How many picks do the Jets have in 2011?

[SirApropos]

Fair enough. Thanks for the corrections on Branch and Brown.

As for Weston. He was waived/injured. Yes, he ended up on the Pats IR list because he cleared waivers, but I believe that his contract was shortened to a 1 year deal as a result. But I am not 100%.

As for Ohrnberger, I wouldn't assume anything.

Why do you have Wendell, Arrington and Barrett as RFA and not ERFA? They are all only 2nd year players.. They would need to have 3 accrued seasons to be RFA..

Fair enough.
I think I am looking at the year they were drafted (2008) and overlooked the fact they were PS players for their first year. Regardless the Pats have their rights for next year.

 

[DaBruinz]

Fair enough.
I think I am looking at the year they were drafted (2008) and overlooked the fact they were PS players for their first year. Regardless the Pats have their rights for next year.

BTW, In lieu of your corrections, I have emailed Miguel with the items I saw that needed to be updated..

 

[PatsFanStnfrd]

The Jets are going to everything they can to hold on to Cromartie, Holmes, Edwards, Harris and Ellis. They have done a good job locking in Mangold, Brickshaw Ferguson and Revis. That is their modus operandi -- get talent by trade on the cheap (including "problem" kids like Cro and Holmes and Edwards) -- and then sign them. They know they don't have many draft picks but they have always gone for quality over quantity. They are also good about recruiting UDFA rookies.

Will this work? Apparently, they succeeded in convincing Mangold and Ferguson to take contracts that are team friendly -- so they are selling "Rex Ryan" coach and a particular kind of team atmosphere to their players. Will others like Holmes and Cromartie follow their lead or go the Revis route of "pay me NOW". They will benefit because they will have little or no competition from others because of CBA uncertainty.

Their draft strategy of going for quality over quantity hit a rough patch in 2010. Their CB Wilson is not what they hoped for nor can they be delighted by Joe McKnight chosen one pick ahead of Hernandez.

Their strategy thus far has been aided by the poor trading acumen of Mangini who basically gave them Sanchez for a bag of beans. Tannenbaum pulled off the heist of the franchise. For that reason alone, Mangini should never again be entrusted with personnel decisions. He also traded away Edwards for a song. The Jets can't continue to count on such generosity in the future now that they have a high profile and success to match.

 

[Metaphors]

2 -QB Brady, Hoyer
2 - RB BJGE, Woodhead
5 - WR Branch, Welker, Tate, Edelman, Price
3 - TE Gronkowski, Hernandez, Crumpler
8 - OL Light, Mankins, Koppen, Neal, Vollmer, Kaczur, Connolly, LeVoir, Wendell, Ohrnberger
9 - DL Warren, Wilfork, Deaderick, Brace, Pryor, Wright, Weston, Love, Richard
8 - LB TBC, Mayo, Spikes, Cunningham, Ninkovich, Guyton, Fletcher, Woods
5 - CB Bodden, McCourty, Butler, Arrington, Wilhite
5 - S Meriweather, Chung, Sanders, Brown, Barrett
5 - ST Gostkowski, Mesko, Katula, Slater, Lockett

20 under Pats control on offense...2 meaningful UFA, 6 over 30 yo during 2011 draft
27 under Pats control on defense...0 meaningful UFA, 2 over 30 yo during 2011 draft

Outside of a couple RBs and freshening up the OL, the Pats will be able to pretty much return the same team next year. Obviously they won't. With history as a guide and given the high draft picks next year, expect 8-10 new players in 2011.

That is really the key. Those 3 to 4 elite drafted players next year won't be filling holes...they will be displacing talented and generally productive players. And the cap shouldn't be a concern.

This is certainly not the case for most teams, including the Jets. Outside of Harris, Cromartie, every S except Leonard and every WR except Cotchery heading to free agency, they are getting older at OL (right side), DL and LB. Their recent drafts have not given them a ready pipeline of replacements or quality depth. Only a fairly remarkable stretch of good health these last 2 years have kept them from being exposed (can't bring up Jenkins because he is 400 lbs. of human playing on knee ligaments made of chewing gum...signing him to big money until he is 34 was insane).

The other difference is that the Pats have enough "capital" in the bank to weather some sub-optimal years like the last 2. The Jets have none. Ryan's big talk will get old really quick if the Jets start descending instead of ascending. Given their altitude in January was the AFCC game and Ryan has explicitly said that they are the best team in the NFL...well you can see where I am going with this. It will take a deep run in the playoffs this year and a championship by next year to keep this from getting ugly.

 

[Metaphors]

Will this work? Apparently, they succeeded in convincing Mangold and Ferguson to take contracts that are team friendly

The Mangold and Ferguson contracts are "team-friendly" only in the ability of the Jets to terminate them. If Mangold and Ferguson stay healthy and actually play for the Jets (if they don't, they would need replacing), they will be pulling in some serious coin. This narrative that the Jets signed them for less than the going rate is silly. The Jets were smart to protect themselves from those contracts turning into boat anchors, but they didn't get any kind of discount.

so they are selling "Rex Ryan" coach and a particular kind of team atmosphere to their players. Will others like Holmes and Cromartie follow their lead or go the Revis route of "pay me NOW".

Again, this idea that players in their prime earning years will take less money to play for Ryan (or Belichick or anybody) is crazy. To keep these players from free agency, the Jets will have to pay top dollar. Once they get to free agency, they will follow the money unless the Jets come pretty close to matching.

The "Rex Ryan" factor only works for older veterans that have gotten their money. Still a useful commodity, but Ryan will eventually need some hardware to keep his tough talk from becoming verbal diarrhea. Everyone wanted to play for his dad after the Bears Super Bowl win. The Eagles were even a regular playoff participant...but once it became clear they weren't winning a title, Buddy quickly became an NFL footnote (after a quick stop in Arizona where careers go to die). So Rex knows the deal better than most. The clock is ticking...

 

[Off The Grid]

2 -QB Brady, Hoyer
2 - RB BJGE, Woodhead
5 - WR Branch, Welker, Tate, Edelman, Price
3 - TE Gronkowski, Hernandez, Crumpler
8 - OL Light, Mankins, Koppen, Neal, Vollmer, Kaczur, Connolly, LeVoir, Wendell, Ohrnberger
9 - DL Warren, Wilfork, Deaderick, Brace, Pryor, Wright, Weston, Love, Richard
8 - LB TBC, Mayo, Spikes, Cunningham, Ninkovich, Guyton, Fletcher, Woods
5 - CB Bodden, McCourty, Butler, Arrington, Wilhite
5 - S Meriweather, Chung, Sanders, Brown, Barrett
5 - ST Gostkowski, Mesko, Katula, Slater, Lockett

20 under Pats control on offense...2 meaningful UFA, 6 over 30 yo during 2011 draft
27 under Pats control on defense...0 meaningful UFA, 2 over 30 yo during 2011 draft

Outside of a couple RBs and freshening up the OL, the Pats will be able to pretty much return the same team next year. Obviously they won't. With history as a guide and given the high draft picks next year, expect 8-10 new players in 2011.

That is really the key. Those 3 to 4 elite drafted players next year won't be filling holes...they will be displacing talented and generally productive players. And the cap shouldn't be a concern.

This is certainly not the case for most teams, including the Jets. Outside of Harris, Cromartie, every S except Leonard and every WR except Cotchery heading to free agency, they are getting older at OL (right side), DL and LB. Their recent drafts have not given them a ready pipeline of replacements or quality depth. Only a fairly remarkable stretch of good health these last 2 years have kept them from being exposed (can't bring up Jenkins because he is 400 lbs. of human playing on knee ligaments made of chewing gum...signing him to big money until he is 34 was insane).

The other difference is that the Pats have enough "capital" in the bank to weather some sub-optimal years like the last 2. The Jets have none. Ryan's big talk will get old really quick if the Jets start descending instead of ascending. Given their altitude in January was the AFCC game and Ryan has explicitly said that they are the best team in the NFL...well you can see where I am going with this. It will take a deep run in the playoffs this year and a championship by next year to keep this from getting ugly.

Beautifully put.

I'm probably the only Yankee in ALL of New England who likes Rex Ryan: I love his complete disregard for all the conventional PC nonsense. To me, he's an Old School Throw Back who keeps it simple. Having said all that...

You NAILED it, and many in this thread touched on it: The Jets have WAFER thin Depth of Talent.

Their success is real, but extremely fragile.

I'm actually reminded of the 1986 Jets, who blasted their way to a 10-1 start behind a ferocious Defense that just destroyed the Run...and then suffering a sudden, shocking, and spectacular collapse, as Mark Gastineau, Joe Klecko, and some other guy or guys got knocked out: they started serving up points by the TRUCK load, lost all 5 of their remaining games, and staggered blearily into the Play Offs as a Wild Card, only making it by the skin of their teeth.

Two or Three injuries to the wrong guys ~ something we've already withstood with stunning resilience ~ and they could simply TANK.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Beautifully put.

I'm probably the only Yankee in ALL of New England who likes Rex Ryan: I love his complete disregard for all the conventional PC nonsense. To me, he's an Old School Throw Back who keeps it simple. Having said all that...

You NAILED it, and many in this thread touched on it: The Jets have WAFER thin Depth of Talent.

Their success is real, but extremely fragile.

I'm actually reminded of the 1986 Jets, who blasted their way to a 10-1 start behind a ferocious Defense that just destroyed the Run...and then suffering a sudden, shocking, and spectacular collapse, as Mark Gastineau, Joe Klecko, and some other guy or guys got knocked out: they started serving up points by the TRUCK load, lost all 5 of their remaining games, and staggered blearily into the Play Offs as a Wild Card, only making it by the skin of their teeth.

Two or Three injuries to the wrong guys ~ something we've already withstood with stunning resilience ~ and they could simply TANK.

Now that's a pleasant memory. We had a god-awful defense that year too. Amazing we won division. Throw in a historically poor running game for us too. 2.9 apc. Hannah retired and Brian Holloway didn't like football any more. Tony Eason actually had a pretty good season along with Grogs having a great year out of the bullpen. Stanley Morgan had the best season a Patriot WR ever had. Until 2007 Randy Moss.

 

[patsfaninpa]

The Jets are going to everything they can to hold on to Cromartie, Holmes, Edwards, Harris and Ellis. They have done a good job locking in Mangold, Brickshaw Ferguson and Revis. That is their modus operandi -- get talent by trade on the cheap (including "problem" kids like Cro and Holmes and Edwards) -- and then sign them. They know they don't have many draft picks but they have always gone for quality over quantity. They are also good about recruiting UDFA rookies.

Will this work? Apparently, they succeeded in convincing Mangold and Ferguson to take contracts that are team friendly -- so they are selling "Rex Ryan" coach and a particular kind of team atmosphere to their players. Will others like Holmes and Cromartie follow their lead or go the Revis route of "pay me NOW". They will benefit because they will have little or no competition from others because of CBA uncertainty.

Their draft strategy of going for quality over quantity hit a rough patch in 2010. Their CB Wilson is not what they hoped for nor can they be delighted by Joe McKnight chosen one pick ahead of Hernandez.

Their strategy thus far has been aided by the poor trading acumen of Mangini who basically gave them Sanchez for a bag of beans. Tannenbaum pulled off the heist of the franchise. For that reason alone, Mangini should never again be entrusted with personnel decisions. He also traded away Edwards for a song. The Jets can't continue to count on such generosity in the future now that they have a high profile and success to match.

What makes that even more amazing. He made those trades with a team that fired him a couple of months before that. Unreal. Me thinks he still hates the Pats and doesn't mind seeing the Jets beat us.

 

[Off The Grid]

* You NAILED it, and many in this thread touched on it:

* The Jets have WAFER thin Depth of Talent.

* Their success is real, but extremely fragile.

I'm actually reminded of the 1986 Jets, who blasted their way to a 10-1 start behind a ferocious Defense that just destroyed the Run...

...and then suffering a sudden, shocking, and spectacular collapse, as Mark Gastineau, Joe Klecko, and some other guy or guys got knocked out: they started serving up points by the TRUCK load, lost all 5 of their remaining games, and staggered blearily into the Play Offs as a Wild Card, only making it by the skin of their teeth.

Two or Three injuries to the wrong guys ~ something we've already withstood with stunning resilience ~ and they could simply TANK.

Now that's a pleasant memory. We had a god-awful defense that year too. Amazing we won division. Throw in a historically poor running game for us too. 2.9 apc. Hannah retired and Brian Holloway didn't like football any more. Tony Eason actually had a pretty good season along with Grogs having a great year out of the bullpen. Stanley Morgan had the best season a Patriot WR ever had. Until 2007 Randy Moss.

Extremely Interesting Note at the Very Bottom of SportsLine's Recap:

* It was the Jets' worst loss since 45-3 to Miami on another Monday nighter, in 1986.

* New York was 10-1 then, but ravaged by injuries it lost its final five regular-season games.

 

[patsfaninpa]

You know what's great about the NFL. There are no quick fixes. The cap will be back next year. They can't go out next year and sign; Sabathia, Teixeira and Burnett. You have to acquire players thru the draft if you don't have a lot of cap space. They won't. They'll be able to keep their own. Won't be able to add. Oh, they can have a good draft. Oops, no 2nd rounder. We all know what the Pats have to look forward to in April. My guess is they cut their losses with Braylon "Los manos de piedras" Edwards and Antonio "Papi" Cromartie. They can keep S. Holmes. He's a good player. But, a jerk. Dancing around when losing 17-0 and he gets a first down. There's a reason Pittsburgh traded. He's one piss test from getting suspended for a year too.

 

[DarrylS]

The Jets have picks in each round except for 2,7 (Cromartie, Kevin O'Connell).

Their big issue next year is going to be resigning Free Agents in 2011. All of these guys are UFA.

K Nick Folk
P Steve Weatherford
QB Kellen Clemens
FB Tony Richardson
WR Braylon Edwards
WR Santonio Holmes
WR/KR Brad Smith
T Wayne Hunter
C/G Robert Turner
DE Shaun Ellis
DE Trevor Pryce
ILB David Harris
ILB Lance Laury
CB Antonio Cromartie
CB Drew Coleman
SS James Ihedigbo
FS Brodney Pool
FS Eric Smith

I can see alot of these guys going elsewhere next year for more money because the Jets can't afford to pay for them. In 2011 the Jets have 36 players signed to contracts that equal about $110.5 Mil in Cap Money. So if a Salary Cap comes back they are in a world of hurt. Conversly the Pats have 45 players signed for next year at $98 Mil in Cap Money. So not only are we getting more draft picks we are set up financially to get Free Agents as well.

I thnk I knew this, but this graphic shows how they put all their chips on the table this year.. a lot of cash is needed to replenish these FA's...

Nice post..

 

[thek1d]

You know what's great about the NFL. There are no quick fixes. The cap will be back next year. They can't go out next year and sign; Sabathia, Teixeira and Burnett. You have to acquire players thru the draft if you don't have a lot of cap space. They won't. They'll be able to keep their own. Won't be able to add. Oh, they can have a good draft. Oops, no 2nd rounder. We all know what the Pats have to look forward to in April. My guess is they cut their losses with Braylon "Los manos de piedras" Edwards and Antonio "Papi" Cromartie. They can keep S. Holmes. He's a good player. But, a jerk. Dancing around when losing 17-0 and he gets a first down. There's a reason Pittsburgh traded. He's one piss test from getting suspended for a year too.

I'd be surprised if they don't keep Braylon Edwards, especially with Holmes' suspension troubles. I think they will try to keep Cromartie, but it will have to be a team friendly deal. I expect Cro to test the market. If they can also keep David Harris they will be ok. However, they, like us, really need a pass rusher out of 2011 draft. I hope they draft another Vernon Ghoulston...

As for Santonio... say what you want about the guy, but he played hard on Monday night. Sanchez gave up in the 2nd half (Sanders pick was lol) and Edwards dropped balls like he was back in Cleveland.

 

[reflexblue]

Those 4 will be wanting a lot of money, and I can't see Pool or Smith taking much of a discount.

Don't forget Cromartie he has all those kids to feed so he will be looking for big bucks also.