Lombardi: Pats winners by losing to Ravens

[Rob0729]

I don't think we'll go "crazy" with salaries either. I do think we'll spend more this offseason than we did in 2007, though. With all of that cap room and an uncapped year looming, the sky is the limit.

I never said the Pats would go crazy. With Jerry Jones out of it and the Jets (well, each can go crazy on one free agent), there is only one or two other teams that have the potential of going "crazy". The Redskins seem to go crazy every year though. The Giants might just to get PSLs sold. Other than that, I can't see any teams really financially set up to go crazy in an uncapped year. Maybe the Packers because they are a non-profit organization.

I expect more teams looking to cut salaries and take advantage of no cap floor than teams spending like the Yankees.

 

[furley]

Why in the HELL would we offer our best player, Moss, up for trade when he has one year left on his contract?

If you'd read around, you would know my take on my reasoning. In my opinion, Moss must go... FYI... Brady is the Patriots' best player while Wilfork is second.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Lombardi also discussed on Twitter the other day of how the drafts since 2006 has been horrid and the downfall this season is the result of not getting any good players the past few years with maybe the exception of Mayo and Meriweather - He did say the Moss and Welker deal worked out well but draft picks were another thing.

 

[Nikolai]

Butler, Vollmer, and Edelman show a lot of promise so I'm not completely sold on the terrible draft argument. I still haven't given up on Chung becoming a valuable player, either.

I admit though that there have been a few more swings and misses of late.

 

[BradyFTW!]

If you'd read around, you would know my take on my reasoning. In my opinion, Moss must go... FYI... Brady is the Patriots' best player while Wilfork is second.

That's a very interesting opinion, but you still haven't backed it up with anything resembling logic, common sense, or coherency.

And no, "Brady was better without Moss" doesn't count, because it's provably untrue. Getting rid of Moss means:

a) you don't think he's worth $5 million this year (his non-sunk cost)
b) you think we can get more than he's worth in a trade
c) you don't think that this would piss Brady off
d) you're comfortable going into 2010 with either Julian Edelman or a new guy who has never played with us before as our #1 WR.

 

[sieglo]

Why in the HELL would we offer our best player, Moss, up for trade when he has one year left on his contract?

Yes, such a personnel move would be unprecedented!

 

[Sivy]

There are 3 stops needed in the 2010-2011 season


Stop one: Sign a WR

Stop two: Sign a GREAT pass rusher

then next stop, superbowl.

Thats it, I really think its that simple.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Butler, Vollmer, and Edelman show a lot of promise so I'm not completely sold on the terrible draft argument. I still haven't given up on Chung becoming a valuable player, either.

I admit though that there have been a few more swings and misses of late.

I don't think the Pats have been swinging and missing so much as they haven't been hitting home runs. This is partly a product of not having many good draft pick (Welker and Moss trades), and partly a product of turning our first rounders into solid starters, but not all-pros (Meriweather, Mankins, who as good as he is is still a guard, Maroney, vs. potentially Mayo)--(btw, what's up with drafting Ms in the first round?). We're getting solid contributors in the first round and beyond, but we need draft some draft picks to pan out like Seymour, Light, Samuel, Warren, Wilfork, and Mankins did. We need that occasional fourth rounder to turn into a pro bowl player like Samuel did.

FWIW, I do think that this strategy--drafting solidly, with more regard for getting quality players than hitting home runs--can work, but only if you're turning FAs like Mike Vrabel into stars, or getting guys like Moss and Welker on the cheap. Since those are tough acts to replicate, I think more and more we're going to have to start leaning on the draft to find playmakers.

Also, I don't totally disagree with you, because there have been some particularly costly swings and misses in rounds 2-3 (Jackson, Wheatley, Crable, O'Connell), but pretty much every team has some of those.

 

[condon84]

By far the shrewdest move in the Belichick era: Draft three straight mediocre draft classes, let talented but expensive players go or trade them, sign key players like Kazcur and Sanders, let inexperienced and overmatched coordinators run the offense and defense, lose in the first round, and finally go into an uncapped offseason with enough money to sign more Lenons, Galloways, and Bakers (we can't have enough TEs, they're integral in our offense).

I can't wait for this offseason. I'm sure we'll do something we don't normally do.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Yes, such a personnel move would be unprecedented!

If you're talking about Moss's last contract with the Raiders, then that's exhibit A in what not to do, so you're pretty much making Kontra's point for him.

If you're talking about the Branch fiasco, that was Deion forcing the issue. The Pats most definitely did not want to deal him, and trading him probably cost them the Super Bowl that year. Once again... kinda making Kontra's point for him.

 

[sieglo]

If you're talking about Moss's last contract with the Raiders, then that's exhibit A in what not to do, so you're pretty much making Kontra's point for him.

If you're talking about the Branch fiasco, that was Deion forcing the issue. The Pats most definitely did not want to deal him, and trading him probably cost them the Super Bowl that year. Once again... kinda making Kontra's point for him.

I'm talking about Richard Seymour, actually.

And I'm not arguing for or against the wisdom of the move, just saying that it's happened before, so we shouldn't completely rule out the possibility of it happening again.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

If you're talking about Moss's last contract with the Raiders, then that's exhibit A in what not to do, so you're pretty much making Kontra's point for him.

If you're talking about the Branch fiasco, that was Deion forcing the issue. The Pats most definitely did not want to deal him, and trading him probably cost them the Super Bowl that year. Once again... kinda making Kontra's point for him.

And it's not like Seymour was a good analogy, either, since the Pats at least have players who could theoretically do what Seymour did; they don't have anyone else ATM who can do what Moss does.

 

[captain stone]

By far the shrewdest move in the Belichick era: Have three straight lousy draft classes - and 4 out of the past 5, let talented but expensive players go or trade them, sign key JAGs like Kazcur and Sanders, let inexperienced and overmatched coordinators run the offense and defense, lose in the first round, and finally go into an uncapped offseason with enough money to sign more Lenons, Galloways, and Bakers (we can't have enough TEs, they're integral in our offense).

I can't wait for this offseason. I'm sure we'll do something we don't normally do.

Fixed it just a wee bit for ya. What you wrote would be really funny, if it weren't also really true. Good post.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

That's a very interesting opinion, but you still haven't backed it up with anything resembling logic, common sense, or coherency.

And no, "Brady was better without Moss" doesn't count, because it's provably untrue. Getting rid of Moss means:

a) you don't think he's worth $5 million this year (his non-sunk cost)
b) you think we can get more than he's worth in a trade
c) you don't think that this would piss Brady off
d) you're comfortable going into 2010 with either Julian Edelman or a new guy who has never played with us before as our #1 WR.

I think the question about retaining Moss is looking at it two ways..

Can Moss help the Patriots get to the playoffs?..certainly

Can Moss help the Patriots win a Super Bowl once in the playoffs?...Not so sure about that since he has been a non factor in 4 playoff games.

 

[RobertWeathers]

He may not have the top-end speed that he used to but Moss has a year or two left of solid production and is still of value to this offense. However, he will be 33 next year. Gotta get a prime-time-player on the other side ready.

 

[pheenix11]

I must be brilliant because this was the 2nd thing I thought of as well when we lost.

First thing was #&%@#

 

[SeymourTrophies]

I think the question about retaining Moss is looking at it two ways..

Can Moss help the Patriots get to the playoffs?..certainly

Can Moss help the Patriots win a Super Bowl once in the playoffs?...Not so sure about that since he has been a non factor in 4 playoff games.

So, the fact that the Jags dropped back into a zone the entire game and gave brady the underneath passes to the tune of some ridiculous passer rating had nothing to do with the attention paid to Moss? Moss' impact on the team is way more than numbers. Everyone else is a little more open because Moss is on the team.

Moss also didn't have a bad game against the Ravens.

I'm not glad that we sidestepped the uncapped year madness at the expense of our scalps, but we certainly do have a chance to alleviate these problems. We won't make some ridiculous amount of signings because you don't know what comes in terms of salary cap for the next year, but this would be a good year to need a roster rehab.

 

[Patspsycho]

There are 3 stops needed in the 2010-2011 season


Stop one: Sign a WR

Stop two: Sign a GREAT pass rusher

then next stop, superbowl.

Thats it, I really think its that simple.

The superbowl ain't a "stop." It's the end of the yellow brick road.

 

[ausbacker]

Forgive me for harping on and sounding like a broken record, but we're a pass first team with a great quarterback at the helm. Receiver is a need, but I still believe we need an upgrade on the offensive line, as we're only as good as they let Brady play.

Either change the philosophy, or put Brady behind better protection.

 

[Kontradiction]

Yes, such a personnel move would be unprecedented!

It's not unprecendented, but it IS idiotic. Besides Brady, Moss is pretty clearly our best offensive player. You can complain about his lack of going over the middle all you want. However, we knew what we were getting when we signed him. To complain about that now is an exercise in futility, at the very least. On top of him being our best offensive player NOT playing quarterback, he can also help ease the pain of change in the receiving corps over the course of this year. This is all on top of the fact that he has one more year left on his contract and we are going into an uncapped year. Once again, letting Moss go would be, at the very least, idiotic.