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OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merged)


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Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Hmm...according to PFT, Santini alerted federal authorities back when he was still with the team in 2009, which would seem to undermine the "he's just bitter that he didn't get to be part of the championship" theory:

DEA exploring Saints drug case | ProFootballTalk.com

If you noticed in the comments section there is one a-hole who referred to the Patriots .. Some jerks find a reason to use the Patriots in everything
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

I KNEW he had to be on something after that Onside kick in the Super Bowl. ;)

Seriously tho, I don't care.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Vicodin's are one step up from extra strength tylenol. While they are a prescription drug Vicodins are not narcotics.
This is much ado about not much of anything.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Vicodin's are one step up from extra strength tylenol. While they are a prescription drug Vicodins are not narcotics.
This is much ado about not much of anything.

Vicodin is an opiate. And yes, vicodins ARE narcotics.

Vicodin is a mix of acetaminophen and hydrocodone. Hydrocodone is a narcotic opiate.



The big thing here is that the saints organization conspired to cover up a felony.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Vicodin's are one step up from extra strength tylenol. While they are a prescription drug Vicodins are not narcotics.
This is much ado about not much of anything.
Ummmm, yeah they are narcotics that are made from hydrocodone.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

The GM treated the removal of the pills like an addiction issue and sent Vitt to rehab; Santini argued it was a criminal matter to report to the authorities.

Santini is in the right here. If it was just stolen property, the saints could handle it however they want, but where its a controlled substance, they are required to report it.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Vicodin's are one step up from extra strength tylenol. While they are a prescription drug Vicodins are not narcotics.
This is much ado about not much of anything.

Two thoughts, since I see you have already been corrected.

One, your standard for "not much of anything" suggests that you have either never taken Vicodin or have an extremely high tolerance for narcotic substances. Vicodin is a powerful and highly addictive drug (I was given a prescription once after a nasty dental procedure, took a couple of doses as directed by my doctor, saw how "good" it was and promptly threw away the rest of the vial as I didn't want it around my home); Brett Favre, among others, has acknowledged a long term addiction.

Two, as someone else has observed, hydrocodone is a narcotic. Vicodin itself is a Schedule III drug under the Controlled Substances Act. This is a serious matter. Personally, I wish the whole thing could have been handled internally as a matter of substance abuse for which rehab was the best response, but now that the cat is out of the bag, it will be impossible to stop it from becoming a criminal matter.
 
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Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

I used to think that "truth, justice and the American way" always prevailed.

Read a lot of comic books?
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Vicodin is an opiate. And yes, vicodins ARE narcotics.

Vicodin is a mix of acetaminophen and hydrocodone. Hydrocodone is a narcotic opiate.



The big thing here is that the saints organization conspired to cover up a felony.

I guess it's my hyper-sensitivity after the lies and half truths of Spygate, but let us Patriot fans be careful with the truth and not do to another organization what was done to us.

No facts have yet been attested under oath and none have been proven in a court of law. So, let's leave it that "the saints organization is alleged to have conspired to cover up a felony by a former employee whose motivations in the matter are not fully clear."
 
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Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Read a lot of comic books?

I'm glad someone got that allusion...
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Santini is in the right here. If it was just stolen property, the saints could handle it however they want, but where its a controlled substance, they are required to report it.

Not arguing, but clarifying.

I'm curious as to the "possession status" of items in "drug storage" on the premises of an NFL team. In this case, who actually has the possession of those substances, the distribution of which is limited by law to those who receive a prescription from a Medical Professional?

Is it the team? In which case, under which rubric of law is an NFL team allowed to possess controlled substances?

Is it the team doctor, effectively turning the facility into a doctor's office where such substances are legally kept?

Or, is the "drug storage" effectively a pharmacy under independent supervision, where the substances are owned by a third party prior to their distribution by prescription?

I ask these questions because they get at who is actually "required to report" a theft of a substance whose distribution is limited.

For example, let's assume that the drugs are technically in the possession of the team doctor, just as the drugs in your doctor's office are in his/her possession and that the premises of the training facility are, under the law, an extension of his office.

Let's assume that the management of the team becomes aware that drugs have been improperly removed from their normal storage location by someone for whom they were prescribed. And let's further presume that management sees to their full and complete return to the storage area before their use and before they left the premises.

Under the above scenario, it seems to me that an argument could be made that they never left the "doctor's office" and that the matter could be handled as a matter of team discipline and the treatment of a substance abuse problem.

I just think we have to be careful until we know the facts. The Patriots were not given this courtesy during Spygate and I think we should extend it to the Saints.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

Under the above scenario, it seems to me that an argument could be made that they never left the "doctor's office" and that the matter could be handled as a matter of team discipline and the treatment of a substance abuse problem.

No, that argument can not be made. These are controlled substances, not a box of band-aids. If they leave the cabinet where they are stored without a prescription, it must be reported.

The team could try making that argument, but they'd be accessories after the fact.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

The Patriots were not given this courtesy during Spygate

that's 100% correct...and then Jetdell allowed the sports media to run amok unchecked, as idiots like Schlereth went on national ESPN and outlined in a long segment "how "IT" was done". THE most moronic,2nd grade level piece of excrement I've EVER seen on the national stage in ANY venue.

Complete near mouth breathers like Faulk and Joey Porter blabbed non stop slanders every time a mic and camera was placed in their faces yet Jetdell said ZERO and made NO attempt to quell these vicious unfounded attacks on a team that had become a model for success in the new millenium.

Psychotic weekly attacks by Easterbrook,blubbering, spitting, mindless LA blitheirngs by Plaschke..the list was almost endless.

But let Wrecks Cryan go all drunken fat slob Tommy Boy on record down in Florida and there's Jetdell, immmediately deflecting and running interference for the disgusting and league embarrassing behavior of an immature miscreant...and then smoothing it all over with that preposterous "25 cent tip" 50 k "fine". What a total joke.

Expect Jetdell to do whatever he can in his power and also to NOT DO anything to help or deflect vicious unfounded attacks, for/on the N.O. Saints football club. IMO he HATES the fact N.O. won the Super Bowl this year and he won't rest until the team he is illegally paid to insure a Super Bowl finally gets slipped in there.And if you really want to retch and puke, get a copy of the just passed NFL draft and look how he acts when the Jets draft choice comes on stage...and then juxtapose how he acts when the Saints pick is announced. In the words of Vincent Caccardia from True Romance...you know, you're saying nothing but you're telling me everything...
 
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Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

No, that argument can not be made. These are controlled substances, not a box of band-aids. If they leave the cabinet where they are stored without a prescription, it must be reported.

The team could try making that argument, but they'd be accessories after the fact.

First of all, don't condescend to me. I know they are not band aids.

I don't have a dog in this hunt, I'm just trying to understand.

Stating things as facts doesn't make them facts.

So, let's get to my questions:

Under Louisiana and Federal Law, who owns the drugs in the "cabinet where they are stored" when the storage area comprises the premises of an NFL training facility? Do you know? I don't. Is it the team? Is it the Team Doctor? Is it an independent pharmacy? Do you know? I don't.

Under Louisiana and Federal Law, what is the legal status of "the cabinet where...[the drugs]...are stored" if the cabinet is in a doctor's office? Do you know? I don't.

For example, if the doctor takes the drugs from the cabinet and for a generally accepted valid reason, puts them in the drawer of his desk so he might have them handy to give to a patient, are those drugs still deemed to be in the "the cabinet?" If so, is his entire office an extension of the cabinet, under the law. Do you know? I don't.

You say, "it must be reported."

Under Louisiana and Federal law, "what" must be reported? That drugs in the possession of a doctor never left his office? Is that something that needs to be reported? Do you know? I don't.

Assuming a crime has been committed, under Louisiana and Federal Law in this case, who had the obligation to make that report? The team? The Doctor? Do you know? I don't.

So, do you know anything, beyond your opinion, that can answer those questions?

I offer the above hypothetically, primarily to make the point that there is a lot about the facts on the ground and the law itself that we don't understand here. I remember how quick people were to jump to judgment on the Patriots during Spygate, with little attention to the facts themselves; I'm just bending over backwards here not to do the same thing to another team.
 
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Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

I found a link to the Lawsuit by the plaintiff. (link below)

Since this is the plaintiff's suit, it is patently self-serving and there is definitely a lot of "he said/he said" in it. But, Santini claims to have some voice recordings as well.

This is definitely not going to go away and will reverberate around the league; I'd bet a good sum that every NFL Front Office is reviewing its medication distribution procedures today.

I'm still going to withhold judgment, as Plaintiff's motivations are ambiguous and I have to admit that, while it doesn't look good on the surface, I don't know the applicable law and we only have one side of the story; the Saints have vigorously denied the charges.

Is this a matter of sloppy practices and enforcement around the NFL or are the Saints alone? What are the League's policies and procedures in these regards? To what extent is the free-wheeling consumption of painkillers part of the culture and practice of the NFL? How strictly is the distribution and consumption of prescription drugs controlled by each team?

One thing that I found unusual is that the team physician is reported in the lawsuit to have been able to fill his prescriptions (at Walgreens) for large bottles of Vicodin, but only in the name of the "Saints" and not of individuals (which is against Federal Law, as I understand the law).


http://media.nola.com/crime_impact/other/saints-lawsuit.pdf
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

I found a link to the Lawsuit by the plaintiff. (link below)

Since this is the plaintiff's suit, it is patently self-serving and there is definitely a lot of "he said/he said" in it. But, Santini claims to have some voice recordings as well.

This is definitely not going to go away and will reverberate around the league; I'd bet a good sum that every NFL Front Office is reviewing its medication distribution procedures today.

I'm still going to withhold judgment, as Plaintiff's motivations are ambiguous and I have to admit that, while it doesn't look good on the surface, I don't know the applicable law and we only have one side of the story; the Saints have vigorously denied the charges.

Is this a matter of sloppy practices and enforcement around the NFL or are the Saints alone? What are the League's policies and procedures in these regards? To what extent is the free-wheeling consumption of painkillers part of the culture and practice of the NFL? How strictly is the distribution and consumption of prescription drugs controlled by each team?

One thing that I found unusual is that the team physician is reported in the lawsuit to have been able to fill his prescriptions (at Walgreens) for large bottles of Vicodin, but only in the name of the "Saints" and not of individuals (which is against Federal Law, as I understand the law).


http://media.nola.com/crime_impact/other/saints-lawsuit.pdf

Federal Law? This is Louisiana ;)

Anyway, I was skimming through the thread over at Saintsreport and I've come across a few comments about how it's being misrepresented in the media, and they're right, and it's unfortunate that really only Patriots fans will understand that.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

please do, I would enjoy his thoughts on the current predicament, thanks

bigcountry75

I will try to think of a creative way to bring it up....if there is one....
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

I just got off the phone with my boss....he said his sister is out here in MD now while Joe Vitt is doing the camp's....My boss said i can't say anything about this situation to him but as soon as my boss hears about it he will tell me and I can inform the patriot nation......:D

I usually hear everything second hand so I love having the inside scoop on something....
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

The big thing here is that the saints organization conspired to cover up a felony.
And the big thing a couple years ago was that the pats videotaped defensive signals in the first half and used them to cheat in the second half.

How about it we at least learn what happened before trashing a franchise and deciding that someting is true because media talking heads are reporting it.
 
Re: OT: Saints HC Sean Payton & LB coach accused of stealing team's painkillers (merg

And the big thing a couple years ago was that the pats videotaped defensive signals in the first half and used them to cheat in the second half.

How about it we at least learn what happened before trashing a franchise and deciding that someting is true because media talking heads are reporting it.

exactly...and ALWAYS forgotten by the mindless mental defectives carrying press credentials. There was NEVER an issue about taping the sideline, the issue was PLACEMENT of the camera. Period. As anyone who reads this board on a semi-regular basis can attest, however,there is this pervasive, misguided perception by fans of other teams that taping a sideline is illegal. It is NOT.[
 
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