OT: Happy Veterans Day!!!!!!

[Actual Pats Fan]

I'd just like to weigh in here as a Vietnam Veteran. I think there's a tendency today to knock our institutions, and believe they are a failure, that exceeds the reality. I was wounded in Vietnam severely enough to have spent the first year home in the hospital. I spent 6 months at Chelsea Naval Hospital, now a condominium complex, and 6 months at JP, and West Roxbury, VAs. I was operated on multiple times at all of the institutions, including a couple I haven't mentioned. They did a great job. While some of these old wounds are beginning to catch up to me as I age the work that was done at Military, and VA, hospitals allowed me to live a pretty full life. I'm very grateful.

Further, while there was a deep disconnect between the returning Veterans from Vietnam, and the population at large, the reports of Veterans being spit on etc. are grossly exaggerated.

You can be prouder of the way our vets were treated in the VA system then the current prevailing wisdom would have you believe.

So grateful for your experience.

There's still work to be done.

 

[Nikolai]

I'd just like to weigh in here as a Vietnam Veteran. I think there's a tendency today to knock our institutions, and believe they are a greater failure then the reality suggests. I was wounded in Vietnam severely enough to have spent the first year home in the hospital. I spent 6 months at Chelsea Naval Hospital, now a condominium complex, and 6 months at JP, and West Roxbury, VAs. I was operated on multiple times at all of these institutions, including a couple I haven't mentioned. They did a great job. While some of these old wounds are beginning to catch up to me as I age the work that was done at these Military, and VA, hospitals allowed me to live a pretty full life. I'm very grateful.

Further, while there was a deep disconnect between the returning Veterans from Vietnam, and the population at large, the reports of Veterans being spit on etc. are grossly exaggerated.

I agree with the ability of military hospitals to treated wounded soldiers. They've done some great work, including on some fellow soldiers I know personally. The biggest complaints I hear tend to be about routine care after retirement. It's anecdotal evidence, but that's what I got.

It should be noted that among the oft-cited statistic of 22 suicides a day, the vast majority of those are among Viet Nam vets. That's not to say our current generation doesn't have its problems and our own disconnect (0nly 0.6% of Americans served in Iraq and Afghanistan), but we're doing ok. The culture of veteran support in this country is a big part of that, I think. I've got other thoughts, but that's getting into the weeds a bit.

 

[MassPats38]

I'd just like to weigh in here as a Vietnam Veteran. I think there's a tendency today to knock our institutions, and believe they are a greater failure then the reality suggests. I was wounded in Vietnam severely enough to have spent the first year home in the hospital. I spent 6 months at Chelsea Naval Hospital, now a condominium complex, and 6 months at JP, and West Roxbury, VAs. I was operated on multiple times at all of these institutions, including a couple I haven't mentioned. They did a great job. While some of these old wounds are beginning to catch up to me as I age the work that was done at these Military, and VA, hospitals allowed me to live a pretty full life. I'm very grateful.

Further, while there was a deep disconnect between the returning Veterans from Vietnam, and the population at large, the reports of Veterans being spit on etc. are grossly exaggerated.

You can be prouder of the way our vets were treated in the VA system then the current prevailing wisdom would have you believe.

Tom-

Thank you for your service.

I agree there is good and bad in the VA systems and programs, just as there are good and bad doctors in the military. I had a Navy doctor operate on me in '95 who was as good as any civilian doctor I might have considered (in contrast, I have encountered civilian doctors who joined the military because they liked the absence of malpractice insurance and care offering immunity from medical malpractice claims, and had good cause to fear those responses given what happened after they joined).

I wouldn't suggest that all doctors or care provided by the VA are bad, because that would be untrue as I would bet the farm there are doctors who forego money for the satisfaction of helping those who deserve it. If the VA you encountered helped you out, that is awesome. My experiences over the last 26 years (active and reserve time) with the VA in several regions of the U.S. has not been as positive, from customer service to actual care provided. I have read a number of a the formal investigations on VA care, and they more confirmed my personal dealings. Nothing I believe is media driven, because the subject is too political so I simply don't trust the reporting.

Out of curiosity, did you spend much time in California going to or returning from the War? When I was in ROTC in the '80s I heard about protesters destroying the Berkely ROTC building. I actually had a sailor in my division who served in the National Guard at Kent State (yes, I know that is in Ohio), and he was okay with discussing that subject in conversation. My understanding was while there were national protests, California typically had the ugliest protests. If you were stationed or spent any time there outbound, then I would be interested in hearing where and when. I am old enough to have had Vietnam War era soldiers and sailors working with me, but I was 6 years old when the war ended so do not claim personal experience there or any personal knowledge of what was happening at the time.

Best,

Mike

 

[tom444]

I agree with the ability of military hospitals to treated wounded soldiers. They've done some great work, including on some fellow soldiers I know personally. The biggest complaints I hear tend to be about routine care after retirement. It's anecdotal evidence, but that's what I got.

It should be noted that among the oft-cited statistic of 22 suicides a day, the vast majority of those are among Viet Nam vets. That's not to say our current generation doesn't have its problems and our own disconnect (0nly 0.6% of Americans served in Iraq and Afghanistan), but we're doing ok. The culture of veteran support in this country is a big part of that, I think. I've got other thoughts, but that's getting into the weeds a bit.

I agree with most of this. I needed surgery, and they performed well. I was medically retired from the Army, so I have used private care following that retirement. I did use VA dental care for awhile and was very disappointed.

>>The culture of veteran support in this country is a big part of that, I think. <<

Yes, we didn't get that, that's true.

 

[tom444]

Out of curiosity, did you spend much time in California going to or returning from the War? When I was in ROTC in the '80s I heard about protesters destroying the Berkely ROTC building. I actually had a sailor in my division who served in the National Guard at Kent State (yes, I know that is in Ohio), and he was okay with discussing that subject in conversation. My understanding was while there were national protests, California typically had the ugliest protests. If you were stationed or spent any time there outbound, then I would be interested in hearing where and when. I am old enough to have had Vietnam War era soldiers and sailors working with me, but I was 6 years old when the war ended so do not claim personal experience there or any personal knowledge of what was happening at the time.

I thought about California when I posted about the treatment of returning vets. While I did leave for Vietnam from Oakland Calf., we went over by ship, and we had no contact with civilians at the piers. I returned by mediflight, landed at Andrews AFB, again no civilian contact. So, I can't speak to that experience.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Brother had no civilian issues he's ever spoken of as an Army returning Vietnam vet.

He ran the excellent Veterans Count charity org here in NH for last 4 years, just stepped down.
They help military families deal with life when a member is away on service and help returning vets & families getting back on their feet. Lots of "working poor" here. They use the Easter Seals structure so as to not add a layer of donation wasting infrastructure expense.

 

[TK in the UK]

The California situation was strange. I too left by ship but from San Diego. Our pre-ship training was pretty intensive so I had no real civilian contact. I came back by air and went to Camp Pendleton for a haircut, clean uniform and 're-orientation' (ie, they didn't want us to kill anyone, anymore). Tom444 is right in that the spitting and physical attacks were rare - at least it never happened to me, although I heard many stories. However the hostile attitudes were common.When I went for home leave in December 1966, I left out of LAX and went in uniform (1/2 price air fare, you know). A very pretty young woman approached and asked if I was a Marine. When I said yes, she asked if I knew what the anagram for USMC was. I said no (didn't actually know what an anagram was then) and she screamed 'It's scum. that's what you are. F'ing scum'. Then she ran off, screaming 'baby killer, baby killer' the whole time. But looking on the bright side, at least I found out what an anagram is.

It was somewhat better in Connecticut, if not really good. Maybe I was just a sensitive soul in those days who noticed when people left any room I walked into. At least a couple of girls found a Marine uniform was not a turn-off so I wasn't totally unhappy.

When I returned to the US in 1969 from my second overseas tour, I was assigned to Pendleton again. The change in people's attitude was noticeable. They weren't hostile, weren't friendly - just indifferent. I guess they simply got tired of the whole thing.

I have no comment about the VA as I never had to use them. When I was hit by a small bomb fragment, it was hardly more than a scratch. They sent me to the field hospital in DaNang for a couple of days (good food) and then it was back to my outfit. I do want to say a couple of words about the real heroes in Vietnam (and probably every war). That's the corpsmen for the Marines and medics for the Army. Those guys are simply awesome. There are a lot of people who would walk through hell for those guys.

 

[tom444]

I do want to say a couple of words about the real heroes in Vietnam (and probably every war). That's the corpsmen for the Marines and medics for the Army. Those guys are simply awesome. There are a lot of people who would walk through hell for those guys.

Hear hear. Two medics, and the guys on the medevac, put their lives on the line to get me out.

 

[FirstAndGoal]

Can't say I've had the same good experience at JP. I've seen some F'd up sh@t there over the years back in the 80s. I was disgusted with some of what I saw.