Has BB turned around any problem players?

[RayClay]

I read that Sullivan was late to mini camp meetings with a NEW coach.

This is just stupid. Don't get me wrong, I think this is worth a shot. High upside, no real downside, (lose a KR, big deal).


Here's the question. Does BB have a history of motivating lazy ass, self centered or otherwise less than ideal character players.?

I ask this because I think this is a strength of Parcells. A radio guy was talking about him "breaking" T.O. and mentioned Meshawn and L.T.

No doubt, fat Tuna loves these head games, but how about BB?

Seems to me he made the decision to acquire good attitude guys in 2001 and that's worked for him.

I don't think Dillon counts IMO because he always gave 100% towards staying in shape and producing.

Thoughts?

 

[BelichickFan]

I think Dillon does count, his attitude wasn't strong his last year in Cincy when Rudy started to get more carries.

I can't think of any others offhand but it's a little bit of a loaded question because he hasn't brought a lot of problem players in. Not that I remember anyway.

 

[sarge]

In my mind, all this did was get us a chance at something for nothing.

There was a good chance Bethel wasn't making the team anyway.

So instead of cutting him, we get a ragbag with tons of potential who just might be a decent player.

That chance is remote. BUt not as remote as if we just outright cut Bethel.

 

[sarge]

Ohh yeah, as far as fixing any headcases??

None that I can think of.

Dillons issue was he hated losing. Seems to me winning a SB will cure that!

 

[RayClay]

I think Dillon does count, his attitude wasn't strong his last year in Cincy when Rudy started to get more carries.

I can't think of any others offhand but it's a little bit of a loaded question because he hasn't brought a lot of problem players in. Not that I remember anyway.

I don't want to argue the point, but I think Dillon realized he got a great opportunity and appreciated it. Of course BB did the research.

This Clown gets a fresh start with a new coach and starts out by showing up late to meetings. Obviously has the maturity level of a 3 year old.

I could see Parcells sadistic streak coming out until this guy finally broke.

I think we miss McGinest in these situations, because BB likes to rely on peer pressure.

I'm sure they didn't acquire him just to cut him, so what's the plan?

 

[PatsFanInVa]

All BB did with Dillon was trusted his own (dead on accurate) gut, on the reason Dillon was cranky. Belichick establishes the type of players he wants then looks for them, and teaches them... he doesn't convince them to do their jobs. It's like the professor who doesn't take attendance, because by the time you get to college you're supposed to want to learn - hell, you're paying for it.

Now Parcells can turn around a head case... maybe BB should think about hiring him on if he gets drummed out of Dallas. Assistant Coach for Motivational Sarcasm or something.

PFnV

 

[RayClay]

I don't think BB does something just for the hell of it at this stage of his career.

My thinking is Big Sey will step up the leadership void of McGinest. Plus he knows this guy.

Throw in Bruschi, Harrison and Troy Brown and I think this guy is going to toe the line or quit.

Just seems to me that BB counts on the team for discipline and they're not going to put up with attitude from this guy.

The Saints are an undisciplined team, to put it nicely. I can't see the veteran Pats putting up with any snit.

 

[PromisedLand]

I think Dillon does count, his attitude wasn't strong his last year in Cincy when Rudy started to get more carries.

I can't think of any others offhand but it's a little bit of a loaded question because he hasn't brought a lot of problem players in. Not that I remember anyway.

Dillon's case was completely different - he was an EXTREMELY productive player in the NFL for 6-7 seasons before his last one in Cincy, and he was injured then before losing his starting job. He was unhappy with losing, not lazy.

 

[patsfan13]

Sullivan was a teammate of big Sey, Big Sey will be depended on to provide leadership. Watson is another teammate of Sullivan.

 

[Isaac]

Here's the question. Does BB have a history of motivating lazy ass, self centered or otherwise less than ideal character players.?

I ask this because I think this is a strength of Parcells. A radio guy was talking about him "breaking" T.O. and mentioned Meshawn and L.T.

Um, I assume you don't mean to say that LT was "lazy ass". He doesn't deserve mention with Owens and Johnson, very different problems. And I wouldn't say that Parcells motivated him, he was supremely self-motivated (for all his faults).

 

[BelichickFan]

Dillon's case was completely different - he was an EXTREMELY productive player in the NFL for 6-7 seasons before his last one in Cincy, and he was injured then before losing his starting job. He was unhappy with losing, not lazy.

I didn't say it was the same. But Dillon was a "problem player" in a couple of ways which was the question that was posed. Again, I don't think Belichick has brought in many lazy players so his chance of success is unknown. It's pretty much no risk though.

 

[Joker]

BB turned around Ty "Ecstasy" Law's career after he went into the tank in the 98/99 seasons...first year, Law moped and b!tched in the media about the system...the second year he came back to All Pro form.

 

[primetime]

Wilfork was considered to have a weight problem (though not an effort problem) coming out of school.

 

[D-cleater]

Good topic for discussion but I am not so sure BB has gone after than many problem players either. That being said, it is fair to say that BB has rejuvinated many an NFL carreer and generally gets more out of his players than other coaches can ( see Hamilton, Washington, Milloy, Patten, Phifer, etc .... Even our beloved Vrabel and Harrison owe part of their success to BB's coaching system and philosophy.

I can't name one player besides Greg Spires that went on to produce more for another team than they did for the patriots, and I believe this trend continues this year. Ty Law I guess can be argued as well, he did have 10 INT's last year.

Edit:

Oh yeah, if Sullivan makes it through TC I think he sticks as a backup and eventually fills in nicely when called upon.

 

[JR4]

By now we should all know Belichick doesn't do anything with out a good reason.
If we could ask him why they made the trade I am very sure he could give
very sound reasons.

I do not believe for one second BB thought ... well we'll just give Sullivan a
try and see how he does. No, I believe BB fully expects that Sullivan will
be useful in his system.

I wouldn't be surprised if BB spent hours looking at film on Sullivan and saw
something he liked. Something that will be useful in the way the PATs do things.
I doubt Saints was the only team that BB could have traded with.
Look what BB and staff have done with Wilfork. NT was not Wilfork's bag yet
they have taught him how to be effective at that position.

This should be fun to see BB and staff work thier magic on Sullivan.
If they fail ... well you can't win em all.
But I bet they have expectations Sullivan will be productive in their
system.

 

[RayClay]

Good topic for discussion but I am not so sure BB has gone after than many problem players either. That being said, it is fair to say that BB has rejuvinated many an NFL carreer and generally gets more out of his players than other coaches can ( see Hamilton, Washington, Milloy, Patten, Phifer, etc .... Even our beloved Vrabel and Harrison owe part of their success to BB's coaching system and philosophy.

I can't name one player besides Greg Spires that went on to produce more for another team than they did for the patriots, and I believe this trend continues this year. Ty Law I guess can be argued as well, he did have 10 INT's last year.

Edit:

Oh yeah, if Sullivan makes it through TC I think he sticks as a backup and eventually fills in nicely when called upon.

He avoids them like the plague, that's the reason for the thread.

Just reminded that Pepper Johnson is the line coach. Could he be the motivator here? Certainly could be looking to make his bones so to speak.

By the way, those players you mentioned would be on the high character, self motivated end of the scale IMO.

We're talking high talent, crappy attitude here.

 

[Poll]

He avoids them like the plague, that's the reason for the thread.

Just reminded that Pepper Johnson is the line coach. Could he be the motivator here? Certainly could be looking to make his bones so to speak.

By the way, those players you mentioned would be on the high character, self motivated end of the scale IMO.

We're talking high talent, crappy attitude here.

I was thinking of Pepper Johnson as well. What kind of coach is he?

 

[Tyler Faith]

Does BB have a history of motivating lazy ass, self centered or otherwise less than ideal character players.?

Thoughts?

Oh I don't know...getting many average players to work together as a team that not only believes in their coach but themselves....holding the respect among the veterans and maintaining full control of egos, superstars, etc. Fighting through injury after injury, game planning and overcoming some of the worst situations any team could face in a season. Finding ways to win AGAIN even when facing a tough schedule.

I don't think that question is really necissary right now to be honest with ya!

 

[Haterproof]

Some people said Harrison was a troubled player at one point.I find this very hard to believe.Rodney is 1 of a few NFL players that I have a high level of respect for.What you see is what you get with Harrison.

 

[Patjew]

When I (sort of) met BB in April, someone asked him how he got players to buy into the team-first concept. He answered that it's all about getting the right players, because by the time they arrive it's usually too late to change them. Personally, I think BB's brilliance is in choosing/sticking with players who others identified as problematic, but that he sees as just having been in a bad situation. Dillon, Rodney, Law, etc.