The bandwagon will be stopping to let anyone off

[Rob0729]

Just because I think the offense lost this game in the second half does not mean I am jumping off the bandwagon. Fact is the offense sucked in the second half. Brady is my favorite player but he cost the Patriots a couple tds today.

And I am not addressing this thread to you. I am addressing it to the people who are saying Brady will never be the same again or lost his passion for football. Or the ones who act like the season is already over.

 

[patsfan-1982]

3-0 at home and 0-2 on the road VS two relly good team's

a D full of younger player's that have gave up 20 one time this year

they are far from a great team right now but come playoff time no one will want to play them

 

[BradyisGod]

i AGREE. Im tired of people saying we are fair weather fans we we are criticizing the team.. they need to be called out...

They need to be called out? For what purpose? What difference will it make if the whole board calls them out? If the people on this board knew .01% of what they claim to know, they would be in the NFL coaching.

This is why the east coast sucks and I hate it. Everyone thinks they are smarter than everyone else. Go to the midwest, and it just seems like they support their team. But NY, New England, everyone is always self aggrandizing like they could match wits with Bill freaking Bellichick. Yes, they want to "match wits" with the Bellichick who owns 5 freaking Super Bowl rings. I do NOT know better. And I know it. And this isn't meant at your Sean Pa...I just don't get it.

Fan is short for Fanatical. In terms of being fanatical in SUPPORT of a team. Not fanatically crazy and critical.

 

[mayoclinic]

For all you fairweather fans who are ready to turn on this team after two losses in five games, feel free to jump off the bandwagon at any time. Seriously, looking at this board, you would think the Pats went 2-14 for the season.

The Pats didn't play well in the second half and overtime and they have things to improve. But they have a fairly easy schedule the rest of the way (only Indy, the Jets, and Saints having winning records remaining on their schedule) and plenty of time to fix the problems. Brady is coming off a major injury and a year away from the game and will probbaly take some time before he is completely on his game.

I'm personally not jumping off the bandwagon. But I'm very discouraged by some of the things that I saw in this game and with the shape of the season so far, which I've highlighted elsewhere:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/281778-very-depressing.html

There is tremendous talent on this team. But there is tremendous talent on the Ravens too, and I doubt they will go very far based on their mental meltdowns. We've melted down too, in a different way. We've failed to execute, to maintain intensity, and to do some very basic things. The game calling has been questionable against the Jets and in this game, with little defensive pressure or offensive balance, and very predictable play. We've failed to maintain intensity and consistency, failed to win on the road, failed to make 2nd half adjustments, failed to score twice on repeated chances when one good drive would have put the game out of reach, and been shut out twice in the second half. We would be kidding ourselves to pretend that those are not major issues, and are essentially incompatible with being a serious contending team.

It's one thing to start out rusty and need to make some corrections, or overcome injuries. At this point the season is nearly 1/3 over, and we do not look like one of the elite teams. We're somewhere in the second tier of also-rans. We have the talent to correct things and turn it around, but the fact that we haven't straightening things out this far into the season is disturbing. It reminds me of 2005 when we started the season 4-4 and couldn't win 2 games in a row. Though we fixed things well enough to finish 10-6 and win the division, we just weren't consistent enough or good enough that year.

Brady could be going through a Manningesque adjustment after injury in which he's inconsistent for half a season before catching fire. Or he may never be the same. Too early to tell. But there are numerous signs coming of this loss that there may be some major issues for this team to work out.

Again, not jumping ship. But not ignoring the facts so far, either.

 

[mgteich]

I agree.
We can hope and expect Brady and the offense to be much better later in the season.
We can hope and expect Brady and the defense to be much better later in the season.

But why should we believe that the coaching will be any better?

To be truthful it's not all Brady that I am concerned about. Yeah, he sucked today and hasn' t sniffed his usual stellar play this year. But my concern is the coaching staff; this is the 3rd game of 5 this season that I felt they have been outcoached (Bills, Jets and Donks).

 

[Rob0729]

Overall the defense has been decent so far. Today the defense was just awful. I believe Orton completed 80% of his passes.

The offense has been between poor and average all year. This is this is the second game that the pats could not score in the second half. Out of 5 games the offense has been poor in 3 of them.

The Pats did score 17 points against a team that was giving up 6 points a game the first six weeks and have the first passing TDs against Denver for the season. The offense isn't as bad as you might think.

 

[Ian]

I agree.
We can hope and expect Brady and the offense to be much better later in the season.
We can hope and expect Brady and the defense to be much better later in the season.

But why should we believe that the coaching will be any better?

Because I have a hard time believing that after reviewing the tape week after week that a coach of Bill Belichick's calibur will continue to make similar errors in week 12 that they are in week 5. Most coaches usually don't feel they need to change anything if their team is winning. A couple of losses may cause them to change the things that obviously aren't working.

 

[crowell33]

To be truthful it's not all Brady that I am concerned about. Yeah, he sucked today and hasn' t sniffed his usual stellar play this year. But my concern is the coaching staff; this is the 3rd game of 5 this season that I felt they have been outcoached (Bills, Jets and Donks).

Not to worry BB is the best coach in the game. Tommy will be fine. Yes I understand he is off to a rough start ( especially on passes longer that 10 or 15 yards ), but he missed a whole season so what do we expect? By the time the playoffs role around he will be much improved.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Why not call belichick out, if we are calling brady out??? Belichick hired this great Dean Pees to run his defense after Mangini, who was not much better in 05.. Belichik who felt it was not worth to have a Richard Seymour this year, because of a a draft pick in 11, that will prob be traded for something in 12 or 13... Belichik needs some blame.. sorry, Brady does to, because he has not played well since the jax playoff game.. But the coaching went in the tank today, when matt light went down on offensive.. they felt Sammy morris was the key today , just like in 06 vs the Colts for the title game, Heath Evans was the awnser... Some things needs to be questioned, but Belichick is still the best coach the Pats will or ever had.. But I think he needs a little call out..

 

[Kontradiction]

Is it against the rules to be critical of your team? I should hope not. That's not really fandom now is it?

Some of us as far from bandwagon fans (myself I have been a Patriots fan since '72) and have earned the right to be critical of the team when they play like crap. Today was one such day.

He's talking about the people like the guy that made the, "Brady will never be the same again" thread. He didn't play his best, but the guy threw two TDs for us today. He's not where he wants to be, but he's getting closer and closer by the week. Some people can nitpick this team and that's fine. You seem to be capable of it. However, it's the others that insist that this team is done/Tom Brady sucks/Dean Pees should be fired/Defense sucks/team has no talent that should just jump off the bandwagon. We'll be fine. We went up against a top three defense today without Brady being 100% back on his game and it showed.

 

[Rob0729]

I agree.
We can hope and expect Brady and the offense to be much better later in the season.
We can hope and expect Brady and the defense to be much better later in the season.

But why should we believe that the coaching will be any better?

Here are two reasons why we can expect the coaching to get better:

1.) Bill O'Brien is a rookie OC and will learn how to call plays better. It took McDaniels a while too.
2.) I do think the Pats are not throwing their who defensive playbook out there just yet. I think they still have a lot of new pieces on defense and Mayo isn't back into the lineup fully. I expect them to approach the defense like they did the offense last year and not open up the entire playbook until the second half of the season.

I could be wrong, but I have felt both these things for a while. I even said in the offseason(and got blasted for it) that the offense would go through some growing pains with the loss of McDaniels.

 

[Rob0729]

He's talking about the people like the guy that made the, "Brady will never be the same again" thread. He didn't play his best, but the guy threw two TDs for us today. He's not where he wants to be, but he's getting closer and closer by the week. Some people can nitpick this team and that's fine. You seem to be capable of it. However, it's the others that insist that this team is done/Tom Brady sucks/Dean Pees should be fired/Defense sucks/team has no talent that should just jump off the bandwagon. We'll be fine. We went up against a top three defense today without Brady being 100% back on his game and it showed.

Thank you! At least someone gets what I meant.

 

[Ian]

But my concern is the coaching staff; this is the 3rd game of 5 this season that I felt they have been outcoached (Bills, Jets and Donks).

I think even Belichick will probably agree with you. Everyone wishes they did certain things differently after a loss. I'm sure there will be certain things changed in the coming weeks.

 

[Halifax_Pats_Fan]

Why not call belichick out, if we are calling brady out??? Belichick hired this great Dean Pees to run his defense after Mangini, who was not much better in 05.. Belichik who felt it was not worth to have a Richard Seymour this year, because of a a draft pick in 11, that will prob be traded for something in 12 or 13... Belichik needs some blame.. sorry, Brady does to, because he has not played well since the jax playoff game.. But the coaching went in the tank today, when matt light went down on offensive.. they felt Sammy morris was the key today , just like in 06 vs the Colts for the title game, Heath Evans was the awnser... Some things needs to be questioned, but Belichick is still the best coach the Pats will or ever had.. But I think he needs a little call out..

good points and you know it is fair to throw blame around. I wish Brady would freak out less on the field.

We have a good team, and i thing we will make the playoffs. I do think we need some changes, may be a bit too late now.

We are not clicking, we are not clicking on offense and way too vanilla on D. I thought the o-line played well. Let's just get it out there, we have been spoiled as fans big time. I truly believe we are a work in progress. We'll be around going forward.

Great job Josh, I am sure we will see you again. You got this one...

 

[mayoclinic]

Because I have a hard time believing that after reviewing the tape week after week that a coach of Bill Belichick's calibur will continue to make similar errors in week 12 that they are in week 5. Most coaches usually don't feel they need to change anything if their team is winning. A couple of losses may cause them to change the things that obviously aren't working.

But we made similar errors in week 5 to those we made in week 2: predictable and unbalanced offensive play calling, lack of defensive pressure, soft coverage, etc. We seemed to have corrected those in games 3 and 4, and then went back to a very vanilla, and ineffective, game plan today.

This game had a lot of similarities to the Jets game:

- Led at halftime and were shut out
- Failed to execute on offense numerous times in the second half
- Didn't generate pressure on the opposing QB, when it should have been clear going in that that was a key to the game
- Played BBDB defense instead of an aggressive, attacking defense
- Didn't make adjustments at the half, and got outcoached
- Lacked intensity compared to what you would expect for a game of that magnitude

We started with 2 poor games. Then we played 2 good games. Now we've played a poor game. Not very consistent. The season is almost 1/3 over. Early adjustments should have been made by now, and the rust should be off. Players have had a chance to gel with each other.

The team that showed up against Baltimore last week (intense, focused, aggressive, balanced, imaginative, and making key plays in the clutch) is capable winning the SB. The team that showed up in Denver this week (uninspired, bland, predictable, unbalanced, soft, and unable to finish) is capable of not making the playoffs.

Which team will we be? Somewhere in-between is likely good enough to make the playoffs, but not good enough to go deep, as in 2005.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

good points and you know it is fair to throw blame around. I wish Brady would freak out less on the field.

We have a good team, and i thing we will make the playoffs. I do think we need some changes, may be a bit too late now.

We are not clicking, we are not clicking on offense and way too vanilla on D. I thought the o-line played well. Let's just get it out there, we have been spoiled as fans big time. I truly believe we are a work in progress. We'll be around going forward.

Great job Josh, I am sure we will see you again. You got this one...

Thanks for listening..

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Belichick- where is your defensive genius...??? have not seen it since 2004

I haven't seen it since '04 either. The schemes are extremely vanilla and doesn't surprise me when average QB's pick them apart because of the lack of creativity.

Brady- You had a inj, your better now. stop forcing passes, you have playmakers on o

It's frustrating but it doesn't surprise me he's struggling. In fact, it's extremely rare for any player to suffer an ACL injury and regain their prior form. It's the injury that pretty much destroys careers.

Deen Pees- Your resignation would be appricated

I was hoping this guy would've either resigned or get fired last season. Very surprising BB didn't want to bring in Romeo.

Adalius Thomas- can you give back some money

This guy needs to take a massive pay cut this offseason because he's not worth anything what he signed for. It's either that, or the Pats payed a massive amount of money for a guy to just hang out in coverage all day. It's bizarre this guy doesn't rush the passer more than he does.

Derrick Burgess- you can rush the passer can you???

This trade is looking worse each week. I was fine with the trade, but when I found out it was for a 3rd and a 5th, I didn't like it.

Vince Wilfork- If the Pats dont resign you, shame on them..

If it came down to an elite pass rusher or Wilfork, I'd take the elite rusher. As much as I like Wilfork, their pretty average stopping the run with him.

 

[Ian]

But we made similar errors in week 5 to those we made in week 2: predictable and unbalanced offensive play calling, lack of defensive pressure, soft coverage, etc. We seemed to have corrected those in games 3 and 4, and then went back to a very vanilla, and ineffective, game plan today.

I'm sure there were reasons, and save for a few plays and a couple of scoring opportunities the game could have turned out differently. As I said I think that you'll probably see some of those errors corrected - but I think we need to be smart and not over react. This is a team with a lot of talent that is only going to get better. I think we're looking at it as more of what the Patriots didn't do, instead of what Denver did.

Let's face it, their receivers made a ton of unbelievable catches today, with guys right on them. There were a lot of excellent plays made by the Broncos players today - and in a close game that's what it comes down to. So give them credit - they stepped up and things went their way. It happens. Tomorrow is another day, and next week will be another week. We're 3-2 with plenty of football left to be played.

 

[muzz]

Gimme a break, just because people are pissed and are letting off steam they are "Band wagoners" now?

TFB was bad, the playcalling on both sides of the ball was bad, that team that we lost to is still undefeated, but they didn't look like a great team to me, because I felt that we gave them the game with pathetic playcalling and even worse execution.

Some people think that blindly following is the way to go, IMO we already have enough of that garbage going on in politics.

I call it like I see it, and what I have been seeing is mediocre(at best) for the most part.

 

[BradyFTW!]

At the end of the day, there's a lot that's out of the team's hands (injuries) that I'm not going to criticize them for. Yes, I wanted the Pats to carry another OT, but even if they had he wouldn't have been active today, so it is what it is. Yes I wanted Nunn to make the team, but Galloway should have been a contributor. I'm not going to blame the team for not seeing that coming.

While I hate to keep harping on it, though, the Seymour trade was well within the Pats' hands. Just looking at it from the perspective of 2009- we chose to not have Seymour instead of having him. The hope was that the downgrade would not be substantial, so that the future production that we got out of the trade would be an unmitigated win. That has not been the case.

Another game, another close one where, while the defense held its own, it was ultimately victimized by its inability to bring a pass rush without blitzing. Anyone think Seymour couldn't have helped there?