Tom Curran: BJGE could be 2010 starter

[patsfan13]

BJGE seems to hang onto the ball in the red zone, we need a steady guy who whill not have negative yards and not turn the ball over.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Tom Curran is a moron. Either the Pats are telling him this to bump up BJE's trade value, or to light a fire under Maroney (again), Curran is making this up, or the Pats are really serious (and stupid).

 

[RayClay]

Personally, I think YPC is somewhat overrated a statistic.

I'm more interested in if the guy got the yards that were there for him to get. Curtis Martin barely managed to get the supposedly vaunted 4 YPC everyone seems on about and yet I doubt we'd find anyone here who wouldn't want him.

So why the love of these sort of stats?

Martin had 4 or more ypc 7 years out of 11.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Martin had 4 or more ypc 7 years out of 11.

But his yard per carry weren't that great with NE.

 

[crowell33]

Tom Curran is a moron. Either the Pats are telling him this to bump up BJE's trade value, or to light a fire under Maroney (again), Curran is making this up, or the Pats are really serious (and stupid).

Just want to be clear about this: Either Bill Belichick and the New England Patriots are "really serious and stupid", OR Tom Curran formerly of the Providence Journal and currently the National Football writer for NBC Sports is a "moron". But " HEY BRO ! WHATS UP ? Message board poster" knows better than they do?

All due respect. I'm thinking Belichick and / or Curran have more access, have attended more practices and have more connections to the team. I could be wrong.

 

[BradyFTW!]

BJGE seems to hang onto the ball in the red zone, we need a steady guy who whill not have negative yards and not turn the ball over.

Historically, Maroney doesn't do either with any particular frequency. There was a couple game stretch last year where he fumbled a lot, but his career success rate and fumble rate are both well above average.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

Yeah, those 7 years of 4 YPC or more? Just about all with the Jets.

1995 - 3.9 YPC
1996 - 3.6 YPC
1997 - 4.2 YPC

If the boards were around back then, would people have been complaining about his YPC? Or would they have been happy he did his job effectively?

Now I'm not saying BJGE is Curtis Martin but I think YPC is one of the least convincing arguments for or against a RB's effectiveness.

 

[TheComeback]

Yeah, those 7 years of 4 YPC or more? Just about all with the Jets.

1995 - 3.9 YPC
1996 - 3.6 YPC
1997 - 4.2 YPC

If the boards were around back then, would people have been complaining about his YPC? Or would they have been happy he did his job effectively?

Now I'm not saying BJGE is Curtis Martin but I think YPC is one of the least convincing arguments for or against a RB's effectiveness.

I doubt people were claiming that Curtis Martin was a hall of famer early on in his career, for one thing. And the fact is that he had more experience by the time he got to the Jets, as well.

If you're going to use stats in this argument at all, it seems to me that YPC would be the only the one that matters for RBs--assuming everything else, like the rest of the starters on offense (esp. the oline), are the same. If not, then it's a different story.

There will always be people who claim that certain stats are overrated or don't mean anything. The fact is that they do give us information about player performance. They may not give the whole picture, but I don't see how you can discount them in many situations, either.

Even so, I'm not sure where you set the mark for an acceptable YPC. It could be 3, 3.5, or 4 depending on the offense, coaches, and situation. But chances are, if your back is averaging less than 3 yards a carry, the "overrated" YPC stat is telling you that your running game sucks.

 

[RayClay]

But his yard per carry weren't that great with NE.

Two out of three years.

This is so stupid. We have people looking at statistics and arguing against them.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

Yep, your running 'game' which is composed of more than just your RB. Where's your RB getting hit first? How much time is there to get to a hole if there is one? These are all components which go more into coaching, scheme and OL for most RBs. There are VERY few RBs who can get the job done without the rest of these components falling into place.

 

[RayClay]

Hmm. Maybe if I pull out certain years and post them, no one will check.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Just want to be clear about this: Either Bill Belichick and the New England Patriots are "really serious and stupid", OR Tom Curran formerly of the Providence Journal and currently the National Football writer for NBC Sports is a "moron". But " HEY BRO ! WHATS UP ? Message board poster" knows better than they do?

All due respect. I'm thinking Belichick and / or Curran have more access, have attended more practices and have more connections to the team. I could be wrong.

I don't don't know, does it take a genius to figure out that JaMarcus Russell is a bad player? What about Ryan Leaf or Tim Couch. The point is, you don't have to be a "coach" or "get access" to figure some of this stuff out.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Two out of three years.

This is so stupid. We have people looking at statistics and arguing against them.

I thought Martin was a good player for the Pats and was pissed they let him walk.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

Hmm. Maybe if I pull out certain years and post them, no one will check.

I looked through the Patriots Media Guide for those and for the 1997 one I pulled up ProFootballReference.com's data.

1995-1997 were his Patriot years.

If you're counting 1995 as 4 YPC, great. It's still just barely that and as I recall, most people thought he had a great season and I doubt anybody was grousing about his 1996 performance either.

 

[RayClay]

Yeah, those 7 years of 4 YPC or more? Just about all with the Jets.

1995 - 3.9 YPC
1996 - 3.6 YPC
1997 - 4.2 YPC

If the boards were around back then, would people have been complaining about his YPC? Or would they have been happy he did his job effectively?

Now I'm not saying BJGE is Curtis Martin but I think YPC is one of the least convincing arguments for or against a RB's effectiveness.

1995 - 1487 yards. 1487/368 = 4.04 ypc according to NFL.com and Pro football Reference.

If you're going to make a statistically based argument, use the most credible sources.

No he's not anywhere close to Curtis Martin.

Also, YPC isn't the most important measure, but usually bruising, consistent backs are ones who can be succesful with a lower ypc.

Eddie George would have been a better example.

BJGE is a journeyman at best. He's not that powerful and he's not exceptionally fast or elusive. That's why he's always on the bubble.

 

[RayClay]

I looked through the Patriots Media Guide for those and for the 1997 one I pulled up ProFootballReference.com's data.

1995-1997 were his Patriot years.

If you're counting 1995 as 4 YPC, great. It's still just barely that and as I recall, most people thought he had a great season and I doubt anybody was grousing about his 1996 performance either.

Look, making a statistical argument then arguing the numbers (4.04 is not 3.9) don't matter is weak

You used two different sources for the same statistic? Ha ha. you're a riot.

 

[DaBruinz]

I think this is spot on. BJGE doesn't exactly have to beat out Walter Payton here to be the starter. If he can stay healthy, not fumble the ball, not dance and block to protect the QB, he's ahead of the game in NE.

BB starting him with the 1's last night was not likely a headgame.

Let's review BJGE and your requirements:

1) Healthy - INC - Has not seen enough game time to determine this
2) Not Fumble the Ball - INC - Has not seen enough game time to determine this
3) Not Dance - He's a north/south runner.. so you get this.
4) Block to protect the QB - INC/F - This was one of his big failings coming out of school. And he hasn't shown much in the times he's been in that situation,.

You forgot pass catching, which he is horrible at.

 

[DaBruinz]

I've been to multiple training camp practices at Gillette. I can tell you that Law Firm is consistently practicing with the #1 offense in drills, and I don't think it's simply to save Maroney as if he's guaranteed the starting spot.

Funny - no one else has mentioned this and there have been plenty of people there to comment.. Sorry if I right it off to them just giving BJGE reps to "showcase him" to others and to make a firm evaluation of him.

 

[Patspsycho]

Let's review BJGE and your requirements:

1) Healthy - INC - Has not seen enough game time to determine this
2) Not Fumble the Ball - INC - Has not seen enough game time to determine this
3) Not Dance - He's a north/south runner.. so you get this.
4) Block to protect the QB - INC/F - This was one of his big failings coming out of school. And he hasn't shown much in the times he's been in that situation,.

You forgot pass catching, which he is horrible at.

He has made tremendous improvements in blocking and catching, from what I saw at camp, in the joint practices, and in the first preseason game.

He has been working with the JUGS machine.

 

[BlueThunder]

Rewatching game on NFL Network now...2nd series...FIRST TEAM UNITS on field.

BJGE carries for 6yds- 2nd and 4

Moss catch for first dwn.

BJGE carries for 4 yds.

Moss 23 yds for first...

BJGE toss sweep left...0 yds ( nothing there and Maroney probably gets stuffed or dances and loses yds)

BJGE- carries for 4 yds

Faulk Draw for 5 or so...first dwn

BJGE stuffed on a LB shooting gap.

BJGE 6 yds for TD....Nice blocking by Gronk to seal inside and Connely takes out Vilma.

The Lawfirm gets what is there...didn't lose yds dancing...granted, NO isn't toughest run D, but Pats are missing 2 starting OL....