2014 Roster - Offseason needs

[mayoclinic]

Grand Master Mayo.

Can't you just see BB in his hoodie with long baggy shorts and a lot of gaudy gold jewelry, sort of a Vanilla Ice look:

If he wanted to piss them off (or put them to sleep), he'd do it in sonnet form:

"The way in which a Super Bowl is won
Requires extraordinary effort from us all.
To conquer you must cover and must run,
And make key plays on both sides of the ball.

Aqib, your play has been extraordinary,
Its clear that you're committed and determined.
You've energized our entire secondary
And played as well as that jerk Richard Sherman.

LG, I tought you well to drop your pads
And now you run with power and with drama.
The 'sults have been much more than just a fad,
We're converts to the truth of Blount Force Trauma.

Among our team you surely have a place,
So long it works within our scant cap space."

I don't think that one would work as well.

 

[Ivan]

Too many long words in there for Blount and Talib.

I think it will be more like--We like you, we want you here, go see what you can get and get back to us...................

Talib, Blount, and Edelman will all have to sacrifice money to stay in New England, whether they are willing to or not will ultimately be the question. I expect the Jets to go hard after Blount.



Whatever happens this season has definitely established the Patriots as the team to go to if you need to reinvent your career, and there are going to be a good many NFL players who watched what happened for those players and are looking for the same kind of success who want to come here and see what they can do.

 

[Ivan]

Can't you just see BB in his hoodie with long baggy shorts and a lot of gaudy gold jewelry, sort of a Vanilla Ice look:

Actually no, I can't imagine Belichick looking like a poser.

 

[mayoclinic]

It seems pretty clear to me from today that we have some glaring needs:

1. DL. I've said for a while that Chandler Jones and Ninkovich played too many snaps this season, I think it showed in terms of their explosiveness and ability to get to Manning. We need to have pass rushers that we can bring in waves to keep people fresh. Jamie Collins was by far our most explosive and effective pass rusher in the post season, partly because of his athleticism, partly because he was fresh. The defensive tackle position needs to be sorted out. Siliga and Chris Jones appear to be keepers, and Armstead could still contribute, but the long term starters are not obvious.

2. OL. The interior OL needs an upgrade, particularly at center. Dan Connolly was not much better than average at RG, if that.

3. TE. Obviously.

Our receivers actually did a decent job of stretching the field, but Brady didn't connect with them. We need a bit more in this area, too.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Well, the main board has gone on ridiculous overreaction mode over today's defeat, so I'm coming here for refuge. From my perspective, I don't think we saw anything today that we didn't already know. The interior of the OL needs to be upgraded. We have no receiving option at TE without Gronk. Dobson is promising, but we need more big receiving options to complement the smurfs. Despite the sacks this year, the DL is inconsistent and can be pushed around by the best OL. The secondary can get crippled against big receivers when Talib goes down.

So does the AFCCG loss change any of my thoughts for the offseason? Not really -- because the issues were the same as the above, so in fact I'm doubling down. Thinking:
- resign Talib, Edelman, and Blount if possible
- extend / redo Wilfork's deal, restructure Mankins, extend Gostkowski, extend McCourty to gain about 11m in cap space.
- cut Sopoaga and Adrian Wilson
- don't resign Wendell and Spikes unless it's really cheap
- sign a receiving mid tier TE like Chandler or Pettigrew

From there, would love the Mallett to Houston for 33 deal. Hopefully Cassel or Orton would be cut and one could sign for cheap as a veteran backup. Could then do something like:
- Trent Murphy in 1st
- Travis Swanson with 33.
- Troy Nicklas with other 2nd.
- Daquan Jones in 3rd.
- Billy Turner in 4th.
- with five 6th and 7th round picks potentially, another TE, DE, RB, big project WR or something like that.

Doesn't solve corner problem, but maybe with a better DL our DBs can have a fighting chance.

Bring Connelly, Kelly, and Gregory to camp and see how they respond and the rookies respond. Cut/restructure/keep as needed based on camp.

The players listed are simply based on everyone else's analysis here, plus my thoughts on need. I don't really care who it is specifically that is picked -- just as long as they get it right. If this works, maybe then Pats can get back to this game next year and this time, maybe win it.

On that note, I want to thank everyone for their hard work on this draft forum. The scouting reports are really appreciated by someone like me that doesn't have that type of an eye. And the atmosphere here is phenomenal and refreshing for the internet.

 

[manxman2601]

I'm going to be boring on this but TE, TE, TE

Adding deep threats for Brady isn't going to help because that's just playing to his biggest weakness. Big targets for Brady in the middle of the field which will allow Vereen, Amendola, Edelman to stretch the field horizontally. Let's play to Brady's strengths, not his weaknesses.

 

[mayoclinic]

I'm going to be boring on this but TE, TE, TE

Adding deep threats for Brady isn't going to help because that's just playing to his biggest weakness. Big targets for Brady in the middle of the field which will allow Vereen, Amendola, Edelman to stretch the field horizontally. Let's play to Brady's strengths, not his weaknesses.

That's why I didn't list WR among my priorities. As I mentioned, we got guys open, but Brady didn't hit them. He's not very accurate on the deep ball.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

That's why I didn't list WR among my priorities. As I mentioned, we got guys open, but Brady didn't hit them. He's not very accurate on the deep ball.

In general, I agree. In this specific case, in Brady's defense, i think he just didn't have the right feel for the mile high air. Those are exactly the types of throws which sail due to the thinness of the air. Both the Edelman and Collie overthrows are likely completions in Foxboro.

But again, agree in general -- he is weakest on those throws in general.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Sup Mayo? I don't know if my eyes are deceiving me or if Im just overreacting to today but both McCourty and Gregory play like they don't trust their eyes/keys, are slow/tentative in run support and are most likely a big part of some of the miscommunications/conversions on 3rd and long. Its not even like its just that we aren't getting to the QB fast enough but that guys are winning and getting open/separation immediately and we usually see one of the safeties arriving a second after the ball does.

Offensively, obviously TE, obviously talent/competition at Center and RG but I'd also love a guy on the outside who can come in and contribute immediately. I think a guy like Odell Beckham Jr. can walk in and solve the KR problem as well as become sort of what Cordarelle Paterson started to do late in the year offensively. Get the ball in his hands in creative ways early why he becomes accustomed to running routes against NFL DB's. Would love a WR corps of Dobson, Edleman, Dola, Thompkins, Boyce, and Beckham Jr. Maybe Mark Harrison comes and earns a spot?

I mean just watching Seattle, they don't have great receivers but they have big bodies who understand how to use them and they attack the ball. On defense they play decisively, swarming/attacking defense and like you mentioned, they have a group of about 5 guys who can get after the QB and beat their man off the snap. Don't think anybody is better at just rushing 4.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Offensively, obviously TE, obviously talent/competition at Center and RG but I'd also love a guy on the outside who can come in and contribute immediately. . . . Would love a WR corps of Dobson, Edleman, Dola, Thompkins, Boyce, and Beckham Jr. Maybe Mark Harrison comes and earns a spot?

The big issue here is that you can't run lots of 2-TE sets and have enough snaps for WRs to justify 6 WRs + Slater.

 

[PattieswinSB]

Even though we had 48 sacks this year, I felt like our pass rush was overrated. We padded our stats vs teams like the Dokphins. We are in desperate need of some pass rush.

 

[ZoisKing]

I think we should evolve from the need of a WR, and just deploy a 3 tight end set all the time. It emphasizes Brady's abilities the most, and would create constant mismatches.

Draft ASJ and Niklas, then spend the rest of the picks on DL-Donald, Easley, Johnson, etc.

 

[ZoisKing]

Even though we had 48 sacks this year, I felt like our pass rush was overrated. We padded our stats vs teams like the Dokphins. We are in desperate need of some pass rush.

Interior pass rush most definitely. Nothing like seeing a couple guys coming up the middle straight at you. We didn't have that this year.

 

[varjao]

I think I'll stick to this thread until things settle down, too much posts, too much angry on the Pats talk forum.

Seriously, I would not mind at all if BB went all offense on the next draft, but I know it won't happen.

One thing came to my mind during the game, and that maybe deserves a thread to develop, but it's a long off season, so far I will just put this here for us to reflect.

We recently had the best offense on the league, and the worst defense. We got one drop away from winning the big one. And even the year before, that disaster against the Jets, it was an unusual game, that team was the best in the playoffs and unfortunatelly we came up short. What I'm trying to say is that we had better chances to win the SB with a good offense than now fixing the defense and giving Brady no weapons. The same applies to last year against Baltimore.

OK, offense wins games, defense wins championships.

I think Denver is changing this old saying. If your best player is an offensive player, a QB, you have to maximize your chances with you best asset. Ok those players came before Manning, this offense is not made by design for Manning, but they can control their destiny better with a powerful offense than they would with a great defense and no receiver at all. Manning can't play without playmakers. And I think Brady can't anymore too.

Brady already did some miracles with scrubs playing receiver, but that's not going to work in today's NFL anymore. They need to give him great playmakers and obviously he will keep doing great plays with normal players but you can't go to playoffs with JAGs and expect anything better than today's outcome.

I know the defense in 2010/2011 was disgusting bu that's not because they focused on offense, it was a rebuilding process and didn't work with those players, but the defense is coming together, last year, this year...maybe 2 or 3 players and they are Ok, but with Brady playing QB, you've got to maximize your chances with your best weapon. I think Brady is so good that BB thought many times that Brady's skills would compensate for not having playmakers on offense, but you know what, it's been 10 years already...

I look for the future and I can see a great regular season team again going to the playoffs and they eventually can strike the big one but as I said on the game thread today, I'm accepting the fact that maybe the GOAT will retire with his only 3 rings and we'll need to deal with the likes of Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck, even Kaep going for 4+ rings.

This team needs big changes , it's not like a 49ers, SB ready, despite their QB choking big time like today. They have all pieces in place, Seahawks too, Broncos have the best offense on football. There are other teams a good draft away from going deep on the playoffs. I look for the Patriots and I see a team with a great coach and a great QB, some top players like Mankins, Gostokowski, Chandler Jones, and and....a lot of question marks.

This team is rebuilding for so long and it's still not ready, I know Hernandez gate had a tremendous negative effect on this season, a lot of decisions was taken based on him being a very important part of this offense, including they moving on from Welker, but you know, that happened way before the season starts. There are financial aspects, but in terms of playing time, we played without TE's this season, except for the 5 or 6 games Gronk played. And it's clear that Brady's best game is on the middle, short throws.

This team needs a HUGE rebuilding on every area, offense, defense, ST's are Ok, but ST's win one game in a season (not talking about kicker), what matters is offense and defense. There are a lot of people saying that this defense is nothing without Talib, I will say this, I don't think Talib would make much of a difference today. Without pressure on the QB it's like 2010 or 2011 when every QB on this league was Dan Marino against us. This defense needs improvement on CB, Safety, DE and DT. This offense needs improvement on WR, TE, OL and RB.

We have not much picks for the next draft nor money for FA, we are *****ED man.

 

[TriplecHamp]

The big issue here is that you can't run lots of 2-TE sets and have enough snaps for WRs to justify 6 WRs + Slater.

They would never carry nor would I expect all of those players to be on the gameday roster. Depending on the gameplan I think 5 would be though. Today we carried Slater, Dobson, Amendola, Collie, Edelman. Im essentially dropping Collie and saying that Slater should never see the field on offense. I think its important going foreword for this team to stop putting so many eggs in one basket. At this point I don't think we should run lots of any single set. I think its a bad idea to run with a rookie TE and Gronk and expect lots of 2-TE's sets. Having 9/46 players be WR's and TE's especially with a player like Beckham playing on st.

 

[mayoclinic]

I think I'll stick to this thread until things settle down, too much posts, too much angry on the Pats talk forum.

This team needs big changes , it's not like a 49ers, SB ready, despite their QB choking big time like today. They have all pieces in place, Seahawks too, Broncos have the best offense on football. There are other teams a good draft away from going deep on the playoffs. I look for the Patriots and I see a team with a great coach and a great QB, some top players like Mankins, Gostokowski, Chandler Jones, and and....a lot of question marks.

This team is rebuilding for so long and it's still not ready. ... This team needs a HUGE rebuilding on every area, offense, defense, ST's are Ok, but ST's win one game in a season (not talking about kicker), what matters is offense and defense. There are a lot of people saying that this defense is nothing without Talib, I will say this, I don't think Talib would make much of a difference today. Without pressure on the QB it's like 2010 or 2011 when every QB on this league was Dan Marino against us. This defense needs improvement on CB, Safety, DE and DT. This offense needs improvement on WR, TE, OL and RB.

We have not much picks for the next draft nor money for FA, we are *****ED man.

No offense, but this sounds like it belongs in the main forum.

Sure there are needs, and there's work to be done. But we have a better talent base, younger team, and are in better shape than almost any team in the NFL.

Seattle was 7-9 2 years ago. Denver had the #2 pick in the draft in 2011. Teams can plug holes fast if they go about it smartly, and we're generally one of the smarter teams out there. No need to panic or despair.

 

[patsderoer]

I'm going to be boring on this but TE, TE, TE

Adding deep threats for Brady isn't going to help because that's just playing to his biggest weakness. Big targets for Brady in the middle of the field which will allow Vereen, Amendola, Edelman to stretch the field horizontally. Let's play to Brady's strengths, not his weaknesses.

This is obvious. TE is the biggest need. Need a proven vet like Chandler and a draft pick. Too bad that they got rid of Ballard and Sudfeld too early.

 

[varjao]

Yeah I was going to finish talking about draft which is the subject here but I forgot, sorry for the rant but it was a line of thought to develop that things may change a lot in terms of draft and cap space.

After today's game, I think we definitely need to keep Edelman. I don't know if you guys have seen his interview crying in the locker room. This dude is really a true Patriot and didn't choke today, made all the catches he was able to do. I don't think he is easy replaceable like some think. He's a essential part in our system.

Also, I love Talib, but we can't have all our hopes on defense in a player with his issues to stay healthy. Ok he took a cheap shot today, but he's dealing with injuries since week 6. December/January are usually cold and if he has a bone issue, we will have to deal with these things every year, Gronk's absence is enough. I think he stays if he gives a big discount. If he goes for money, I don't think BB should cover the market. The same goes for Blount.

If BB clear some cap space with Talib, Wendell, Hooman and others, reestructure some contracts, then maybe TE should be addressed via FA.

This way, CB would be a lock in 1st or 2nd round, or safety.

WR is also a huge need. Sorry but I only trust Dobson to play on the outside. Thompkins and the guys in PS and IR are long shots.

RB's we probably will have another season of Ridley/Vereen, maybe Blount if they get a deal, I don't think the market will throw big money on him.

1st and 2nd - WR/ DE / CB is a possibility if Talib doesn't stay,
3rd - DT/DE
4th - Oline

 

[varjao]

Even though we had 48 sacks this year, I felt like our pass rush was overrated. We padded our stats vs teams like the Dokphins. We are in desperate need of some pass rush.

This.

That first Dolphins game, the game was over and Jones and Vellano got free tickets to sack Tannehill.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

1st and 2nd - WR/ DE / CB is a possibility if Talib doesn't stay,
3rd - DT/DE
4th - Oline

I would like to see the Pats address TE in the first three rounds.