Predict Pats biggest FA signing 2013

[ATippett56]

You offered crap. You know you offered crap. Your arguments on cap/contracts were lousy last year, and they're starting off every bit as bad this year. Either accept that there's an actual, albeit limited, market for the services of NFL players, or don't bother with the numbers, because you're nowhere near reasonable.

Offer Wes Welker the moon, I don't care, but if you do there will be no money leftover whatsoever for Talib or Vollmer.

Even if the New England Patriots offer Wes Welker 4 years $40 million with a $20 million signing bonus, then be prepared for a team such as the Colts, completely devoid of quality cornerbacks, to offer Aqib Talib 5 years $50 million, and a team such as the Cardinals, completely devoid of quality offensive tackles, to offer Vollmer 5 years $50 million.

 

[Deus Irae]

Offer Wes Welker the moon, I don't care, but if you do there will be no money leftover whatsoever for Talib or Vollmer.

Even if the New England Patriots offer Wes Welker 4 years $40 million with a $20 million signing bonus, then be prepared for a team such as the Colts, completely devoid of quality cornerbacks, to offer Aqib Talib 5 years $50 million, and a team such as the Cardinals, completely devoid of quality offensive tackles, to offer Vollmer 5 years $50 million.

When this first began, last season, Ian and I discussed it. We both looked at something that could go out to 3 years, 8+ million per as acceptable if a bit more than we wanted at the time. The year before that, the Patriots could have gone to Welker with a good offer that didn't screw him over, and he probably would have jumped on it. I'm also not suggesting that they offer 4 for $40 million, either, so quit setting up the straw men.

Instead, reports say that they offered him a garbage first offer and never improved on it. In case you haven't noticed, that's not usually a successful strategy with top players in the NFL.

As for Talib, if someone else wants to pay him $10 million per, let them. The same goes for paying $10 million per to Vollmer. The irony here is that you want to underpay the player who stays on the field and produces, while overpaying the guy who doesn't have his head on straight and the guy who can't stay on the field. :bricks:

 

[ATippett56]

There is currently no official 2013 salary cap figure, so you're making up numbers, again.

Franchise tag numbers tentatively set; 2013 cap near $121M - NFL.com

I could just use that same argument, apply receptions instead of yards, and get an enormous pay raise for Welker.

I could compare touchdown receptions between Moss and Welker and that would devalue Welker case even more.

 

[Deus Irae]

Franchise tag numbers tentatively set; 2013 cap near $121M - NFL.com

Thanks for proving my point. There are no official numbers. You were making yours up, as I said.

I could compare touchdown receptions between Moss and Welker and that would devalue Welker case even more.

I could compare receptions, as I noted. Your argument was a terrible one, as I demonstrated easily. Why double down on it? Admit the argument sucked or drop it, but don't keep going down what you know is a bad path. I'm stuck at home with a sick animal tonight, but other people aren't going to want to read this stuff. Make sound arguments or move on, for crying out loud.

 

[ATippett56]

When this first began, last season, Ian and I discussed it. We both looked at something that could go out to 3 years, 8+ million per as acceptable if a bit more than we wanted at the time. The year before that, the Patriots could have gone to Welker with a good offer that didn't screw him over, and he probably would have jumped on it. I'm also not suggesting that they offer 4 for $40 million, either, so quit setting up the straw men.

I have no idea what the New England Patriots organization will offer Wes Welker this time around.

From my own personal perspective, I would retain Welker and Edelman yet be damned with the consequences of allowing Woodhead, Vollmer, Talib, Arrington, Chung, Scott to depart via unrestricted free agency.

 

[ATippett56]

Thanks for proving my point. There are no official numbers. You were making yours up, as I said.

I wasn't making them up but using a source linked to a recent article.

 

[Deus Irae]

I wasn't making them up but using a source linked to a recent article.

There are no official numbers. Any numbers being used right now are made up numbers. The source you cited doesn't even give a real number, just noting that it's tentatively set at or near 121, yet you used the number $121 million as if it were meaningful, and compared it to specific and official data about 2008. Come on, man. Be better than that. That is the stuff trolls would do.

 

[Deus Irae]

I have no idea what the New England Patriots organization will offer Wes Welker this time around.

From my own personal perspective, I would retain Welker and Edelman yet be damned with the consequences of allowing Woodhead, Vollmer, Talib, Arrington, Chung, Scott to depart via unrestricted free agency.

Then what's with the baseless lowballing? I can understand hoping not to overpay, but to go with a $5 million per season cut, you've got to have better than "Because he's aging", since the man's going to end up with more than 110 catches in a season, yet again.

 

[ATippett56]

Then what's with the baseless lowballing? I can understand hoping not to overpay, but to go with a $5 million per season cut, you've got to have better than "Because he's aging", since the man's going to end up with more than 110 catches in a season, yet again.

Baseless lowballing or looking from a management perspective on the situation based upon a previous high profile wide receiver signed to a three year contract extension.

Whether Wes Welker is even amenable to a three year contract extension is sheer conjecture at this point in time, let alone the following:

Contract Value
Signing Bonus
Roster Bonus (annual)
Workout Bonus (annual)

At a minimum, retain the following unrestricted free agents:

Wes Welker
Julian Edelman
Donald Thomas
Tracy White (special teams)
Niko Koutouvides (special teams)
Marquice Cole (special teams)
Derrick Martin (special teams/training camp fodder)

At a minimum, retain the following restricted free agents:

Michael Hoomanawanui
Dane Fletcher

If any salary cap room is remaining, retain running back Danny Woodhead.

 

[PatsFanStnfrd]

For 2013, Pats need WRs and Safeties as priorities.
Given the cost of top tier WRs like Wallace and Jennings-- BB will prefer to keep the WRs w/ proven production with Wes Welker on top of list even at a franchise cost of $11 million. Edelman who was on the verge of a breakout season before injuries is another priority. Woodhead (change of pace runner who is good at catching the ball) is invaluable to the Pats.

Vollmer would be another priority -- though much depends on health and market for a right tackle. Either way BB is going to have to sign or find a right franchise tackle.

BB has not had much luck with top flight free agents like Red Bryant and Dashon Goldson. How much of a downgrade over Goldson is Gregory? How much better off would the Pats be w/ Goldson if BB had gone the extra mile?

Remains to be seen if Talib is a current season gamble. After having spent a 4th round pick, hopefully BB can find a way to keep him around for a year or two.

Complicating matters is that unlike the past three years, Pats are thin on draft currency -- without extra high round draft choices. So free agency will be even more important.

All in all, this off season will keep BB on his toes. Hope Kraft increases his compensation to above $8 million -- to once again make him the highest paid coach in football over Sean Payton (who does not play GM in real life unlike BB)

 

[supafly]

BB will prefer to keep the WRs w/ proven production with Wes Welker on top of list even at a franchise cost of $11 million.

One line of thinking is that they may have figured that retaining Welker for the 2012 and 2013 seasons was going to cost the same anyway whether they paid him on a 2 year deal or ended up franchising him for a total of approximately 20 million.

They may have decided that it was a safer way to go by waiting it out and seeing how the production and durability ended up being, thus taking it on a year-by-year basis for this season and the next.

 

[BingoBrown]

Jason has the Patriots currently able to carry forward $6.7m and 16m under the cap for next year without that, so factoring in 5m for rookies the Patriots have $19.7m.

Brady has a cap hit of £21.8m though which can be lowered with an extension or another restructure.

Next years cap numbers: New England Patriots Salary Cap 2013

Not a lot of money to play with once you add in Welker, Vollmer, Talib, Woodhead & Edelman needing new contracts.

here in the States that is some righteous bucks....or is
that quid.

I would go after Mike Wallace