Pats Offseason Review - Free agents

[Ring 6]

Andy -

Thanks for your comments. However, if there is anything that I've learned about leadership over the years of being a manager, its that any good manager always has his eyes and ears open to the people who are doing the actual work. So, while BB may have developed the philosophy, its been refined with the help of Pioli.

As I said, I think that Pioli has as much to do with it because he's the one who got the players that BB wanted signed to the team. There were some players who got away (Derrick Mason) and some who should have gotten away (Monty Beisel, Duane Starks). But there have been plenty that Pioli has gotten in here that have been intergral parts of this team (Vrabel, Harrison, Colvin).

I don't believe that the Patriots would have won 3 SBs without Pioli being in the position he is in. If its anyone else, I believe that the Pats may not even have ONE SB.

Pioli is also responsible for the scouting personnel. Particularly at the college level. He was the one who trained Dimitroff. He's been involved in the training of many of the other scouts. The people who have brought us Matt Cassel, Vince Wilfork, Ty Warren, etc, etc. Without those Pioli trainined scouts, the Pats don't win 3 in 4 years. The Pats don't become the class of the NFL.

As I said, its also my belief that Belichick cannot fire Pioli. Just like its my belief that Pioli can't fire Belichick. Those two decisions are for Kraft and Kraft alone. And I believe that is one of the reasons why Pioli is happy to stay in New England and that, contrary to reports, Pioli feels respected.

I simply totally disagree.

 

[Keegs]

best thread ive read in months. thanks for the hard work.

Mike Wright is fun. I hope he sticks around.

 

[Krugman]

Thanks for the hard work,DB,good reading.

 

[BionicPatriot]

Andy -

Thanks for your comments. However, if there is anything that I've learned about leadership over the years of being a manager, its that any good manager always has his eyes and ears open to the people who are doing the actual work. So, while BB may have developed the philosophy, its been refined with the help of Pioli.

As I said, I think that Pioli has as much to do with it because he's the one who got the players that BB wanted signed to the team. There were some players who got away (Derrick Mason) and some who should have gotten away (Monty Beisel, Duane Starks). But there have been plenty that Pioli has gotten in here that have been intergral parts of this team (Vrabel, Harrison, Colvin).

I don't believe that the Patriots would have won 3 SBs without Pioli being in the position he is in. If its anyone else, I believe that the Pats may not even have ONE SB.

Pioli is also responsible for the scouting personnel. Particularly at the college level. He was the one who trained Dimitroff. He's been involved in the training of many of the other scouts. The people who have brought us Matt Cassel, Vince Wilfork, Ty Warren, etc, etc. Without those Pioli trainined scouts, the Pats don't win 3 in 4 years. The Pats don't become the class of the NFL.

As I said, its also my belief that Belichick cannot fire Pioli. Just like its my belief that Pioli can't fire Belichick. Those two decisions are for Kraft and Kraft alone. And I believe that is one of the reasons why Pioli is happy to stay in New England and that, contrary to reports, Pioli feels respected.

Says it the best, IMO.

 

[DaBruinz]

I simply totally disagree.

If you "simply totally disagree", then I would say that you've never held a management position or had anyone working for you. Much of what I have stated is fact, especially about being a successful manager.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Despite the fact that at times you can be an arrogant and insulting 'my views are right and you are wrong' type of patsfans member,you still did a fine job of putting this Pats FA list together

Thanks for the good analysis and well thought out thread

 

[billdog3484]

If you "simply totally disagree", then I would say that you've never held a management position or had anyone working for you. Much of what I have stated is fact, especially about being a successful manager.

obviously you are a simpleton. the only thing that is fact is that there is no one way to do anything. there are many ways to do many things. you ought to stop being so narrow minded.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

obviously you are a simpleton.

You might find that a mirror would be a revealing tool

 

[Brady'sButtBoy]

Well, well, well. And I thought talking football was going to be fun!

 

[cincipatsfan]

Thanks DB, great thread.

Funny how some of the best threads around here happen after the season has ended and the drama queens have left.

 

[Warren94]

Pioli is definitely a key to the success but he has whiffed on some draft picks as well. It's a crap-shoot. I do feel BB is more important to the organization than Pioli.

 

[BionicPatriot]

Pioli is definitely a key to the success but he has whiffed on some draft picks as well. It's a crap-shoot. I do feel BB is more important to the organization than Pioli.

So Bill shoulders no blame? They go 50/50 on decisions, and Bill himself has said Pioli sometimes had a different and correct opinion on a move.

 

[Dagg]

we will be fine without pioli IMHO he was better at FA than in the draft which is an easier skill to replace.

 

[DaBruinz]

we will be fine without pioli IMHO he was better at FA than in the draft which is an easier skill to replace.

I am curious as to how you came to this conclusion?

 

[Warren94]

So Bill shoulders no blame? They go 50/50 on decisions, and Bill himself has said Pioli sometimes had a different and correct opinion on a move.

Don't believe I said that. Sure BB has made some rough and questionable calls. However we do not know what happens in the trenches.

 

[DaBruinz]

Don't believe I said that. Sure BB has made some rough and questionable calls. However we do not know what happens in the trenches.

While we don't know specifics, we do know that if one or the other disagrees on a player, that they strike that player from their initial lists. This is documented fact.

 

[Dagg]

Looking at his FA pickups they have been great. His drafts not so much .

I consider myself a strong evaluator of talent and I always liked the guys he added that were not big names(Moss). IE Vrabel at the time, Sammy Morris, Gaffney. And he definatley had me on wes welker who I was not hot on.

Draft wise meh, while we have done better than some teams for sure, we havent exactly set the world on fire.

 

[DaBruinz]

Looking at his FA pickups they have been great. His drafts not so much .

I consider myself a strong evaluator of talent and I always liked the guys he added that were not big names(Moss). IE Vrabel at the time, Sammy Morris, Gaffney. And he definatley had me on wes welker who I was not hot on.

Draft wise meh, while we have done better than some teams for sure, we havent exactly set the world on fire.

How many of the drafts are you using for your determination? Are you including 2000, where Bobby Grier provided all the "scouting" information?

If you look from 2001 through 2006 and compare them to other teams around the league, I think you'll find that the Patriots are probably in the top 10 in terms of talent evaluation. And I think you'll find that the Patriots have had more players cut and hook on with other teams than most.