Who should have the Patriots taken at 48 instead of Wilson

[Sciz]

(And let's please not fool ourselves into believing that another team would've scooped up Wilson
btwn 48 & 59. We all know in our hearts that that wasn't going to happen, ever.)

There have been multiple rumors to the contrary.

 

[Sciz]

So you guys shelled me when I said Albert Hayneswoth would not last half the season.

That's not what you said. You said he would be cut by midseason. He wasn't cut by midseason. You bragged anyway. That's why nobody likes you.

 

[Off The Grid]

4 ~ As I've said before ~ and I'm surprised no one commented:The failure of the Patriots and the Broncos to get together on a trade for #62 could only have been on Elway, if you think it through. Rookie mistake.

It's not unreasonable to conclude that Elway was late getting it together for a 62 - 87 & 120 trade;

but with whom does the fault lie for not executing the 48 - 59 & 123 trade which GB eventually made for Philly's 51?

(And let's please not fool ourselves into believing that another team would've scooped up Wilson
btwn 48 & 59. We all know in our hearts that that wasn't going to happen, ever.)

1 ~ Well, I specifically cited that trade for #59 and #123, a few weeks ago, as what I would've done at #48 ~ based on far less information than Mad Bill, mind you ~ so you know how I feel about that move.

2 ~ But that doesn't make it a mistake, Brother Stone. It only means that I and Coach Bill diverge on what the best move was at that point. And I'm comfortable giving him the Benefit of the Doubt he richly deserves.

3 ~ None of us ~ and that includes Coach Bill, himself ~ will ever know if Wilson would've lasted to #59.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Lavonte David.

I'm fine with the Wilson pick for now until I see how he plays. But I thought David was one of the best defensive playmakers in the draft.

David might turn out to be a great player in the right system, but you KNOW that he doesn't fit BB's prototype mold at linebacker. Those guys he already took in Chandler in Hightower. David might turn out to be very successful in the NFL but given that BB already took TWO first round linebackers, I think it is understandable that he chose to address the secondary, which does have NEEDS, rather than take on an undersized LBer who has a high ceiling but likely doesn't fit BB's system.

 

[mayoclinic]

David might turn out to be a great player in the right system, but you KNOW that he doesn't fit BB's prototype mold at linebacker. Those guys he already took in Chandler in Hightower. David might turn out to be very successful in the NFL but given that BB already took TWO first round linebackers, I think it is understandable that he chose to address the secondary, which does have NEEDS, rather than take on an undersized LBer who has a high ceiling but likely doesn't fit BB's system.

As I've stated elsewhere in this thread, I have a particularly high opinion of David, to the point where I think he would have been successful regardless of the fact that he doesn't fit BB's prototype mold. But I agree with you - I think it's entirely understandable that BB passed on taking another LB, and as I've also stated elsewhere, I have no problem with the Wilson pick.

 

[IllegalContact]

konz, reyes, or worthy

you can never have too many of these trench guys.

konz would have been the best long term choice as
solder
mankins
konz
cannon
vollmer

seems excellent for the longer term. and even if vollmers injuries eventually get the best of him, move cannon to RT, konz to RG and inset connolly at C

 

[DaBruinz]

It's not unreasonable to conclude that Elway was late getting it together for a 62 - 87 & 120 trade;
but with whom does the fault lie for not executing the 48 - 59 & 123 trade which GB eventually
made for Philly's 51?

(And let's please not fool ourselves into believing that another team would've scooped up Wilson
btwn 48 & 59. We all know in our hearts that that wasn't going to happen, ever.)

You are making an assumption that Philly offered that trade to the Patriots.. If that offer wasn't there, then how could the Pats have made that trade?

 

[DaBruinz]

As I've stated elsewhere in this thread, I have a particularly high opinion of David, to the point where I think he would have been successful regardless of the fact that he doesn't fit BB's prototype mold. But I agree with you - I think it's entirely understandable that BB passed on taking another LB, and as I've also stated elsewhere, I have no problem with the Wilson pick.

Mayo - Do you feel that he is another Tedy Bruschi type of player? Is that why you have a high opinion on Lavonte David?

If that is the case, then I can understand why you have such a high opinion of him.

 

[mayoclinic]

Mayo - Do you feel that he is another Tedy Bruschi type of player? Is that why you have a high opinion on Lavonte David?

If that is the case, then I can understand why you have such a high opinion of him.

That's an interesting comparison. I hadn't thought of him in quite that way, but yeah, I see Bruchi-like instincts, heart and intangibles in David that outweigh any size limitations. 2 weeks after David transferred to Nebraska in 2010, DC Carl Pellini said that David might be the best player he'd ever coached, and that was right after Ndamukong Suh graduated. Again, it's just my personal opinion, and I accept that I'm skewed way to the right of where most people view David - as a very good tampa-2 prospect - but I see him as a "special" player despite his size who could succeed anywhere. It might take him longer in a different system, just as it took Bruschi a few years to develop. I'll probably end up being wrong - it's just my personal view, and I don't expect to convince others of it.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

That's not what you said. You said he would be cut by midseason. He wasn't cut by midseason. You bragged anyway. That's why nobody likes you.

My exact words (7/28):
"Mark my words...he will be gone by mid season"

He was cut on November 8, 2011. What was that? Week 9? Pretty close. And for that the Moderator put this thread on the Practice Squad.....ha!

 

[Sciz]

My exact words (7/28):
"Mark my words...he will be gone by mid season"

He was cut on November 8, 2011. What was that? Week 9? Pretty close. And for that the Moderator put this thread on the Practice Squad.....ha!

If I say that Welker is going to get a huge extension in the next year and he gets it on May 31, 2012, then I'm wrong. There's no close. There's right and wrong. You were wrong.

 

[captain stone]

That's an interesting comparison. I hadn't thought of him in quite that way, but yeah, I see Bruchi-like instincts, heart and intangibles in David that outweigh any size limitations. 2 weeks after David transferred to Nebraska in 2010, DC Carl Pellini said that David might be the best player he'd ever coached, and that was right after Ndamukong Suh graduated. Again, it's just my personal opinion, and I accept that I'm skewed way to the right of where most people view David - as a very good tampa-2 prospect - but I see him as a "special" player despite his size who could succeed anywhere. It might take him longer in a different system, just as it took Bruschi a few years to develop. I'll probably end up being wrong - it's just my personal view, and I don't expect to convince others of it.

There's little doubt in my mind that Bill would've found a way to use the unique skillset
of David to help this defense. But as VJC stated earlier, Bill had already taken 2 edge
defenders with his first 2 picks; taking a 3rd in a row might have exploded the messageboard.

I also understand the doubt in the minds of those who feel that he would not be a fit here.
But surely having one player who can do what he can do would not have been a bad thing
to have. I wouldn't want 4 Lavonte Davids at LB, however; but I wouldn't want 4 Brandon
Spikes, either.

(BTW, if David had been drafted, and he & Spikes had to run a lap during TC, would David
finish 2 laps before Spikes finished 1?)

 

[Sciz]

(BTW, if David had been drafted, and he & Spikes had to run a lap during TC, would David
finish 2 laps before Spikes finished 1?)

You know, for being so small, David isn't even that fast. At least Spikes is big for a linebacker. David is small and not even fast.

 

[Off The Grid]

That's not what you said.

You said he would be cut by midseason.

He wasn't cut by midseason.

You bragged anyway.

That's why nobody likes you.

I am CLEARLY wrestling with some HORRIBLE, deep-seated psychological issues, because for GOD only knows what reason, I can't stop CACKLING at this!!

 

[DaBruinz]

That's an interesting comparison. I hadn't thought of him in quite that way, but yeah, I see Bruchi-like instincts, heart and intangibles in David that outweigh any size limitations. 2 weeks after David transferred to Nebraska in 2010, DC Carl Pellini said that David might be the best player he'd ever coached, and that was right after Ndamukong Suh graduated. Again, it's just my personal opinion, and I accept that I'm skewed way to the right of where most people view David - as a very good tampa-2 prospect - but I see him as a "special" player despite his size who could succeed anywhere. It might take him longer in a different system, just as it took Bruschi a few years to develop. I'll probably end up being wrong - it's just my personal view, and I don't expect to convince others of it.

Ok. Though we disagree on what schemes David fits in, I can understand why you would think he'd be successful here, taking those things into consideration. After all, Bruschi wasn't a "prototypical" ILB either at just over 6' and around 250 lbs. . But he definitely got the most out of his physical and mental abilities once he'd been in the system for a few years..

 

[DaBruinz]

You know, for being so small, David isn't even that fast. At least Spikes is big for a linebacker. David is small and not even fast.

4.65 is plenty fast. Granted, he's only 233 lbs, but I could see him putting on 10 lbs and not losing a step. Particularly since he is game fast as well.

 

[Ivan]

Q
Is there some rule where we all have to be Pollyannas? "Oh l love everything Bill did. He can do no wrong. Whoever he picked is perfect. Oh please Mr Monitor; make Fred stop--he is being soooo mean."

This is how desperate your hating has become Fred, it doesn't require some homer post where people gush praise on Belichick, a player, or their play, it simply requires that people don't join you on sh.tting all over Belichick, a player, or their play etc..... You cannot come up with one person who is claiming that the Wilson pick was some incredible pick that they love, or gushing over Belichick for being so smart that he saw something no-one else did. Now anyone who doesn't join you in claiming that Wilson sucks or that Belichick "panicked," which is completely ludicrous, is a "Pollyanna."


As for "Fred being so mean.....," it is really more that you are an incessant douchebag who tries but always fails to be smarter than everyone else and always looks for the most negative spin he can find on any issue related to the Patriots. You aren't hurting anyone's feeling Fred you are just wholly dedicated to being as big a turd as possible.

Go ahead and show us the posts gushing over Belichick's choice of Tavon Wilson, or Wilson himself, you can't, because they actually don't exist, that's just another strawman created to make it look like you have an opponent to argue against, when in truth all anyone is saying is that the kid deserves a chance to show if he can play before being labelled garbage by people like you.

So show us those posts Fred, or shut your piehole.

 

[State]

I guess you haven't looked at this teams center depth lately. Besides Connolly and Koppen, they have Wendell and McDonald. McDonald played extremely well last year in his 2 starts. He's YOUNG and, with the re-signing of Connolly and Koppen, may force the Patriots to cut Wendell. You seem to need reminding that the Pats made it a point to keep McDonald even after Connolly and Wendell were both healthy.

It became clear to me when the Patriots re-signed both Connolly and Koppen that they were not going to draft a center and felt that needs in other areas were of bigger importance. They clearly also felt that, because the needs were more in other areas, that Konz wouldn't provide them the value they were looking for in the 2nd round.

Excellent analysis, DaBruinz.

I think Nick McDonald is the most underrated player on the team right now. He'll contend for a starting position, just being beat out by Connolly.

Koppen, who loses weight as the season goes on making him a liability against huge NTs, could find himself at the season's beginning as the third-string center. A position of luxury for the Pats.

I do think that not drafting one of the stud DTs, like the UConn player or Jerel Worthy, will come back to bite us. That's assuming Tavon would have been available latter in the round. I think that's a safe assumption, unnamed minor scout rumors to the contrary.

 

[mayoclinic]

\I think Nick McDonald is the most underrated player on the team right now. He'll contend for a starting position, just being beat out by Connolly.

Koppen, who loses weight as the season goes on making him a liability against huge NTs, could find himself at the season's beginning as the third-string center. A position of luxury for the Pats.

I tend to agree with you. I'm not sure McDonald will progress quickly enough to beat out Koppen at the beginning of the season, but I suspect that by the end of the year he will be the #2 center, and possibly be ready to leapfrog Connolly. I concur with your assessment that he is one of the most underrated players on the team right now, and that he has the potential to project to a long term starting position at center or guard.

 

[everlong]

This has probably been pointed out previously but none of the Patriots draft choices this year were taken in a position of where the Patriots originally held the pick. Found it interesting but not enough to start another thread.


1 21 (21) Chandler Jones DE 6-5 265 Syracuse from Bengals

1 25 (25) Dont'a Hightower ILB 6-4 260 Alabama from Broncos

2 16 (48) Tavon Wilson SS 6-0 205 Illinois from Raiders

3 27 (90) Jake Bequette DE 6-5 271 Arkansas from Packers

6 27 (197) Nate Ebner DB 6-0 205 Ohio St. from Packers

7 17 (224) Alfonzo Dennard CB 5-10 205 Nebraska from Packers through Jets

7 28 (235) Jeremy Ebert from Packers

I wonder if that's ever happened before with that many picks.