Julio Jones.

[Off The Grid]

I think that Brother Maine's analysis of BenJarvus Green's sluggish + slothfull ways ~ my words, not his ~ should be required reading: The largest problem our O Line had ~ except maybe Dan Connolly ~ was BenJarvus Green: One of our most potent advantages on Offense is that teams have very little idea, before the snap, what our deadly Hybrids ~ Rob Gronkowski, in particular ~ will be doing on that play...unless Green is in the backfield, because his utter lack of Explosiveness means that BOTH Tight Ends all too often need to stay in and block.

There are at least TWENTY Backs in this draft who could dramatically improve on Green...most of them available from the 3rd Round, on.

If we get an elite level O Guard to supplant Connolly, and pick up a few explosive Running Backs to supplant Green ~ and maybe a couple more Super Hybrid Tight Ends, to exploit and expand the tactical advantage we just seized, there ~ then I simply don't think teams are going to be able to game plan for us.

My Take​

We simply do not need another Wide Out, much though I love Julio Jones.

U want us to draft another TE?

Absolutely.

In fact, I want us to draft at least TWO.

This game, as always, is changing.

I believe that Super Hybrid Tight Ends ~ Wing Backs like Rob Gronkowski and Wing Ends like Aaron Hernandez ~ offer an IMMENSE tactical advantage against an increasingly smaller and quicker Defensive LandScape.

So, yeah: With Alge Crumpler and Hernandez both having health questions, I'd like to see us draft a couple of Mid Round BEASTS ~ Lance Kendricks and Jordan Cameron, to be exact ~ and stock up with a couple of P Squad guys, like Will Yeatman and Brett Brackett.

There's a unique Opportunity, here...and I want to see us POUNCE on it.

I'm curious, how would you use 4 or 5 te's in this offense and at the same time?

Are you planning on rotating the players or run a 4 TE set with 1 rb? Maybe a 5te set?

I'd be looking to run a lot of 2 + 3 Tight End Sets: The possibilities that those guys would bring for hitting the enemy with a bad match up on virtually every single play would be IMMENSE.

Those many moves ~ including one or two P Squad guys ~ would be for Depth, as well.

But that doesn't mean I would forgo a 4 Tight End Set, either!!

~ Rob Gronkowski
~ Lance Kendricks
~ Aaron Hernandez
~ Jordan Cameron

With Cameron Split Wide, Hernandez at Flanker, and Kendricks at Slot??

SERIOUS tactical possibilities, gentlemen.

 

[RussFrancis]

That's just not realistic.

 

[bakes781]

I definitely understand your logic, but am I the only one that actually wants Julio?

I want him and in fact like him over AJ Green. If he falls out of the top 10 by all means let's get on the phone.

 

[mcsully]

I'd be looking to run a lot of 2 + 3 Tight End Sets: The possibilities that those guys would bring for hitting the enemy with a bad match up on virtually every single play would be IMMENSE.

Those many moves ~ including one or two P Squad guys ~ would be for Depth, as well.

But that doesn't mean I would forgo a 4 Tight End Set, either!!

~ Rob Gronkowski
~ Lance Kendricks
~ Aaron Hernandez
~ Jordan Cameron

With Cameron Split Wide, Hernandez at Flanker, and Kendricks at Slot??

SERIOUS tactical possibilities, gentlemen.

Okay I heard your POV but to be honest, this is crazier than "lets trade for FitzGerald" or "NGATA plays NT (which is still funny because I realize people don't watch football outside of NE)", "Trade Mankins for Ware"

In today's football, you have a limited amt of resources.. Allocating your chips correctly, provides a team with depth and talent at mulitple positions.. Your thinking goes against the grain and is not realistic.

Sorry but I'm saying "HELLO NO"

 

[Kontradiction]

You'd be better off grabbing Hankerson or someone later on than getting Jones. His hype is kinda silly going off of his combine performance. He's a good player, certainly, but he's no where near the player AJ Green. Granted Jones' upside is similar to TO, he's not worth the pick considering he's a better fit for the west coast system than ours.

I agree with the first sentence (as I like Hankerson myself), but the rest of the post is off. I'd take Jones in this offense over A.J. Green. Julio Jones did most of his work over the middle and racked up a ton of YAC on short passes and screens. He's as good a fit for this offense as anybody in the draft. The only reason why I would go with Hankerson over Jones is that I don't believe the Pats are going to take a WR that high, even though it is a priority.

 

[Off The Grid]

I'd be looking to run a lot of 2 + 3 Tight End Sets: The possibilities that those guys would bring for hitting the enemy with a bad match up on virtually every single play would be IMMENSE.

Those many moves ~ including one or two P Squad guys ~ would be for Depth, as well.

But that doesn't mean I would forgo a 4 Tight End Set, either!!

~ Rob Gronkowski
~ Lance Kendricks
~ Aaron Hernandez
~ Jordan Cameron

With Cameron Split Wide, Hernandez at Flanker, and Kendricks at Slot??

SERIOUS tactical possibilities, gentlemen.

Okay I heard your POV but to be honest, this is crazier than "lets trade for FitzGerald" or "NGATA plays NT (which is still funny because I realize people don't watch football outside of NE)", "Trade Mankins for Ware"

In today's football, you have a limited amt of resources.. Allocating your chips correctly, provides a team with depth and talent at mulitple positions.. Your thinking goes against the grain and is not realistic.

Sorry but I'm saying "HELLO NO"

Actually, it's quite brilliant, thank you. Your inability to grasp it does not render it "crazy".

However, it certainly is "against the grain". Please note my Screen Name.

I'm not sure you completely grasp what "realistic" is.

Nor is that important: I'm not selling "realistic." I was merely sharing an idea, at your request.

The question you should be asking is: "Would it be effective?"


I agree with your dissertation about spreading Depth though out the Roster, but find it strange that you should address that to me in this thread, considering that my original point, clearly stated, was that we have enough Receivers. Also, considering that you haven't seen my entire Mock, your lecture about "depth and talent at multiple positions" seems as presumptuous as it is ironic, addressed to somebody ~ me ~ who is often expounding the importance of Depth of Talent.

*No need to be "sorry." With respect, I haven't seen much in your posts ~ particularly this one ~ to place great import on your opinion. More to the point, I was clearly not asking for your approval: I was answering your question, as a courtesy.

 

[Off The Grid]

I'd take Jones in this offense over A.J. Green. Julio Jones did most of his work over the middle and racked up a ton of YAC on short passes and screens. He's as good a fit for this offense as anybody in the draft. The only reason why I would go with Hankerson over Jones is that I don't believe the Pats are going to take a WR that high, even though it is a priority.

Couldn't agree more: Julio Jones is an absolute BEAST of a blocker, and a nightmare to tackle.

AJ Green should be spectacular, but in terms of Moving The Chains and controlling the ball ~ which I believe is far more important than HighLight Reel Catches, if you're interested in winning Super Bowls ~ Julio Jones is, in my view, clearly the superior Wide Out.

He's been my favorite Wide Out in this entire Draft Class for as long as the concept has existed. I have to admit that I was shocked at how fast he timed at the Combine, but that was just Icing on the Cake.

 

[supafly]

However, it certainly is "against the grain". Please note my Screen Name.

Yes, "Brother" Grid is an acquired taste. Much like a fine wine....or a very strong and bitter whiskey

....or maybe a bottle of Mad Dog 20/20??

Regardless of his 4 TE set idea, he brings a different perspective to the forum; like most of us--some ideas are approved, some are not.

One thing I will admit, his posts always make you think

 

[supafly]

Couldn't agree more: Julio Jones is an absolute BEAST of a blocker, and a nightmare to tackle.

AJ Green should be spectacular, but in terms of Moving The Chains and controlling the ball ~ which I believe is far more important than HighLight Reel Catches, if you're interested in winning Super Bowls ~ Julio Jones is, in my view, clearly the superior Wide Out.

He's been my favorite Wide Out in this entire Draft Class for as long as the concept has existed. I have to admit that I was shocked at how fast he timed at the Combine, but that was just Icing on the Cake.

Jones was the one with the foot issue to boot too, correct? A fast time with a foot issue is indeed impressive.

 

[Dufflebagz]

I'd be looking to run a lot of 2 + 3 Tight End Sets: The possibilities that those guys would bring for hitting the enemy with a bad match up on virtually every single play would be IMMENSE.

Those many moves ~ including one or two P Squad guys ~ would be for Depth, as well.

But that doesn't mean I would forgo a 4 Tight End Set, either!!

~ Rob Gronkowski
~ Lance Kendricks
~ Aaron Hernandez
~ Jordan Cameron

With Cameron Split Wide, Hernandez at Flanker, and Kendricks at Slot??

SERIOUS tactical possibilities, gentlemen.

You just blew my mind!!!

Even though this will never happen, I thank you for the interesting formation ideas and if it does amazingly happen I will bow down to your mighty powers :youtheman:

 

[Off The Grid]

I'd be looking to run a lot of 2 + 3 Tight End Sets: The possibilities that those guys would bring for hitting the enemy with a bad match up on virtually every single play would be IMMENSE.

Those many moves ~ including one or two P Squad guys ~ would be for Depth, as well.

But that doesn't mean I would forgo a 4 Tight End Set, either!!

~ Rob Gronkowski
~ Lance Kendricks
~ Aaron Hernandez
~ Jordan Cameron

With Cameron Split Wide, Hernandez at Flanker, and Kendricks at Slot??

SERIOUS tactical possibilities, gentlemen.

You just blew my mind!!!

Even though this will never happen, I thank you for the interesting formation ideas and if it does amazingly happen I will bow down to your mighty powers :youtheman:

As a BIG fan of your work, I am both honored and humbled by your praise, Good Sir Brother Duffle.

I thank ye kindly.

 

[Off The Grid]

I agree with the first sentence (as I like Hankerson myself), but the rest of the post is off. I'd take Jones in this offense over A.J. Green. Julio Jones did most of his work over the middle and racked up a ton of YAC on short passes and screens. He's as good a fit for this offense as anybody in the draft. The only reason why I would go with Hankerson over Jones is that I don't believe the Pats are going to take a WR that high, even though it is a priority.

Couldn't agree more: Julio Jones is an absolute BEAST of a blocker, and a nightmare to tackle.

AJ Green should be spectacular, but in terms of Moving The Chains and controlling the ball ~ which I believe is far more important than HighLight Reel Catches, if you're interested in winning Super Bowls ~ Julio Jones is, in my view, clearly the superior Wide Out.

He's been my favorite Wide Out in this entire Draft Class for as long as the concept has existed. I have to admit that I was shocked at how fast he timed at the Combine, but that was just Icing on the Cake.

Jones was the one with the foot issue to boot too, correct?

A fast time with a foot issue is indeed impressive.

VERY good point.

I remember, afterwords, many were actually saying he should be downgraded for that.

Amazing.

 

[Off The Grid]

However, it certainly is "against the grain". Please note my Screen Name.

Yes, "Brother" Grid is an acquired taste. Much like a fine wine....or a very strong and bitter whiskey

....or maybe a bottle of Mad Dog 20/20??

Regardless of his 4 TE set idea, he brings a different perspective to the forum; like most of us--some ideas are approved, some are not.

One thing I will admit, his posts always make you think

Wow.

High praise, indeed.

Thank you kindly, Brother Fly.

"Acquired Taste" and "His Posts always make you think." are about the best compliments I could possibly wish for. I come here to read, as much as to write, because there are many fine FootBall minds, hereabouts, that make ME think. I couldn't imagine being arrogant enough to expect to instantly convert others to my views, based on my writing: Men and women employ the ideas of others not to substitute for their own, but as fuel and fodder to inspire their own creativity. Thus, I do not seek approval, even from those I admire.

But it is certainly gratefully and humbly appreciated, on those rare occasions when it is issued!!

*Addendum: The greatest compliment of them all may've been the comparison to a strong, bitter Whiskey. Jack Daniels and I go WAAAAAAAAAAAAY back.

The Mad Dog reference is something I should find insulting.

Tragically, it is NOT.

I and Mad Dog 20/20 ~ The "Jaws 4: The Revenge" of Wines ~ ALSO go way back!!

 

[supafly]

Wow.

High praise, indeed.

Thank you kindly, Brother Fly.

"Acquired Taste" and "His Posts always make you think." are about the best compliments I could possibly wish for. I come here to read, as much as to write, because there are many fine FootBall minds, hereabouts, that make ME think. I couldn't imagine being arrogant enough to expect to instantly convert others to my views, based on my writing: Men and women employ the ideas of others not to substitute for their own, but as fuel and fodder to inspire their own creativity. Thus, I do not seek approval, even from those I admire.

But it is certainly gratefully and humbly appreciated, on those rare occasions when it is issued!!

*Addendum: The greatest compliment of them all may've been the comparison to a strong, bitter Whiskey. Jack Daniels and I go WAAAAAAAAAAAAY back.

The Mad Dog reference is something I should find insulting.

Tragically, it is NOT.

I and Mad Dog 20/20 ~ The "Jaws 4: The Revenge" of Wines ~ ALSO go way back!!

I by no means meant it to be even remotely insulting, as we may not agree on everything but I do appreciate the different views you bring, and your usually jovial self.

I too, go way back with MD 20/20, as I actually have a scar on my left hand to prove it--busted right through a double frosted pane window. Not too bad considering I am right handed. That's the bite the Mad Dog would bring when you're in your late teens/early 20's. Fond memories indeed

 

[mcsully]

Actually, it's quite brilliant, thank you. Your inability to grasp it does not render it "crazy".

However, it certainly is "against the grain". Please note my Screen Name.

I'm not sure you completely grasp what "realistic" is.

Nor is that important: I'm not selling "realistic." I was merely sharing an idea, at your request.

The question you should be asking is: "Would it be effective?"


I agree with your dissertation about spreading Depth though out the Roster, but find it strange that you should address that to me in this thread, considering that my original point, clearly stated, was that we have enough Receivers. Also, considering that you haven't seen my entire Mock, your lecture about "depth and talent at multiple positions" seems as presumptuous as it is ironic, addressed to somebody ~ me ~ who is often expounding the importance of Depth of Talent.

*No need to be "sorry." With respect, I haven't seen much in your posts ~ particularly this one ~ to place great import on your opinion. More to the point, I was clearly not asking for your approval: I was answering your question, as a courtesy.

"dissertation", "ironic" & "presumptuous "?? Um, I think you need to put the word of the day calander back in the desk.. Dissertations involve submitting documentation for an academic purpose, which I'm not doing. Ironic and presumptuous? Can't put all your assets into TE and then pound the table saying we need depth, its not Madden..


My logic is simple, you initially stated your POV about drafting more TE's and I followed up by asking how this would this work. Your answer was "not out of the box" or "off the grid", it was just vanilla, with no substance.. And you're right, I can't understand it.. Just like I can't understand why someone PUSHES on a door when it has a sign that says PULL. I don't get why they do that even though I can open the door

Joking aside, what made this team so good for years is its ability to be flexible on offense and defense. Each week, the pats would come out and play a different style. You need to ask yourself, how much better is this team by taking a jones or TE? How many more wins does it bring us. The pats were a top 5 team in scoring. If we bring in a Jones, does it move us to a Top 3 and put us over the hump in the playoffs?

If Jones falls, I'm up for drafting him, great value.. But if we're going to use additional resources to obtain a player, lets focus on a weakness not a strength

 

[Off The Grid]

McSully, I answered your original question as a courtesy.

If you're going to respond like a four year old and make fun of how I write ~ as if the way I say something matters ~ while you describe my notion of a potentially dynamic new Scheme as "vanilla" simply because you don't understand it...then I can't claim to have any further interest in discussing this with you.

 

[Off The Grid]

Yes, "Brother" Grid is an acquired taste. Much like a fine wine....or a very strong and bitter whiskey

....or maybe a bottle of Mad Dog 20/20??

Regardless of his 4 TE set idea, he brings a different perspective to the forum; like most of us--some ideas are approved, some are not.

One thing I will admit, his posts always make you think.

Wow.

High praise, indeed.

Thank you kindly, Brother Fly.

"Acquired Taste" and "His Posts always make you think." are about the best compliments I could possibly wish for. I come here to read, as much as to write, because there are many fine FootBall minds, hereabouts, that make ME think. I couldn't imagine being arrogant enough to expect to instantly convert others to my views, based on my writing: Men and women employ the ideas of others not to substitute for their own, but as fuel and fodder to inspire their own creativity. Thus, I do not seek approval, even from those I admire.

But it is certainly gratefully and humbly appreciated, on those rare occasions when it is issued!!

*Addendum: The greatest compliment of them all may've been the comparison to a strong, bitter Whiskey. Jack Daniels and I go WAAAAAAAAAAAAY back.

The Mad Dog reference is something I should find insulting.

Tragically, it is NOT.

I and Mad Dog 20/20 ~ The "Jaws 4: The Revenge" of Wines ~ ALSO go way back!!

I by no means meant it to be even remotely insulting, as we may not agree on everything but I do appreciate the different views you bring, and your usually jovial self.

I too, go way back with MD 20/20, as I actually have a scar on my left hand to prove it--busted right through a double frosted pane window. Not too bad considering I am right handed. That's the bite the Mad Dog would bring when you're in your late teens/early 20's. Fond memories indeed

Hah!! "Usually jovial self." Another compliment!! That's it: I'm sending you flowers!!

LOVE the Mad Dog story!! "If you think his LEFT hurts, you should see his RIGHT!!"

Can't claim any such battle scars, I'm afraid...However, when I've sufficiently elevated my thinking with the influx of vast quantities of Fizzy Lifting Drinks, I have been known to steal the odd Traffic Cone...or car.

It seemed like the thing to do at the time.

 

[mcsully]

McSully, I answered your original question as a courtesy.

If you're going to respond like a four year old and make fun of how I write ~ as if the way I say something matters ~ while you describe my notion of a potentially dynamic new Scheme as "vanilla" simply because you don't understand it...then I can't claim to have any further interest in discussing this with you.

ahahhahaha.. Keep pushing on that door

 

[VJCPatriot]

Joking aside, what made this team so good for years is its ability to be flexible on offense and defense. Each week, the pats would come out and play a different style. You need to ask yourself, how much better is this team by taking a jones or TE? How many more wins does it bring us. The pats were a top 5 team in scoring. If we bring in a Jones, does it move us to a Top 3 and put us over the hump in the playoffs?

If Jones falls, I'm up for drafting him, great value.. But if we're going to use additional resources to obtain a player, lets focus on a weakness not a strength

To be more accurate, the Pats were the #1 scoring team in 2010 (32.4 ppg). They were also a top 10 offense of all time in terms of total points scored (518). All without the services of Julio Jones and Randy Moss for only 4 games out of the 16. The key to that was Tom Brady's terrific play yielding 36 tds vs only 4 ints.

I wouldn't put my nose up at drafting a WR in 2011 but it's clearly not a priority need that would warrant a 1st round pick. I'll take a Hankerson or Torrey Smith later in round 2. In round 1 I want to focus on defense which was clearly the Pats' achilles heel in 2010.

 

[mcsully]

To be more accurate, the Pats were the #1 scoring team in 2010 (32.4 ppg). They were also a top 10 offense of all time in terms of total points scored (518). All without the services of Julio Jones and Randy Moss for only 4 games out of the 16. The key to that was Tom Brady's terrific play yielding 36 tds vs only 4 ints.

I wouldn't put my nose up at drafting a WR in 2011 but it's clearly not a priority need that would warrant a 1st round pick. I'll take a Hankerson or Torrey Smith later in round 2. In round 1 I want to focus on defense which was clearly the Pats' achilles heel in 2010.

Thanks for the info on actual ratings.. But as we agree, there are more pressing needs.