ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady is #1

[FCB02062]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

According to you, Sanchez is better than brady, manning, brees, ryan and almost every qb in the league except rodgers and Roethlisberger? or did i get you wrong?

My whole entire point is that Brady has not been anything more than average in his last TEN or so playoff games, and that includes his two otherworldly performances against Jacksonville and one really good game against the NYJ. Other than that, I would argue that Brady has been nothing more than pedestrian, if that. The numbers and results do not lie. Sanchez, on the other hand, has really raised his game in the playoffs. And, the greater point is, the Pats WILL NOT win another Super Bowl, no less a playoff game, if Brady's play continues to DECLINE once the playoffs roll around...that's it. Never said Sanchez was better than Brady...
It's not a Sanchez or Brady argument; it's the FACT that Brady has sucked in the playoffs of late....but say that on this forum, and you're labeled an NYJ fan...

 

[patfanken]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Were you a big fan of all those Adams Division banners hanging in the old Garden, too?

Not a bad comeback FCB, but you STILL have the disadvantage of not having a lot of ammo to work with, aside from that SINGLE win in Foxboro. BTW- That SINGLE banner the Jets have must be PRETTY thread worn by now. After 42 years, it must have eroded to "shmattah" (dust rag for the Yiddish impaired)

If that is all you have, then its time to go back to the drawing board. The Jets wave has peaked, while the Pats NEW wave is starting to build. The Pats brought EVERYONE back and lost NO ONE from a 14-2 season, plus added 4 potential impact guys (Wright, Bodden, Haynesworth, and Chad). The youngest defense in the league (a surprising 8th in scoring D) will have another year to improve. And oh by the way, we also drafted a few guys. all of whom DON'T have to make significant contributions and the Pats WILL still be better. and if any should contribute, so much the better.

OTOH the Jets LOST several players, added an old slow big WR who hasn't played the game in 2 years, and are counting on 2 of their draft picks to make significant contributions just to get the DL back to where it was. The vast majority of your LBs are old and declining. You are counting on a completely untried guy like Westerman to provide a better pass rush. He might be that guy, but that's like a Pats fan COUNTING on Dane Fletcher being the primary pass rusher this year. It could happen, but you'd hammer me for COUNTING on him....and rightfully so. The Same holds true for McKnight. Jet fans are COUNTING on him to be the primary RB after Greene. That's like the Pats COUNTING on Taylor Price being a key WR in the passing game. He's another guy who had a good game in week 17. He MIGHT contribute in the passing game this year. We are all hoping he will. BUT Pats fans don't have to COUNT on it.

The Jets might be just as good as you hope this season FCB, but a LOT of things have to go right for that to happen, and what about next season when the big number from all those restructurings start to hit the cap. What then?

 

[FCB02062]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Not a bad comeback FCB, but you STILL have the disadvantage of not having a lot of ammo to work with, aside from that SINGLE win in Foxboro. BTW- That SINGLE banner the Jets have must be PRETTY thread worn by now. After 42 years, it must have eroded to "shmattah" (dust rag for the Yiddish impaired)

If that is all you have, then its time to go back to the drawing board. The Jets wave has peaked, while the Pats NEW wave is starting to build. The Pats brought EVERYONE back and lost NO ONE from a 14-2 season, plus added 4 potential impact guys (Wright, Bodden, Haynesworth, and Chad). The youngest defense in the league (a surprising 8th in scoring D) will have another year to improve. And oh by the way, we also drafted a few guys. all of whom DON'T have to make significant contributions and the Pats WILL still be better. and if any should contribute, so much the better.

OTOH the Jets LOST several players, added an old slow big WR who hasn't played the game in 2 years, and are counting on 2 of their draft picks to make significant contributions just to get the DL back to where it was. The vast majority of your LBs are old and declining. You are counting on a completely untried guy like Westerman to provide a better pass rush. He might be that guy, but that's like a Pats fan COUNTING on Dane Fletcher being the primary pass rusher this year. It could happen, but you'd hammer me for COUNTING on him....and rightfully so. The Same holds true for McKnight. Jet fans are COUNTING on him to be the primary RB after Greene. That's like the Pats COUNTING on Taylor Price being a key WR in the passing game. He's another guy who had a good game in week 17. He MIGHT contribute in the passing game this year. We are all hoping he will. BUT Pats fans don't have to COUNT on it.

The Jets might be just as good as you hope this season FCB, but a LOT of things have to go right for that to happen, and what about next season when the big number from all those restructurings start to hit the cap. What then?

I hope so, but my eyes see a quarterback (Brady) who's play has gone downhill come playoff time and the other guy (Sanchez), who's play has gotten better in the playoffs...as a matter of fact, you could probably say that for both teams as a whole the last few years...hopefully the Pats can change that this season...

 

[Sparetire]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

My whole entire point is that Brady has not been anything more than average in his last TEN or so playoff games, and that includes his two otherworldly performances against Jacksonville and one really good game against the NYJ. Other than that, I would argue that Brady has been nothing more than pedestrian, if that. The numbers and results do not lie. Sanchez, on the other hand, has really raised his game in the playoffs. And, the greater point is, the Pats WILL NOT win another Super Bowl, no less a playoff game, if Brady's play continues to DECLINE once the playoffs roll around...that's it. Never said Sanchez was better than Brady...
It's not a Sanchez or Brady argument; it's the FACT that Brady has sucked in the playoffs of late....but say that on this forum, and you're labeled an NYJ fan...

Nobody disagree that brady sucked in the last playoff games, he knows it as much as we do, the main thing is: last years regular season form make some ppl forget that the patriots D was in its diapers, Brady is not the one to win SB by himself like he is not the one to lose them by himself, Sanchez had a great group of players around him, brady had too, but not very matured.

Brady is not the playoff brady we got used to, but you canot compar a Sanchez one year, he need at least three more playoff games to be considerd better than brady in the playoffs, maybe it was a one-year thing? you cant know.

Oh, and one Alge Crumpler that dropped the ball in the endzone, a ball that would destroy the jets hopes, i promise you that.

 

[patfanken]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

My whole entire point is that Brady has not been anything more than average in his last TEN or so playoff games, ..

Oops FCB, now you have driven RIGHT over the edge of rationality. You have officially become a ADJF (another delusional Jet fan) . TEN playoff games!!!!!!!! Clearly now you are just making it up as you go. Brady had a horrible game against the Ravens. And while he wasn't great vs the Jets, he wasn't the only reason we lost the game. Just too many plays where the Pats didn't execute to mention (he didn't drop the pass in the endzone, he didn't drop the snap from C on the punt). And in 2007 superbowl, he simply late in the 4th quarter he simply lead his team from behind to score the go ahead TD. To the best of my knowledge, Brady wasn't on the field in those last 2 minutes when Samuel let a sure pick go thru his hands, when Richard Seymour let Manning get away, or when David Tyree made his one and done miraculous catch

Granted Mark Sanches in 4-2 in his last 6 playoff games, while Tom Brady is just 3-3 in his last 6. Or if you wish 0-3. There isn't a single GM, HC, or NFL "expert" who would take Mark Sanchez over Tom Brady if your life was on the line in a single game. NOT ONE. Not even Rex Ryan......Not even YOU.

 

[FCB02062]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Nobody disagree that brady sucked in the last playoff games, he knows it as much as we do, the main thing is: last years regular season form make some ppl forget that the patriots D was in its diapers, Brady is not to one to win SB by himself like he is not the one to lose them by himself, Sanchez had a great group of players around him, brady had too, but not very matured.

Brady is not the playoff brady we got used to, but you canot compar a Sanchez one year, he need at least three more playoff games to be considerd better than brady in the playoffs, maybe it was a one-year thing? you cant know.

Sanchez has six career playoff games (two seasons)...compare his last six with Brady's last six....it ain't pretty....I blame the Brazilian supermodel....

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Back to the thread premise, regardless of creating the "right" outcome any stat that relies on hidden from peer review subjective analysis of plays is useless. Too dependent on the high priests of film analysis away from our view.

The guy doing the analysis is simply doing salary preservation and justification as he says he was hired by espn as a "quant" a guy to do stats for them. Mission accomplished. Value minimal.

 

[FCB02062]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Oops FCB, now you have driven RIGHT over the edge of rationality. You have officially become a ADJF (another delusional Jet fan) . TEN playoff games!!!!!!!! Clearly now you are just making it up as you go. Brady had a horrible game against the Ravens. And while he wasn't great vs the Jets, he wasn't the only reason we lost the game. Just too many plays where the Pats didn't execute to mention (he didn't drop the pass in the endzone, he didn't drop the snap from C on the punt). And in 2007 superbowl, he simply late in the 4th quarter he simply lead his team from behind to score the go ahead TD. To the best of my knowledge, Brady wasn't on the field in those last 2 minutes when Samuel let a sure pick go thru his hands, when Richard Seymour let Manning get away, or when David Tyree made his one and done miraculous catch

Granted Mark Sanches in 4-2 in his last 6 playoff games, while Tom Brady is just 3-3 in his last 6. Or if you wish 0-3. There isn't a single GM, HC, or NFL "expert" who would take Mark Sanchez over Tom Brady if your life was on the line in a single game. NOT ONE. Not even Rex Ryan......Not even YOU.

John Lackey just loaded the bases with no outs...you probably think he's gonna get out of the inning unscathed, right?

 

[patfanken]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

I hope so, but my eyes see a quarterback (Brady) who's play has gone downhill come playoff time and the other guy (Sanchez), who's play has gotten better in the playoffs...as a matter of fact, you could probably say that for both teams as a whole the last few years...hopefully the Pats can change that this season...

My question is, how can you characterize a player who had just had the SINGLE greatest season at QB in the history of the game as on the downside, just because he had an average game in the playoffs and his team lost. Don't you understand how stupid that sounds? When you make off the wall comments like that then you lose all creditability. And that would be sad, because, unlike a some here, I enjoy when opposing fans come here and try and defend their team. I'm not looking for agreement to my side of the issue, just a modicum of rationality. AND my friend, this last post didn't have any.

 

[patfanken]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Sanchez has six career playoff games (two seasons)...compare his last six with Brady's last six....it ain't pretty....I blame the Brazilian supermodel....

Sorry PWP, just one more comment. FCB, I made several comments on how I see the Jets as of right now. Since you decided to deflect with baseball and Gisselle remarks, I guess you agree with me.

 

[FCB02062]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

My question is, how can you characterize a player who had just had the SINGLE greatest season at QB in the history of the game as on the downside, just because he had an average game in the playoffs and his team lost. Don't you understand how stupid that sounds? When you make off the wall comments like that then you lose all creditability. And that would be sad, because, unlike a some here, I enjoy when opposing fans come here and try and defend their team. I'm not looking for agreement to my side of the issue, just a modicum of rationality. AND my friend, this last post didn't have any.

Once again, I'm not defending "My team", which of course, is the patriots - oncer again, anyone who belittles Brady, Kraft, etc., is not a fan....sheesh....
I'm more fed up with the way they've played the last few playoff seasons, which is not good...

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

Once again, I'm not defending "My team", which of course, is the patriots - oncer again, anyone who belittles Brady, Kraft, etc., is not a fan....sheesh....
I'm more fed up with the way they've played the last few playoff seasons, which is not good...

That's a bit of an unfair characterization, IMO. They were a ridiculously bad pass interference call away from a win in the 2006 AFCCG, and would likely have been SB champions had they won that game. They certainly played fine in 2007, getting to within 3 minutes or so of an undefeated season. They didn't make the playoffs in 2008. They lost Welker during the last game of the season in 2009, and they just stunk up the joint in 2010.

Seems to me, you're really looking at 1-2 games where they haven't played well and blowing it up in to something more.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Re: ESPN is unveiling a new QB statistic to replace passer rating: naturally, Brady i

At the discussion with the Jet fan: Why bother. No matter what they tell you, to them, all that matters was that they beat us in the 2010 playoffs. And, god bless their sorry souls, its REALLY all they have to justify rooting for their team the past decade.

They have essentially waited over 40 years for the team they root for to become relevant to anyone else who doesn't live in metro NYC....and isn't a Giants fan. Well they beat the Pats in the game that mattered in 2010. They deserve to gloat....because the way Tanny has gone all in the last 3 years, who knows when the NEXT time the Jets will matter.

As of right now they won't even be as talented as they were last season, while IMHO the Bills, Dolphins, and Pats all got better.

As to the QBR : From what I can can gather this is all about is improving a flawed stat, with another “less” flawed stat. Which is even LESS relevant, since BOTH stats attempt to quantify an INDIVIDUAL player in a game where 23 other players significantly affect the success of the player you are trying to judge.

BOTTOM LINE – congrats, its better than the old stat. But really no stat can measure how an individual performs in a game so reliant how the other 23 players interact. And THAT’S what makes it such a fantastic game to watch.

BTW- one quick question. Does ESPN “own” the stat or can other networks use it

I agree. It just annoys me that anyone can conclude Sanchez is "Brady-esque" when he hasn't even been to the Super Bowl.

I believe ESPN does own the stat, especially since a lot of that stat is based on interpretation of specific events. Though even if they didn't, two networks could use the same formula but come up with different grades for the same play. Heck, two different ESPN employees could grade it differently. Imagine if a pass goes incomplete, but one guy says it was a drop from the WR while the other says it was a poor throw from the QB.

It's an extremely interpretative stat in many ways, and I'm not really a huge fan of it. At the same time, looking at the "results," it's hard to argue with it either. I mean the seasons at the top seem to be the best seasons. The bottom ones deserve to be at the bottom. But there's no way a fan could calculate what that stat is.