New England can become Superbowl contenders again

[Thelonious]

We need to straighten out the failed-GM situation, then set about systematically rebuilding the roster under new leadership. Given the roster's dismal state, I suspect that will take a couple of years. That gives us time to make a decision on the HC, unless he chooses to move on when we fire the GM. There is no urgency re qb at present. Any decision on that front is pending an examination of the fit between our needs and the draft/trade situation at year's end.

I think the OP is too optimistic. We haven't even begun the necessary work at this point.

There is no quick fix for this ****.

 

[Real fan 02]

Would anyone believe me if I said New England can become a superbowl contender again with 2 great OT's, one more great DT, 1 great LB and one great WR? Maybe an edge too.

No, I'm not crazy. Neither stupid.

I don't necessarily think your crazy. But I often wonder how did we go from 2021.. being at one point 9-3 the 1 seed in the AFC to where we are now in 2023 the laughter of the AFC.. the worst offense in the NFL. For so long we all witnessed the perfect from the GOAT and BB. Now we are forced to watch every Sunday a team we thought we'd never see. We clearly have a talent Issue be QB and WR.

The teams going to either surround Mac with real offensive pieces or trade him and prepare to draft another guy. On defense add some depth on the D line and LB.

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

Would anyone believe me if I said New England can become a superbowl contender again with 2 great OT's, one more great DT, 1 great LB and one great WR? Maybe an edge too.

No, I'm not crazy. Neither stupid.

So 6 elite players not counting the QB that they do not have.......

 

[Nikolai]

Yup. Not particularly close either.

18th in yards
22nd in passing yards
13th in rushing yards
26th in points per game.
13th in penalties
28th in sacks
20th in QB knockdowns
22nd in passing touchdowns by opposing offense
25th in first downs given up
They are tied for 24th for INT's but really only one team has less interceptions
Tied for 26th in total takeaways.

We've never had a defense anywhere near this that won a Super Bowl. Just in ppg the 2004 team was ranked 2nd, 2014 was ranked 8th, 2016 was ranked 1st, 2018 was ranked 7th. The website doesn't go further back than 2004 but we all know the 03 and 01 teams weren't ranked as badly as this team. I don't think we've ever won a Super Bowl without a top 10 defense.

On top of that we've never won a Super Bowl with an offensive line that ranked this poorly. Or a special teams that ranked this poorly.

Also the only time we've won with a running back group close to as bad as this was the 2003 squad. And even then as a pure player I'd put Faulk over any of them for how he produced in both rushing and receiving.

Before you even talk about passing, this team has a lot of severe deficiencies that the Super Bowl winning teams didn't.

Not that I'm disagreeing, but does this account for the number of drives the defense has to be on the field? Or the pick sixes and fumble sixes that count against the defense?

I'm far too busy these days to do the analysis myself, but sadly, those who actually get paid to do it are lazy as **** and miss details that then later shock them in the playoffs or whatnot.

 

[Pats1971]

Would anyone believe me if I said New England can become a superbowl contender again with 2 great OT's, one more great DT, 1 great LB and one great WR? Maybe an edge too.

No, I'm not crazy. Neither stupid.

No, they need a great QB. They dont have one

 

[Pats1971]

I don't really think we need massive upgrades on defense. If we had all starters, we have the best secondary and a strong front 7. The issue is, the way the defense is built, it soars when the offense has built a lead by having the secondary be so good. Force teams to pass. Let the defense actually rest for a few set of downs instead of constantly having to go out after the offense crumbles.

The true positions are QB/WR. Maybe WR might unlock Mac's next level and we can get by with him.

This team is on the precipice of being a solid threat. Also injuries suck.

mac doesnt have a next level. A receiver is not going to make him suddenly stop being stupid with the ball or mentall tough or make his arm stronger.

 

[Vindicate]

mac doesnt have a next level. A receiver is not going to make him suddenly stop being stupid with the ball or mentall tough or make his arm stronger.

I tend to lean in the same direction as you, but at the same time I can't say I've seen Mac at the NFL level and an NFL level #1 WR. That's my only hangup there.

 

[VrabelJr]

Not that I'm disagreeing, but does this account for the number of drives the defense has to be on the field? Or the pick sixes and fumble sixes that count against the defense?

I'm far too busy these days to do the analysis myself, but sadly, those who actually get paid to do it are lazy as **** and miss details that then later shock them in the playoffs or whatnot.

Yeah our defense cannot be judged by straight up stats. Sure they had trouble getting off the field against arguably the best offense in the NFL on Sunday but that's just going to happen sometimes. The offense has put them into awful positions time and time again.

 

[lancerman]

Not that I'm disagreeing, but does this account for the number of drives the defense has to be on the field? Or the pick sixes and fumble sixes that count against the defense?

I'm far too busy these days to do the analysis myself, but sadly, those who actually get paid to do it are lazy as **** and miss details that then later shock them in the playoffs or whatnot.

Not really. It's bulk stats. But if you go purely by DVOA, which tries to measure each unit agnostic of the others, they are pretty average and in the middle. The offense and special teams knock them down like 5 or so spots and put them out of top 20. But they aren't some good defense. They are mediocre with a tendency to get burned on big plays. They also make up a lot of their deficiencies in the pass game by being pretty good in run defense.

Of the three phases if you go by the best metrics to isolate them.

They have one of if not the worst special teams in the league (have been hovering between the bottom 3 and occassionally hitting worst), then like the 7th overall worst offense, and then are in the middle on defense.

My overall point is that, this defense is not very good when you compare them to our Super Bowl winning defenses. It's a lopsided mediocre defense that is very below average at overall pass defense and is pretty good at run defense. Like there's no aspect of this team that you can point to and say "yeah this is good enough to be a contender if you fixed x on the otherside". If we had an amazing offense and defense, our special teams is so bad that we would become one of those teams that dreads special teams plays and it would be the thing that screws us in the end. There's just too many holes overall for a simple fix. Gonzalez and some guys in the secondary could probably get our defense into the top 10 at some point which is the easiest fix. But getting a good QB isn't going to compensate for everything else wrong on offense or special teams. Nor is one tackle nor one WR. In reality, right now, everyone is culpable for the losses. The offense is bad at every level. There's nothing good you can say about the offense and anyone saying otherwise is full of it. The line is a bottom tier unit (like either them or the Giants) in whatever metric you take. The WR's suck and if you measure them on production or seperation. The running backs just aren't producing at a remotely acceptable level and we aren't deep there anyways so they aren't ever fresh. The defense has a huge issue at pass defense and gets burned to hell by any speedy receiver which all the good teams have. And the special teams is probably the only unit that is comprably bad to the offensive line.

 

[Toofy]

Would anyone believe me if I said New England can become a superbowl contender again with 2 great OT's, one more great DT, 1 great LB and one great WR? Maybe an edge too.

No, I'm not crazy. Neither stupid.

Now tell us your secret... We want to taste it too. What were you drinking ?

 

[Easywolf32]

you're lucky if you get ONE of those FIVE type of players you mentioned in any one player acquisition period. This is going to be a long road back to contending for a title. I'll settle for an adequate tackle and a receiver who can create more than 1/10 of a step of separation.

Pretty sure some of you doubters thought you'd never see another Superbowl after 2013, let alone 3 in the next 4-5 years, 4 actually. So quick to quit on Bill while the guy's building a new team from the ground up. 20 year dynasty and can't give the guy a few years to rebuild while other teams have been rebuilding for decades......wow

 

[Real fan 02]

Now tell us your secret... We want to taste it too. What were you drinking ?

In order of necessity
QB
LT
WR
LB
DE
CB

 

[203Pat]

View attachment 54316
Pretty sure some of you doubters thought you'd never see another Superbowl after 2013, let alone 3 in the next 4-5 years, 4 actually. So quick to quit on Bill while the guy's building a new team from the ground up. 20 year dynasty and can't give the guy a few years to rebuild while other teams have been rebuilding for decades......wow

So how many more years should we give Bill in your opinion?

 

[UGAPatsfan]

View attachment 54316
Pretty sure some of you doubters thought you'd never see another Superbowl after 2013, let alone 3 in the next 4-5 years, 4 actually. So quick to quit on Bill while the guy's building a new team from the ground up. 20 year dynasty and can't give the guy a few years to rebuild while other teams have been rebuilding for decades......wow

I think it’s more about objectively evaluating the personnel decisions
he HAS made on offense.

Sanu, Parker, lack of O-line talent, no 3rd down back, terrible WR/TE drafts, Jonnu, Agholor, I could go in.

It’s fair to ask if BB is the guy you want anywhere near picking offensive players in FA or the draft.

 

[Guts]

View attachment 54316
Pretty sure some of you doubters thought you'd never see another Superbowl after 2013, let alone 3 in the next 4-5 years, 4 actually. So quick to quit on Bill while the guy's building a new team from the ground up. 20 year dynasty and can't give the guy a few years to rebuild while other teams have been rebuilding for decades......wow

You're omitting one huge piece there pal.
Tom Brady was the QB