So regardless of the outcome with Berman, this needs to get bigger than just the Pats

[XLIX]

Given how the league is ran do you really think the league was forthright with the PA? Or do you think they strong armed the PA and then leaked the reports you speak of?

I am not sure I understand what you are saying. While people may disagree on what the outcome should have been, nobody seems to disagree as to the facts of the situation as far as I know.

I hate all involved parties and I can't wait until the next time some other team feels they are being treated unfairly - especially if it's Dallas.

 

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

I am not sure I understand what you are saying. While people may disagree on what the outcome should have been, nobody seems to disagree as to the facts of the situation as far as I know.

I hate all involved parties and I can't wait until the next time some other team feels they are being treated unfairly - especially if it's Dallas.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...lpas-collusion-complaint-againt-league-teams/

A federal appeals court Friday reinstated the NFL Players Association’s collusion claim accusing the league and its teams of operating with a secret and improper salary cap in the sport’s uncapped year in 2010.

Besides the NFLPA I guess...

 

[flasox27]

How can Goodell possibly keep his job if the Brady arbitration award blows up like we expect/hope it will?

He'll be like Mike Nifong of the Duke Lacrosse scandal. Yeah, many of the "superfans" may not care if Brady and the Patriots were wrongfully harassed with a malicious prosecution but casual fans and fair minded non fans should side with us Patriots fans on the issue of how Goodell should be dealt with when this is over.

I mean, were North Carolina fans rushing to Nifong's defense after his misconduct was exposed?

I am just trying to present the view of people outside New England with whom I deal with in South Florida.
In their minds, Brady has cheated and the Pats have cheated and nothing will change this regardless of how the case comes out. If Goodell loses the case it will not because he was wrong it will be because the Pats were better at hiding the evidence. Goodell is hated without doubt but the Pats are hated far more. This attitude goes back to the camera placement fiasco when Goodell trashed the reputation of the Pats with the total complicity of Kraft. Once it was established with the destruction of the tapes that eliminated exculpatory evidence combined with the gag order on explanation of what the violation was, it was etched in stone. This is just the next incident in the litany of Goodell's actions to which Kraft acquiesced as a sign of guilt in people's minds. Let me say that the unjust persecution of Brady does not stirrup protest groups like Goodell's handling of the wife beater did and we all know who was the first to circle the wagon around Goodell when he was vulnerable. I also believe that the vast majority of the other owners including Rooney and Mara who really count are supporting Goodell and will continue to do so for various reasons including jealousy and the fan base and media will follow suit. Even if Goodell loses the court case he has already won a victory for the other teams in having Kraft surrender the draft picks.
Sorry to say the fair minded people that you are counting on do not exist in 44 states.

 

[PatsSox363804]

I am just trying to present the view of people outside New England with whom I deal with in South Florida.
In their minds, Brady has cheated and the Pats have cheated and nothing will change this regardless of how the case comes out. If Goodell loses the case it will not because he was wrong it will be because the Pats were better at hiding the evidence. Goodell is hated without doubt but the Pats are hated far more. This attitude goes back to the camera placement fiasco when Goodell trashed the reputation of the Pats with the total complicity of Kraft. Once it was established with the destruction of the tapes that eliminated exculpatory evidence combined with the gag order on explanation of what the violation was, it was etched in stone. This is just the next incident in the litany of Goodell's actions to which Kraft acquiesced as a sign of guilt in people's minds. Let me say that the unjust persecution of Brady does not stirrup protest groups like Goodell's handling of the wife beater did and we all know who was the first to circle the wagon around Goodell when he was vulnerable. I also believe that the vast majority of the other owners including Rooney and Mara who really count are supporting Goodell and will continue to do so for various reasons including jealousy and the fan base and media will follow suit. Even if Goodell loses the court case he has already won a victory for the other teams in having Kraft surrender the draft picks.
Sorry to say the fair minded people that you are counting on do not exist in 44 states.

True. Even here in New Orleans where the fans know first hand about screw jobs and absolutely hate Goodell you still hear people saying "yeah but the Pats are long established cheaters so they probably did it." Granted you have a good number of people like Pherin who don't buy the leagues BS but the leagues stranglehold on the media and narrative is tough to break through and you just end up sounding like a maniac when talking about this to non Pats fans.

 

[YOUGOTMOSSED]

I am just trying to present the view of people outside New England with whom I deal with in South Florida.
In their minds, Brady has cheated and the Pats have cheated and nothing will change this regardless of how the case comes out. If Goodell loses the case it will not because he was wrong it will be because the Pats were better at hiding the evidence. Goodell is hated without doubt but the Pats are hated far more. This attitude goes back to the camera placement fiasco when Goodell trashed the reputation of the Pats with the total complicity of Kraft. Once it was established with the destruction of the tapes that eliminated exculpatory evidence combined with the gag order on explanation of what the violation was, it was etched in stone. This is just the next incident in the litany of Goodell's actions to which Kraft acquiesced as a sign of guilt in people's minds. Let me say that the unjust persecution of Brady does not stirrup protest groups like Goodell's handling of the wife beater did and we all know who was the first to circle the wagon around Goodell when he was vulnerable. I also believe that the vast majority of the other owners including Rooney and Mara who really count are supporting Goodell and will continue to do so for various reasons including jealousy and the fan base and media will follow suit. Even if Goodell loses the court case he has already won a victory for the other teams in having Kraft surrender the draft picks.
Sorry to say the fair minded people that you are counting on do not exist in 44 states.

I'm not talking about the average sports goon that sits around a bar 24/7 blaming the Patriots because his wife left him and his kids don't respect him. I have to think the vast majority of humanity tends to look down upon people who defame and frame innocent people.

Even the "mean girls" comprising the rest of the NFL owners will have to distance themselves from Goodell if he loses the Brady arbitration. If (what's left) of his credibility is gone, what good is he to them?

 

[flasox27]

I'm not talking about the average sports goon that sits around a bar 24/7 blaming the Patriots because his wife left him and his kids don't respect him. I have to think the vast majority of humanity tends to look down upon people who defame and frame innocent people.

Even the "mean girls" comprising the rest of the NFL owners will have to distance themselves from Goodell if he loses the Brady arbitration. If (what's left) of his credibility is gone, what good is he to them?

Sorry to disagree, but I deal with well educated professional people who cannot be reasoned with in this matter. The NFL propaganda machine including ESPN has done its job that well in the last eight years in etching the Pats reputation in granite. Basically any rumor even when disproven is given credence and any exculpatory information is given no credence. Thank you Bob for your contributions to the NFL characterization by your cowardly actions.

 

[BradyFTW!]

True. Even here in New Orleans where the fans know first hand about screw jobs and absolutely hate Goodell you still hear people saying "yeah but the Pats are long established cheaters so they probably did it." Granted you have a good number of people like Pherin who don't buy the leagues BS but the leagues stranglehold on the media and narrative is tough to break through and you just end up sounding like a maniac when talking about this to non Pats fans.

That's been the big surprise to me. If nothing else, I would've thought that Saints fans would 'get it'. But with the notable exception of Pherein, most Saints fans I know are buying into the NFL narrative. I'm friends with 3 Saints fans out here in California, and two are convinced that Brady and the Pats are cheaters. One is more diplomatic and acknowledges that he doesn't know either way. On the nfl subreddit, some of the most vocal proponents against Brady have been Saints fans.

It's kinda weird, but I think some of it comes down to just being glad that it's someone else is in the crosshairs. I'll admit that I felt a bit of that when it was other teams getting unjustly taken down. I thought it was BS, but I was kinda relieved that it wasn't our problem for once.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

My fantasy?
The Saints and Patriots players run out onto the field together on Saturday as a sign of solidarity, led by Belichick, Payton, Brees and Brady.
OK. Not gonna happen...but it would be cool.

 

[YOUGOTMOSSED]

Sorry to disagree, but I deal with well educated professional people who cannot be reasoned with in this matter. The NFL propaganda machine including ESPN has done its job that well in the last eight years in etching the Pats reputation in granite. Basically any rumor even when disproven is given credence and any exculpatory information is given no credence. Thank you Bob for your contributions to the NFL characterization by your cowardly actions.

You may be right. It surprises me when I hear people, who I know to be otherwise sane and reasonable in other aspects of life, sound like Daffy Duck when it comes to the Patriots. I guess this is just the ugly side of sports fanaticism. I wonder whatever happened to sportsmanship and respect?

Funny thing. I was watching a cartoon series the other day that explains philosophic ideas and deflategate was specifically referenced in a cartoon explaining Nietzsche's "will to power" and critique of Christian morality. Maybe Nietzsche was right! Here the link to that cartoon:

 

[pherein]

That's been the big surprise to me. If nothing else, I would've thought that Saints fans would 'get it'. But with the notable exception of Pherein, most Saints fans I know are buying into the NFL narrative. I'm friends with 3 Saints fans out here in California, and two are convinced that Brady and the Pats are cheaters. One is more diplomatic and acknowledges that he doesn't know either way. On the nfl subreddit, some of the most vocal proponents against Brady have been Saints fans.

It's kinda weird, but I think some of it comes down to just being glad that it's someone else is in the crosshairs. I'll admit that I felt a bit of that when it was other teams getting unjustly taken down. I thought it was BS, but I was kinda relieved that it wasn't our problem for once.

OH they do, we still have some bandwagon fans from when we were good. Im not sure about your friends situation, wether born in LA, but though I respect their opinion they are dead wrong and uninformed.
I think you see most other fans , maybe 80-90% think Pats cheated, because it never happend to them, and they dont read about it. We had the same problem.
But in LA and New Orleans there have been a number of articles written on how the Pats and Brady are being rail roaded, like us. Here Id say its about 60-70% pro Patriots and think this is rediculas. Id say 30-40% believe it, and thats also some that just want to see someone else suffer, which is infantile. We should be banning together as 2 teams and fans, much like Brees supporting Brady when asked.
I think you will get a very sympathetic ear when in N.O.
unfortunate we have some idiots in our camp like most teams, and they and idiots never know when to shutup. But I would be very sure in saying that LA probably has the largest fan base supporting NE.

 

[pherein]

My fantasy?
The Saints and Patriots players run out onto the field together on Saturday as a sign of solidarity, led by Belichick, Payton, Brees and Brady.
OK. Not gonna happen...but it would be cool.

I would love to see this lol.
Maybe they can play band music and all form a F.U.R.G. in the middle of the field, be hillarious.