Say Goodbye To Van Noy

libra957 said:

If we can let Trey Flower walk, I don't see why we can't do they same with Van Noy.

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Trey Flowers broke the market, $16m.

Van Noy is looking at $8 or $9m

203Pat said:

Agree on the rest. I was devastated to see Givens go lol.

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We had a good little stretch there of drafting and developing WRs with branch and givens.

upstater1 said:

Are people here seriously considering Stidham as our starting QB next year? I mean, why not Hoyer?

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Stidham is nice don't let the 4th round pick fool you, he was a projected 1st rounder till he went to a bad team.

Also, the idea that Van Noy is just a JAG is crazy. You can have all the speed in the world, but if you're bad at diagnosing plays, all it means you're going to get to the wrong spot really fast.

Van Noy is a playmaker.

And oh yeah, we're spoiled. Just because we had 1 bad year (12-4) out of 4 with this guy doesn't mean we chuck all the free agents over the fence and start over. You do what makes sense financially and you build the team back up again. This defense is actually good enough to win a Super Bowl. It is.

Triumph said:

Instead of being focused on the next game, Boogyman Van Noy is bellyaching about his money.

Mahomes and Lamar Jackson aint scared of this defense.

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Mahomes may not be scared, but Belichick pretty much shut him down for a half of last years AFCCG and the second half this year

Bradyking12 said:

Stidham is nice don't let the 4th round pick fool you, he was a projected 1st rounder till he went to a bad team.

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The draftniks project every Tom, **** & Harry that high until they show warts in college. Tell me where they are drafted when the scouts have their say, and I'll believe it. Look at this year, in fact, when guys like Fromm and Love are projected as 1st rounders by some.

Bradyking12 said:

Stidham is nice don't let the 4th round pick fool you, he was a projected 1st rounder till he went to a bad team.

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At this point no one should be dismissive of Stidham.

They also should not be making him the heir-apparant.

He needs to beat his competition and earn it. Just like Tom did.

For my LB priorities in 2020 KVN>Collins

robertweathers said:

At this point no one should be dismissive of Stidham.

They also should not be making him the heir-apparant.

He needs to beat his competition and earn it. Just like Tom did.

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If TB isn’t back next season let’s see what we have in the kid.

Ras-IR Dowling said:

If TB isn’t back next season let’s see what we have in the kid.

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Absolutely. This fan base won't like it but tuff toodles.

Bring in a sage vet for reasonable $, maybe draft another QB, bring Michael Bishop out of retirement for fun and we're good to go.

TommyBrady12 said:

I dont think this team is going to be the same anymore. Too many pieces are leaving and Brady is too old to retool around him...

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We'll see. The team changes every year. Van Noy is a nice player but he has limitations and next year he's 29. I'll bet he wants Dee Ford money ($15M per).

It would surprise me if Brady played for the Patriots next year.

ChrisR2223 said:

Which is why I said Roll with Stidham and use the cap to improve the offense.
Keeping defensive pieces in place the secondary needs to stay near intact.
Would love Devin back don’t know if the cap is feasible.
Think of this and this is honestly scary if Josh leaves chances are Tom is leaving if Tom leaves my guess is Edelman would went to go with him especially if it’s home to California.

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While I agree with you that Edelman becomes a moveable asset if Brady leaves (Jules production:cap is still among the best in the league and he isn't getting crazy money next 2 years), I don't generally agree with the bolded above. Nothing resembling this roster for 2020 is winning anything without Brady, better to just burn it to the ground and get some fresh blood for 2021/2022 in that scenario. Everyone who will be over 30 in 2021 - out. Especially if you can trade them for picks.

I still believe they can make some noise this year if they really execute well and get a couple bounces, but the defense early on clearly did benefit from weak opponents and opportunistic turnover rates that can't be sustained. I'm not sure how interested I am in keeping that whole unit together at what it will cost and assuming they can be as good or better next year. If you're going 'last dance' with Brady maybe you make the dollars stretch to keep some of the depth, but otherwise it's Joejuan/JC/JJ/Brooks time in the secondary.

robertweathers said:

Absolutely. This fan base won't like it but tuff toodles.

Bring in a sage vet for reasonable $, maybe draft another QB, bring Michael Bishop out of retirement for fun and we're good to go.

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People talking about trading the farm to move up to go QB, why not grab a guy like Jalen Hurts in the mid rounds? He’s played in multiple college systems, he’s TOUGH, and his best quality...We don’t have to use a first round pick on him! If this plan fails miserably we could be staring at Trevor Lawrence in 2021. A pretty good consolation prize.

upstater1 said:

The draftniks project every Tom, **** & Harry that high until they show warts in college. Tell me where they are drafted when the scouts have their say, and I'll believe it. Look at this year, in fact, when guys like Fromm and Love are projected as 1st rounders by some.

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Not sure I completely understand this but scouts don't have a big say, if much at all until the 4th/5th + Rds. 1-3 are usually GM/Coach with some input but it's mostly Bill\Nick making the decisions early on. Which makes sense considering most of our draft $ is going on those players.

So basically 1-3 are the big shots & 4+ are where your scouting department really shows up.

Ras-IR Dowling said:

People talking about trading the farm to move up to go QB, why not grab a guy like Jalen Hurts in the mid rounds? He’s played in multiple college systems, he’s TOUGH, and his best quality...We don’t have to use a first round pick on him! If this plan fails miserably we could be staring at Trevor Lawrence in 2021. A pretty good consolation prize.

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While I won't like it I can handle a rough regular season if the plan is good and I'm confident management is competent.

The question is can the Krafts?

It's like BB has been putting cream& sugar in their coffee and now they need to drink it black

upstater1 said:

Also, the idea that Van Noy is just a JAG is crazy. You can have all the speed in the world, but if you're bad at diagnosing plays, all it means you're going to get to the wrong spot really fast.

Van Noy is a playmaker.

And oh yeah, we're spoiled. Just because we had 1 bad year (12-4) out of 4 with this guy doesn't mean we chuck all the free agents over the fence and start over. You do what makes sense financially and you build the team back up again. This defense is actually good enough to win a Super Bowl. It is.

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Here KVN has been a playmaker. Detroit not so much. There he was the epitome of a JAG.

Elsewheres? who knows?

If he winds up in Miami, as some might posit, who's to say he will be used in the same manner as he was here? Didn't Flores continue to use Minka Fitzpatrick out of position, until they shipped him out? Nothing is a given ... except if he does go to Miami, they will overpay him ... and I can't blame a guy for grabbing that Brass Ring when it becomes available

BaconGrundleCandy said:

Not sure I completely understand this but scouts don't have a big say, if much at all until the 4th/5th + Rds. 1-3 are usually GM/Coach with some input but it's mostly Bill\Nick making the decisions early on. Which makes sense considering most of our draft $ is going on those players.

So basically 1-3 are the big shots & 4+ are where your scouting department really shows up.

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I was replying to the idea that Stidham was a projected 1st rounder. If scouts weren't the ones to listen to on that, then you certainly don't listen to the draftniks either.

Would not surprise me if TB retired. I think he nearly did last season. If McD leaves, as I expect, TB may not be far behind.

203Pat said:

Stay with Patriots. Get paid.


Choose one.

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Won 2 rings and elevated his profile. Gonna walk and get paid. Smart business decision and I wouldn’t blame him if he did.

Pape said:

Here KVN has been a playmaker. Detroit not so much. There he was the epitome of a JAG.

Elsewheres? who knows?

If he winds up in Miami, as some might posit, who's to say he will be used in the same manner as he was here? Didn't Flores continue to use Minka Fitzpatrick out of position, until they shipped him out? Nothing is a given ... except if he does go to Miami, they will overpay him ... and I can't blame a guy for grabbing that Brass Ring when it becomes available

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Detroit was also the epitome of dysfunction. We've seen it many times in the past that even future Pro Bowlers and All Pros did not do so well under coaches who had their heads in the sand.

There are obvious examples in New England too. Parcells was great, don't get me wrong, but McGinest under Belichick was a totally different ball player. Gilmore is another good example. Belichick saw his ability, even though he was torched a lot in Buffalo. I could go on, but there are a lot of players who could be All-Pros on other rosters. Chicago is paying Akiem Hicks $11m and until this year, he was delivering.