Enough with the homerism - I'm P.O.'d

[sieglo]

A more basic question, how do you tape a signal caller from behind? Or how do you know no one is taping from the spotters box or other vantage point??

I'm hoping that NFL officials load up the tape and its gay porn. Another big joke by BB on stupid NFL rules.

 

[PatsDeb]

it really makes us look bad, and even silly. from an image standpoint in the league, this is a PR blunder. there is no arguing that.

it also appears to be more of an antagonistic move than productive one, to film like that. BB telling the Mangenius or whomever that he is poking him with a sharp stick. i think that is where some ppl are coming from, when they say this whole thing is un-necessary.

i bet Bob Kraft is having a few words w BB about all of this, no doubt. Kraft didnt invest gizillions and a decade to build the best professional team image in football to have it tarnished by BB's mind games.

I agree with this post. I am also wondering how long the Pats have been doing this. If they did it while Mangini was here, then he knew about the practice and set BB up in a big way to look like a fool and tarnish his reputation. I hold out hope of 2 things - 1) there is nothing really bad on the tape; 2) the other teams actually do this a lot and therefore the league will be reluctant to impose any stiff punishment and make an example of the Pats. Has anyone figured out at what point in the game the camera was confiscated?

I also wonder why the Pats would continue to use a guy that was supposedly stopped at Green Bay doing the same thing. I cannot believe they are that dumb again. This leads me back to the thought that this is a common practice (despite the rules) and maybe BB is shocked such a big deal is being made of this.

In any event, I agree with the starter of this thread that this has ruined my enjoyment of a great win and start to the season.

 

[MDD]

Believe me, on every other team's message board I belong to, I'm posting all of the sarcastic responses that are suitable for a ridiculous story such as this one. But the more of a non-issue this is, the more stupid of a move it is, in my opinion.

 

[Grizzafted]

So tell us Mr. Football....is videotaping the signal caller on another team legal in the NFL?

Is it legal to poke your thumb into someone's eyeball or grab their crotch in a pile? Is it legal to teach your offensive linemen to cut block? Yeah it's stupid, but this is the NFL.

I'm reacting to what is inevitably going to be a major overreaction and bring all the Belichick haters out of the woodwork. So what, our coach is a prick. Is everybody supposed to bend over backwards for the sports media? You're not the fourth estate, pals. This aint watergate. I am hoping that there are people who make it understood that this has minimal impact on the game.

A LOT of important questions haven't been answered at ALL yet. This is going to be a bumpy ride, though, and I just hope the coaching staff keeps players focused on Sunday. Maybe it's a good motivational tool for them to go out and dominate, show people who they are.

 

[PatsDeb]

When was the camera confiscated? After the first series? After the first half?

 

[Pats726]

Question, what is the advantage of filming a game from behind a bench?? The signal callers are facing the field and the Patriots?? It would make more sense to film them from either behind the pats bench facing the Jets.

unfortunately NO ONE is explaining the logistics of this at all...of HOW even if that was dione was ANY advantage...explain IF you know becuase I do not..and I hear all kinds of things repeated without any logic..or of anything that even remotely states HOW The team got any advantage... The logistics of how this took place seem like Rube Goldberg if that...it doesn't add up. If teh Patriot's cheated state EXACTLY how..explain the details...

 

[RoughingthePasser]

A lot of people are really showing how little they understand the game of football here, and it's pissing me off, big time.

This is a non story. Do you know how many blitz packages an NFL team uses in a game? If the Jets, or any other professional football team, has so few blitzes that the hand signals can easily be decoded like that, they deserve to have them stolen. This is ridiculous, and its effect on the field is minimal.

I agree.

Shame on the crooked "MEDIA" for pouncing on this.

This means ZERO.

What a circus....the hatred for the New England Patriots grows.

Think this would ever happen to the Colts or that some of their Defensive players would get teated for juicing????
Think about it!

I hate the media
I hate "The Man" too.

 

[Pats726]

I agree with this post. I am also wondering how long the Pats have been doing this. If they did it while Mangini was here, then he knew about the practice and set BB up in a big way to look like a fool and tarnish his reputation. I hold out hope of 2 things - 1) there is nothing really bad on the tape; 2) the other teams actually do this a lot and therefore the league will be reluctant to impose any stiff punishment and make an example of the Pats. Has anyone figured out at what point in the game the camera was confiscated?

I also wonder why the Pats would continue to use a guy that was supposedly stopped at Green Bay doing the same thing. I cannot believe they are that dumb again. This leads me back to the thought that this is a common practice (despite the rules) and maybe BB is shocked such a big deal is being

NO ONE has yet to explain even IF there is something on teh tape HOW that in anyway is an advantage. So some guy has what are supposed signals on tape..and so what??? Somehow this picture goes by telepathy to who?? when?? And how does THAt vecome any advantage?? Please..is it some magic camera that does MORE than anyone thinks?? Unless more details are explained..this is just a mangina Red Herring..full of sour grapes..

 

[upstater1]

Whatever guys. This isn't a court of law.

Hey, if he was just taking pictures of lovely scenic New Jersey I'll come back here and call myself an idiot ok?

You should just call yourself an idiot now. Why? Because you're an idiot.

 

[Mack Herron]

If the Patriots broke the rules and got caught, as it appears, then BB was stupid and deserves whatever punishment he gets. Unfortunately, what is already a PR blunder affects innocent people too, including players and fans. I'm sure some of the players are as disappointed in the organization as I am. Even if the infraction was trivial, unimportant, and common, attempts to defend it wreak of homerism and are pathetic. The image of the organization, and guys like Vrabel and Bruschi, has been tarnished by Harrison, and now again by BB. They are a great team, but the joy of winning has been diminished by the new meaning of "the Patriot way".

 

[DarrylS]

If the Patriots broke the rules and got caught, as it appears, then BB was stupid and deserves whatever punishment he gets. Unfortunately, what is already a PR blunder affects innocent people too, including players and fans. I'm sure some of the players are as disappointed in the organization as I am. Even if the infraction was trivial, unimportant, and common, attempts to defend it wreak of homerism and are pathetic. The image of the organization, and guys like Vrabel and Bruschi, has been tarnished by Harrison, and now again by BB. They are a great team, but the joy of winning has been diminished by the new meaning of "the Patriot way".

Not sure things are all that bad, a bump in the road, but not even sure it is an infraction yet.. time will tell..

 

[mdhprime]

A lot of people here seem to be missing the point and the big picture in a big way. All 32 teams in this league do something like this in their own way. Whether it is video recording from the sideline, video recording from the stands, dedicating a staff member to do nothing but watch and take note of the other teams signals, etc. It is all a variation on a theme and to my knowledge it is all illegal. It has also been going on for a long, long time. It seems to me that there are certain forces in positions within the league (competition committee comes to mind) that have attempted to legislate their way to success against the Patriots. The Ty Law rule emphasis is one of the most famous. Polian was so livid that his receivers got manhandled that the 5 yard contact rule got blown out of proportion. Now we have a case where the Patriots may have gotten caught doing soemthing against the rules. If the tape proves something, fine they should be punished, but with the knowledge that every other team needs to be scrutinized just as much as New England. I do not think the league is ready to do that. My prediction is the Patriots may get a slap (a draft picking being an extreme slap, a fine being a nominal one) but the bigger implication will be that all non press cameras will be banned from the sidelines, whether they belong to coaches, players, staff, guests, officials, etc. It is the most logical thing to do if the league is really serious about limiting sign stealing.

 

[RESPECT]

If that's the case then you ARE ONE..........

Of all the fans that come on here weekly {aside from perhaps Jets fans}, there are no more disrespectful, arrogant A-holes fans out there then Charger fans.

good one I'm came to your site to talk football and get some insight on Boston because i'm lucky enough to be going to the game! I actually respect your team both on paper and the field!

Fact of the matter is you spanked the Jets!!!! You clearly were the far more talented, well prepared team. BUT......... this accustaion, and yes that's all it is, does cast a shadow on your performance, why? Look at shawn Merriman he started the 06' season at Oakland with like 3 sack or somethin.... Then came the posotive steroid test and then everyone questioned his first couple performances and said it was because of the steroids.

So i'm not saying it is true what happened, but i'm taking it for what it is and that is an accusation not proof of guilt. Now if they are found to be guilty of this, then yes, you all should prepare for some crap from the league, and Jets fans! But what do i know i'm just an A-hole Charger Fan....Good Luck Sunday

 

[mdhprime]

good one I'm came to your site to talk football and get some insight on Boston because i'm lucky enough to be going to the game! I actually respect your team both on paper and the field!

Fact of the matter is you spanked the Jets!!!! You clearly were the far more talented, well prepared team. BUT......... this accustaion, and yes that's all it is, does cast a shadow on your performance, why? Look at shawn Merriman he started the 06' season at Oakland with like 3 sack or somethin.... Then came the posotive steroid test and then everyone questioned his first couple performances and said it was because of the steroids.

So i'm not saying it is true what happened, but i'm taking it for what it is and that is an accusation not proof of guilt. Now if they are found to be guilty of this, then yes, you all should prepare for some crap from the league, and Jets fans! But what do i know i'm just an A-hole Charger Fan....Good Luck Sunday

If you want to talk football, there are a lot of people here who are more than happy to do that, regardless of what team you support. What is your take on the game this coming Sunday?

 

[MassPats38]

First time caller, long time listener. Usually I am happy to read the exchanges here, but this cheating issue has driven me sufficiently batty to cause me to post a reply.

My initial question in response to those who have decided this case against the Pats is as follows: is it illegal to film the game from a different vantage than the coach sees (specifically the other side of the field)? If the rule does not permit this (and from what I have read i the league statement appears to be the case), then the Patriots violated a rule on videotaping. That would appear to be a fairly minor infraction as it does not represent a genuine competitive advantage (other than more raw data to analyze on your own team). At present, it is not apparent whether it is customary to violate these rule by virtue of agreements among competing teams.

If the Pats actually put a video camera on the field, I will join the host of others who have stated such an act would reflect blatant stupidity, which has not been the norm for New England. If we can take pictures of objects the size of license plates from space, I suspect the taping of signals could be done in a covert manner given the resources of an NFL team.

This is not the Vick case where an indictment (requiring probable cause of criminal infractions) and witnesses support a story and therefore make it credible. I have only read the account of a garbage journalist (Tomase and the useless Herald) to support the claim, and a piling on of uninvestigated/unsubstantiated allegations (if so egregious, why weren't these allegations forwarded to the league, or maybe they were). Recent history (the New York Daily article ascribing a quote to Belichick he never made, reflecting an inability to read an SI article before publishing "news") suggests not every published story has sound footing in fact.

Let the league do its investigation, and if sanctions follow then you can be disgusted. I suspect few of the so-called journalists demonizing the Patriots at this point will recant and admit they are hacks. The good journalists are printing exactly what this story is at this point, a complaint with the league.

 

[spacecrime]

Monday morning I must have read every AP story, every local newspaper, every everything about that Jets win, how smart my team played, how smart we were for getting Moss. I was really really proud to be a Patriots fan.

This latest trumped up scandal is petty, it's jealosy on the Jets' part, and on the part of influential insiders like Casserly who have always hated the Pats. We know this.

However, it doesn't change the fact that Belichick was stupid, and because of his stupidity, instead of looking forward to this game, I have to "look forward to" a week of "I told you so's" by the Chargers, and a week of our media enemies commiserating with them. Hey, after all, how DARE we beat that team full of pro-bowlers last year? It MUST be because we CHAEATED.

Thanks for taking away my enjoyment Bill. How someone so smart can be such an idiot is beyond me. Get yourself some psychological help and stop being an a--hole. Just STOP it.

Knight and Parcells grew up (relatively speaking), it's time that you did as well, idiot.

You have no friggin' idea what happened. No one can take away your enjoyment but you yourself. If you want to go beserk and get all lathered up, go for it. Who gives a crap what Charger fans think?

BB didn't take away your enjoyment. You fair-weather fans wouldn't even be fans if it weren't for him turning the franchise around. Do Patriots Nation a favor and buy some Gints jerseys.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Monday morning I must have read every AP story, every local newspaper, every everything about that Jets win, how smart my team played, how smart we were for getting Moss. I was really really proud to be a Patriots fan.

This latest trumped up scandal is petty, it's jealosy on the Jets' part, and on the part of influential insiders like Casserly who have always hated the Pats. We know this.

However, it doesn't change the fact that Belichick was stupid, and because of his stupidity, instead of looking forward to this game, I have to "look forward to" a week of "I told you so's" by the Chargers, and a week of our media enemies commiserating with them. Hey, after all, how DARE we beat that team full of pro-bowlers last year? It MUST be because we CHAEATED.

Thanks for taking away my enjoyment Bill. How someone so smart can be such an idiot is beyond me. Get yourself some psychological help and stop being an a--hole. Just STOP it.

Knight and Parcells grew up (relatively speaking), it's time that you did as well, idiot.

Let the facts come out and the investigation proceed... but if its true, I pretty much share your anger and outrage...

Other teams might have reason to be mad, but its we as Patriots fans that will be most hurt by this if its true

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Monday morning I must have read every AP story, every local newspaper, every everything about that Jets win, how smart my team played, how smart we were for getting Moss. I was really really proud to be a Patriots fan.

This latest trumped up scandal is petty, it's jealosy on the Jets' part, and on the part of influential insiders like Casserly who have always hated the Pats. We know this.

However, it doesn't change the fact that Belichick was stupid, and because of his stupidity, instead of looking forward to this game, I have to "look forward to" a week of "I told you so's" by the Chargers, and a week of our media enemies commiserating with them. Hey, after all, how DARE we beat that team full of pro-bowlers last year? It MUST be because we CHAEATED.

Thanks for taking away my enjoyment Bill. How someone so smart can be such an idiot is beyond me. Get yourself some psychological help and stop being an a--hole. Just STOP it.

Knight and Parcells grew up (relatively speaking), it's time that you did as well, idiot.

Wahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh...

Go find another dynasty to root for.

 

[mdhprime]

Let the facts come out and the investigation proceed... but if its true, I pretty much share your anger and outrage...

Other teams might have reason to be mad, but its we as Patriots fans that will be most hurt by this if its true

This is a tempest in a tea pot. The league knows everyone does this or something like it and if the Patriots receive a punishment it will most likely be nominal to minor and used to send a message to the rest of the league to stop any practice of stealing signs. The most effective measure would be to ban any camera from a non-press person on the field.

BTW...how in the world does this hurt fans???

 

[Displaced - Fan]

1. There is a rule that taking steroids is not OK, and those who still do and get caught pay the price. There's a rule that you can't videotape the other team's signal callers. We got caught, we gotta pay the price. It doesn't matter that all teams do it as well - just as it doesn't matter that probably a vast, vast majority of NFL players use illegal substances. What matters is quite simple: there's a rule, we know about it, and we still broke it. What matters now moving forward is the sort of punishment - if any - that will be levied against us for it. Whatever it is, we'll have to take it with humility. We did the crime, we'll do the time.

3. In business, we call it a risk assessment. We look at what we can gain from an action, what our losses can be resulting from said action, and the odds of those losses occurring. Then we make a decision based on this information. Note that ethics don't really enter into focus all that much in that process. The Pats saw some kind of advantage, I am sure they're smart enough to have done their own risk assessment and decided to go with it. Too bad ethics didn't weigh a little more in the process, and for that, as a Pats fan, I am disappointed.

I agree with you here, this gets done all the time. The one thing I'd argue at this point is that the Pats are "under" investigation. They haven't been "charged" with anything yet. The timing is certainly poor coming after the whole HGH instance with Rodney. :bricks: