My Blueprint for the Defense

[mayoclinic]

And likewise it was a shrewd move by Aqib Talib to turn down the long term overtures the Patriots made towards him last year. He recognized it was a bad year to be a FA cornerback and bet on himself. Then played the best football of his career by a country mile in weeks 1-5.

Good point. We don't know what the Pats offered in terms of a long term deal last year. Obviously, it wasn't enough. And I have no doubt that if BB hadn't traded for Talib, he wouldn't be getting that ridiculous contract. Talib was a great trade for the Pats, but the Pats also re-invigorated Talib's career, which was pretty moribund 18 months ago.

 

[Get it shawtaay]

Since discussing things on the main board intelligently is a non starter.

Matt Shaughnessy...... ehh. Edge setting force? Not sure how excited I can get about that. Would put Ninkovich on the bench early downs, unless we intend to kick Jones inside more often.

I just don't see much growth potential in the guy. Solid player but no more.

 

[mayoclinic]

Since discussing things on the main board intelligently is a non starter.

Matt Shaughnessy...... ehh. Edge setting force? Not sure how excited I can get about that. Would put Ninkovich on the bench early downs, unless we intend to kick Jones inside more often.

I just don't see much growth potential in the guy. Solid player but no more.

I prefer Mike Neal, who I think has more explosiveness.

 

[everlong]

So given Talib's exit I spent my morning watching some different games I hadn't seen of the top corners. I came away downgrading Dennard and Gilbert and upgrading Fuller and Phillip Gaines. Everybody else didn't make a big enough impression one way or the other for me to change my feelings. I don't see how Fuller is making it out of the first round and would be happy with him at 29. I do not think Gaines makes it to 62. If Fuller is gone at 29 or somebody completely unexpected and too good to be true is there at 29 like Donald or Ebron then I think we would need to trade up in the second to get him. I think Fuller and Gaines have both the size and athletic ability to be special.

Funny but after I watched them my take was Fuller was more explosive than I remembered and Gaines more fluid. I looked at their combine numbers after and they backed that up.

 

[mayoclinic]

So given Talib's exit I spent my morning watching some different games I hadn't seen of the top corners. I came away downgrading Dennard and Gilbert and upgrading Fuller and Phillip Gaines. Everybody else didn't make a big enough impression one way or the other for me to change my feelings. I don't see how Fuller is making it out of the first round and would be happy with him at 29. I do not think Gaines makes it to 62. If Fuller is gone at 29 or somebody completely unexpected and too good to be true is there at 29 like Donald or Ebron then I think we would need to trade up in the second to get him. I think Fuller and Gaines have both the size and athletic ability to be special.

Funny but after I watched them my take was Fuller was more explosive than I remembered and Gaines more fluid. I looked at their combine numbers after and they backed that up.

With all the "Revis to the Pats" speculation, here's a physical comparison, FWIW:

- Darrelle Revis: 5' 11 1/2" 204#; 4.38 40, 4.08 SS, 6.58 3C; 38" VJ, 10'5" BJ

- Phillip Gaines: 6' 0 3/8" 193#; 4.38 40, 4.04 SS, 6.62 3C; 36.5" VJ, 10'2" BJ

 

[everlong]

With all the "Revis to the Pats" speculation, here's a physical comparison, FWIW:

- Darrelle Revis: 5' 11 1/2" 204#; 4.38 40, 4.08 SS, 6.58 3C; 38" VJ, 10'5" BJ

- Phillip Gaines: 6' 0 3/8" 193#; 4.38 40, 4.04 SS, 6.62 3C; 36.5" VJ, 10'2" BJ

I can see Bill taking him in the mid second and the general board erupting with WTF? Another no-name that could have been had in the 5th round......and the draft forum will be doing cartwheels, well those of us who are athletic enough to do one.

 

[BobDigital]

My Defense right now.


DE - 5 - Jones Nink Peppers(FA) Aaron Lynch(Draft) ???? (someone else)
DT - 5 - Kelley Aaron Donald(Draft) Hatcher(FA) Jones Siliga
LB: - 5 -Mayo Collins Hightower Woodyard(FA) Fletcher
CB: - 5 - Revis(FA) Dennard Ryan Arrington Keith McGill(Draft)
S - 4 - McCourty Major Wright(FA), Harmon Ebner

I am not gonna tell you how I would make this happen. Just MAKE IT HAPPEN.

We are getting BTFO by Denver in free agency and need to respond.

 

[mayoclinic]

My Defense right now.


DE - 5 - Jones Nink Peppers(FA) Aaron Lynch(Draft) ???? (someone else)
DT - 5 - Kelley Aaron Donald(Draft) Hatcher(FA) Jones Siliga
LB: - 5 -Mayo Collins Hightower Woodyard(FA) Fletcher
CB: - 5 - Revis(FA) Dennard Ryan Arrington Keith McGill(Draft)
S - 4 - McCourty Major Wright(FA), Harmon Ebner

I am not gonna tell you how I would make this happen. Just MAKE IT HAPPEN.

We are getting BTFO by Denver in free agency and need to respond.

Well, I give you credit for imagination.

Revis, Peppers and Hatcher in FA?

And I'm not very high on Aaron Lynch.

But very creative. And there is one piece of your plan that I really, really like.

 

[BobDigital]

Well, I give you credit for imagination.

Revis, Peppers and Hatcher in FA?

And I'm not very high on Aaron Lynch.

But very creative. And there is one piece of your plan that I really, really like.

Well if possible in the draft I get Ealy instead of Lynch. However he might be a top 15 pick and we can't likely trade up that high twice. If he falls to 24 or so GRAB HIM TOO.

Also this is the LEAST we can do if we want to beat Denver cause right now they are much better on paper on than us.

 

[mayoclinic]

Also this is the LEAST we can do if we want to beat Denver cause right now they are much better on paper on than us.

As were the 2001 Rams.

Games aren't played on paper, and it's a long season. Depth is paramount.

 

[BobDigital]

As were the 2001 Rams.

Games aren't played on paper, and it's a long season. Depth is paramount.

Still to start the year I'd rather be better on paper than Denver as opposed to worse. Wouldn't you? The better team on paper usually wins the game.

 

[mayoclinic]

Still to start the year I'd rather be better on paper than Denver as opposed to worse. Wouldn't you? The better team on paper usually wins the game.

It's about building a team, not just adding talent. John Elway is trying to build a team to win Madden, and so are you.

Anyway, we're not going to get anywhere with this. You're free to your approach, and I applaud your creativity, but I don't think it makes any sense, and it's completely unfeasible in any case.

 

[BobDigital]

It's about building a team, not just adding talent. John Elway is trying to build a team to win Madden, and so are you.

Anyway, we're not going to get anywhere with this. You're free to your approach, and I applaud your creativity, but I don't think it makes any sense, and it's completely unfeasible in any case.

I know the difference between building a team and adding talent. I also know the more talent you have generally the better chance you have to win.

You bring up the 2001 Patriots which were overall a less talented team than the Rams that year. However, that team did have a lot of talent looking back in hindsight. Law, Milloy, Brady, Brown(in a career year), McGinest, ect... It is not like they did not have the talent to compete with the Rams.

Right now I don't think the Patriots have the talent to compete with the Broncos, Seahawks or 49ers in a serious manor. Maybe you do but If so we can agree to disagree.

Also my approach is ENTIRELY feasible. I don't think BB will do it but it is entirely possible to make happen provided we back load contracts and make some room with smart cuts/extensions.

However the thing that bugs me the most is you said my approach did not make sense. How so? I built a team with players that can play well within a traditional 4-3 defense that has strong pass defense and good enough rush defense. Makes sense to me. whether it would actually work is of course in question but I think it is better than doing what we usually do.

 

[mayoclinic]

Tedy Bruschi thinks that a Pats-Revis deal "has to be done":

“Defensive coordinator Matt Patricia and Bill Belichick are most successful when they have a player like this, where they can eliminate part of the field or eliminate a receiver that’s outside, or also in the slot, and they can be creative in other parts of their coverage with their linebackers, defensive ends, safeties, other cornerbacks if they have this player. A Ty Law type of player -- this is who they need," Bruschi said on the program (video above).

“This deal has to be done. It has to be done. There is reason and there is motivation. The reason is that you just can’t do what you want to do if you don’t have a player with this type of skill -- the Aqib Talib, Ty Law type of skill.”

Tedy Bruschi on Darrelle Revis: 'Deal has to be done' - ESPN Boston

While I'm not yet 100% sold on the wisdom of signing Revis, this argument is the one that has the most weight with me. If a guy like Revis can allow the Pats to "get creative" on defense and start exploiting some of the athleticism they have with other players because they can count on Revis to lock down half the field, then it opens up a lot of possibilities on defense. Especially if you add another disruptive playmaker or two through the draft.

 

[mayoclinic]

Mike Neal says he is staying in Green Bay:

Mike Neal tweets he's staying with Green Bay Packers - NFL.com

Too bad. Poor man's Lamarr Houston.

 

[everlong]

Tedy Bruschi thinks that a Pats-Revis deal "has to be done":



Tedy Bruschi on Darrelle Revis: 'Deal has to be done' - ESPN Boston

While I'm not yet 100% sold on the wisdom of signing Revis, this argument is the one that has the most weight with me. If a guy like Revis can allow the Pats to "get creative" on defense and start exploiting some of the athleticism they have with other players because they can count on Revis to lock down half the field, then it opens up a lot of possibilities on defense. Especially if you add another disruptive playmaker or two through the draft.

It comes down to price. If he can be had for 12M great. If he's holding out for the 16 or close to it that he was making in Tampa that's too much coin.

 

[mayoclinic]

It comes down to price. If he can be had for 12M great. If he's holding out for the 16 or close to it that he was making in Tampa that's too much coin.

It's done, per Schefter: 1 year@$12M.

Now draft Phillip Gaines to be his understudy.

 

[mayoclinic]

With Darrelle Revis under contract but with a $12M cap hit, the Pats are down to about $5M in cap space. That's a sizable chunk of change - about what I had hoped to spend in cap space on Talib + a DL like Lamarr Houston. That's the bad news. The good news is getting a shutdown CB who can be put on an island against anyone in the league and who can make the field smaller. That will allow the rest of the Pats' secondary to get help, and make things much easier for the front 7.

I'd be thrilled to pick up Wesley Woodyard, Brandon Browner and maybe a rotational DE if the Pats can find the cap space. Vince Wilfork's situation needs to be sorted out. But the bottom line to me is this: If the Pats can get decent SS safety play (whether from Duron Harmon, a FA like Browner, or a rookie), if Jamie Collins continues to progress the way he did at the end of 2013, and if the Pats can add some disruption and depth on the DL, then I think they could have a legitimate top 5 defense.

Aaron Donald, Ra'Shede Hageman or Dominique Easley, please.

 

[jsull87]

With Darrelle Revis under contract but with a $12M cap hit, the Pats are down to about $5M in cap space. That's a sizable chunk of change - about what I had hoped to spend in cap space on Talib + a DL like Lamarr Houston. That's the bad news. The good news is getting a shutdown CB who can be put on an island against anyone in the league and who can make the field smaller. That will allow the rest of the Pats' secondary to get help, and make things much easier for the front 7.

I'd be thrilled to pick up Wesley Woodyard, Brandon Browner and maybe a rotational DE if the Pats can find the cap space. Vince Wilfork's situation needs to be sorted out. But the bottom line to me is this: If the Pats can get decent SS safety play (whether from Duron Harmon, a FA like Browner, or a rookie), if Jamie Collins continues to progress the way he did at the end of 2013, and if the Pats can add some disruption and depth on the DL, then I think they could have a legitimate top 5 defense.

Aaron Donald, Ra'Shede Hageman or Dominique Easley, please.

RE what you had hoped to get Talib and Houston for. I agree but the reality of it ended up being Talib went for $9m per and Houston went for $7m per. So it ended up being in reality another $4m then expected.

I am still hoping for a Wilfork restructure and Peppers to be brought in for a tilt at the title. I guess only time will tell.

 

[mayoclinic]

My Defense right now.


DE - 5 - Jones Nink Peppers(FA) Aaron Lynch(Draft) ???? (someone else)
DT - 5 - Kelley Aaron Donald(Draft) Hatcher(FA) Jones Siliga
LB: - 5 -Mayo Collins Hightower Woodyard(FA) Fletcher
CB: - 5 - Revis(FA) Dennard Ryan Arrington Keith McGill(Draft)
S - 4 - McCourty Major Wright(FA), Harmon Ebner

I am not gonna tell you how I would make this happen. Just MAKE IT HAPPEN.

We are getting BTFO by Denver in free agency and need to respond.

I know the difference between building a team and adding talent. I also know the more talent you have generally the better chance you have to win.

You bring up the 2001 Patriots which were overall a less talented team than the Rams that year. However, that team did have a lot of talent looking back in hindsight. Law, Milloy, Brady, Brown(in a career year), McGinest, ect... It is not like they did not have the talent to compete with the Rams.

Right now I don't think the Patriots have the talent to compete with the Broncos, Seahawks or 49ers in a serious manor. Maybe you do but If so we can agree to disagree.

Also my approach is ENTIRELY feasible. I don't think BB will do it but it is entirely possible to make happen provided we back load contracts and make some room with smart cuts/extensions.

However the thing that bugs me the most is you said my approach did not make sense. How so? I built a team with players that can play well within a traditional 4-3 defense that has strong pass defense and good enough rush defense. Makes sense to me. whether it would actually work is of course in question but I think it is better than doing what we usually do.

There are several things I like about your proposal, one of which, the Revis signing, has already occurred. I obviously love the idea of Aaron Donald, and the combination of Donald disrupting inside and Revis locking down half the field would be potentially awesome.

There are 2 main issues I have:

1. First, I don't think the FA signings are "realistic" from a cap space. Revis + Peppers + Hatcher, plus a few others. We already know Revis is costing us at least $12M in cap space, possibly more. Peppers won't come for free, and Hatcher was a Pro Bowl DT last year. I just can't see any way of fitting that in - and I fully understand that your proposal involves cutting Wilfork to free up cap space. But there are offensive needs, too. Maybe we get lucky and find a way to squeeze enough money to get Peppers and Woodyard. I don't personally see Major Wright as a starter at safety, but that's JMHO, and differences of opinion are fine.

In addition, I don't understand your subsequent comment about also trading up to get Kony Ealy if he lasted to 24 or so in the 1st round. With what? Donald would require a trade up. What would we have to basically have 2 1st round picks in the top 24? I don't understand where that is coming from, though it was not part of your original plan.

2. The part that makes no "sense" to me is signing Jason Hatcher - a high cost FA 3-tech - and then trading up to draft Aaron Donald. I like both players, but they are redundant. Why would you make a high profile pass rushing 3-tech signing and then trade up to draft a pass rushing 3-tech?

I don't mean to be demeaning. Some of the ideas are very appealing, if they could be made to work. But that was why I used those 2 words, which I didn't intend as insulting.