a big deal? I think the guy is a heck of a posession receiver.

That 34 year old LB you speak of is a terror as a situation pass rusher. How many sacks did he register against the Jags? 3? 4?.... yeah... he's real washed up.

And how can you minimize your kicker? That's just insane.

SteelCity,


As fans of the two best managed clubs in the League, we have both seen respected players leave to get the "greener grass".

Seldom do they find it.

Both our teams will stay up near the top while we transition; we have done so yesterday, and will do so tommorrow. Actually you've been at it longer than us, and I recall Kraft saying he wanted to be a perennial contender like Pitt, and not point for a big year or two window, and then rebuild. That's your MO, and I think BB is copying it, frankly.

All three guys will be missed, of that I have no doubt. Willie was reaching the end, but he had a year or maybe two as a spot pass rusher to still give, as well as his locker room presence, as a pro's pro. He will be missed most of all.

AV was clutch, but in truth his leg was fading, even if his short range accuracy and clutch kicking (when within range) was not. One thing not noted about AV was that he was no fading daisy as a ikick coverage guy. I think he must have led the league in TD saving tackles over the years he was with the Pats.

Givens was a very good #2, but any #1, even a fading one like Key or Eric, would be an upgrade for a few years. Givens was young, but in this League no one seems to stay for a career, so what difference does potential additional years bring due to youth, when they will probably be spent elsewhere? I think BB wants to add soem age an dmaturity to his Offense because last year it was just TOO YOUNG and error prone. The O self-destructed in the Denver divisional game, making many youthful(??) mistakes.

I actually am more concerened with the loss all the easily replaced other guys, who added up to a lot of quality depth. Guys like Matt Chatham,
Tim Dwight, Steve Neal, Tom Ashworth. Even though we'll draft LBs high this year, and we have depth for Neal & Ashworth in Hochstein, Kayczur and maybe Britt along with Tucker, Yates and and Mruczkowski.

I actually think the plans to draft quality LBs early, was one of the reasons Willie was allowed to leave, they opted to open a position for the draftees to come.

I assure you that you can't relax, Next season will still be a Tong War between Pitt and the Pats....

 

[NE_Paddy]

AzPatsFan............

Superb post.

A salve for the silliness.

A balm for the bitterness.

 

[Welker83]

Some one needs to finish signing their UFA's...

 

[NE_Paddy]

One thing I do not understand is how just one montha go, AV was the most clutch kicker in history, who won us trophies, and today he's just a kicker, who's not all that impressive, and only accounted for 2 big kicks that anybody else could have made.

Whats going on here?

Why can't we just admit that he's a quality, but aging player who's time had come.

The only way to sustain success is to rebuild and rebuild and rebuild.

And rebuilding is painful.

But worth it.

Adam is a loss, so is Willie, so is Givens.

They will benefit their other teams. But they can be replaced.

It doesn't have to be one or the other. Just because they may do well at the next stop on their career journey's does not mean we were wrong to let them go.

It's all about pruning.

 

[godef]

I can't believe all they key guys you guys have just lost.........

Givins is such a big game receiver.

Willie is huge in big games..... he causes so much havoc rushing the passer from just about any front 7 position. He is another big gamer.

Adam V.......... This guy's big game credentials are outstanding.

I hope nobody get offended by my post because I was just thinking about how great those players were in big games. Losing one of those guys would be a huge loss but losing all of them???? Wow....

Rebuild? Oh please! Your Steelers got hot and won the Super Bowl (much like us in '01), but the Patriots are still a better and more complete team than the Steelers right now.

 

[jct]

This guy needs to go home and worry about his own teams FA looses.

 

[Ring 6]

One thing I do not understand is how just one montha go, AV was the most clutch kicker in history, who won us trophies, and today he's just a kicker, who's not all that impressive, and only accounted for 2 big kicks that anybody else could have made.

Whats going on here?

Why can't we just admit that he's a quality, but aging player who's time had come.

The only way to sustain success is to rebuild and rebuild and rebuild.

And rebuilding is painful.

But worth it.

Adam is a loss, so is Willie, so is Givens.

They will benefit their other teams. But they can be replaced.

It doesn't have to be one or the other. Just because they may do well at the next stop on their career journey's does not mean we were wrong to let them go.

It's all about pruning.

I think the difference is 2 months ago those that felt he was just a kicker who happened to come up big in a few spots (the Snow Bowl spearates him forever from anyone. The SB FGs do NOT mean as sometimnes suggested we won BECAUSE OF HIM. They were not difficult kicks. Because he didnt choke doesnt mean another K would have) had no reason to discuss it.

There are Adam loyalists (lovers) who will not consider the football side of the equation. And there are guys who are more concerned about the football side, but have a special admiration of AV.
There was never a reason for the 2nd group to diminish the touting by the first group.

What you are hearing now is reality.

Vinatieri is a good K.
He has been good in the clutch.
The Snow Bowl was ungodly.
The OTHER PLAYERS put him in a position to make SB winning kicks that 90% of NFL Ks should make.

He is not the 'face of Championships' for doing something extraordinary for his position, he is that face because the other players put him in position to convert an 80% shot and be labeled the hero.

He made them. The only different result of having a different K would be missing them. However the odds are at least 80/20 that the next best K we found would have ended up the 'hero', SNOW BOWL ASIDE/

 

[Steelgal]

I've been reading here for over a year, but finally decided to register a few weeks ago. Not here to talk trash because I can't stand trolls.

I think both the Steelers and Patriots have suffered losses this year in FA, but it's unknown yet which will hurt worse come next year. Until the draft and FA is over, there's no way to gauge yet.

As for us, I don't think the loss of El is huge. He wasn't a great #2 receiver and was more valued for his gadget plays and punt returns. And for the price he was paid, I say goodbye and goodluck. We definately need to draft or pick up another receiver/returner in his absence.

I think the loss of Bettis will sting most of all. His leadership to the team and mentoring of Willie was huge. Those are intangibles that can not be replaced by any new player, IMO. I think Duce will be able to carry to load of short yardage and goal line back, as long as he stays healthy. I'm hoping we draft a RB.

Kimo will also be missed for his leadership. While he's getting older, I still think he had another good year atleast, but not for the price he got from the Jets. I don't know alot about Keisel, but I know alot of fans are happy about him getting a chance at starting.

Chris Hope, I was never a huge fan of his. I know even less about Clark, his replacement, but hope he can fill in, and still let Troy work his magic :rocker:

As for the big 3 Patriot losses in FA, I think Givens is the least irreplaceable. From what I know about Willie, he seemed like a defensive leader and upstanding guy. While he is aging, I still think he had a couple of good years left, but not for the price Cleveland paid either. I think the loss of him and Kimo for us are similiar.

Regarding Adam, I know he's just a kicker, but a darn good one at that. Whenever he lined up, people thought it was automatic. Not sure you can say that about most other kickers. I think it'll be interesting to see who they replace him with.

 

[aabtec]

You actually think that losing those guys is not a big deal?

Willie may be the oldest LB in the league but he is an amazing situational pass rusher. If he was washed up, believe me no team would have been after him, much less give him a big contract.

some people on this board are in danile..and I don't mean the river
The Pats seem to be in a reloading year. so it will be interesting to how it plays out..the AFC has changes alot..The Steelers have lost the bus and randle -el, colts have losta LB and edge..the Dolphins got the captain of the Love Boat (Culpepper) and the Reskins..well the seem to be like the Borg..they are absorbing everyone...

 

[JoeSixPat]

I can't believe all they key guys you guys have just lost.........

Givins is such a big game receiver.

Willie is huge in big games..... he causes so much havoc rushing the passer from just about any front 7 position. He is another big gamer.

Adam V.......... This guy's big game credentials are outstanding.

I hope nobody get offended by my post because I was just thinking about how great those players were in big games. Losing one of those guys would be a huge loss but losing all of them???? Wow....

This is hilarious - a Steelers fan who isn't familiar with his own team.

The Steelers and Patriots are actually pretty comparable teams.

Was Plaxico Burress less of a big time player than Givens? I'd say he was MORE important to the team. But his price exceeded his value and the team moved on.

And what was the result of for the Steelers?


And of course now, Randel El is moving on - as well as some other key players.

I generally thought Steelers fans were pretty savvy about football. Guess I was wrong.

 

[Pats Fanatic]

I agree with you Joe, i think that is reason that The Patriots and the Steelers have been so good for so long is that they know when to let go and when to hold on to their players.

 

[SteelCity]

This is hilarious - a Steelers fan who isn't familiar with his own team.

The Steelers and Patriots are actually pretty comparable teams.

Was Plaxico Burress less of a big time player than Givens? I'd say he was MORE important to the team. But his price exceeded his value and the team moved on.

And what was the result of for the Steelers?


And of course now, Randel El is moving on - as well as some other key players.

I generally thought Steelers fans were pretty savvy about football. Guess I was wrong.

I've come back today and read all the posts that have been added since we started this thread last night. Most posters here sound very informed about their team and I give you guys all the credit you deserve.

What I don't understand is guys like this joesixpat who just come on here and start throwing insults around in response to my original post. The theme of my original post was that the guys you lost will be hard to replace.

As far as the steeler losses you cited in trying to draw a steeler comparison to the FA losses that the patriots just suffered, I have to disagree. Burress, although a great threat in the regular season, was always terrible in big games. By contrast, I have always thought of Willie, Adam and David as 3 of the better big game performers in the entire league. I can't compare those 3 studs to the steelers that have been lost recently.

Hey, I certainly can't predict the future and for all I know, the patiots could end up replacing these 3 greats. But forgive me if I have my doubts considering how great those 3 players were - especially in big games where championships are won.

 

[arrellbee]

Know when to hold 'em; know when to fold 'em.

In poker, you know which guys understand that - they have all of the chips at the end.

In NFL, you know which guys understand that - they take home the Lombardi.

 

[arrellbee]

Hey SteelCity. I'm glad you posted the thread. Amongst all the trash were some good posts. This morning, PatsFanInVa, dante828, AzPatsFan, NE Paddy, and Andy Johnson. Enjoyed the comments. And we even got a good post from Steelgal !! Not all is lost - just have to ignore the noise.

 

[SteelCity]

Hey SteelCity. I'm glad you posted the thread. Amongst all the trash were some good posts. This morning, PatsFanInVa, dante828, AzPatsFan, NE Paddy, and Andy Johnson. Enjoyed the comments. And we even got a good post from Steelgal !! Not all is lost - just have to ignore the noise.

A lot of you guys are good posters who have very well reasoned posts about your team's moves. Yeah there has been some noise but I should've expected it becuase I am from another team's board.

You guys made some good points and I appreciate the feedback.

 

[CrazyDave]

you're a clown