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* Ye Olde 2013 Mock Draft Thread!! *

Discussion in 'Patriots Draft Talk' started by Off The Grid, Apr 30, 2012.

  1. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    Hah!! SCREW this "wait until October" nonsense!! [​IMG]

    Today IS the first official day of the 2013 Draft Season, and I say: Let's fire it UP, Brothers!! :rocker:

    And who better to start things off than the man, the legend...Brother Mayo!! :D
  2. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    MayoClinic's Inaugural 2013 Mock Draft ~ V1.0!!

    Here's an absurdly early attempt at a 2013 mock for the Patriots. As I see it, some potential areas to address include:

    1. DT. Vince Wilfork will be 31 and has been playing an increasing number of snaps. Age and playing time make him susceptible to injury. As the Grantland article suggess, he is the key to making it all happen. The 2013 draft class is potentially loaded at the DT position (depending on which underclassmen declare), and an extra wide body in the middle would also help with 4-3, 4-2-5 and 2-4-5 schemes.

    2. TE/WR. I personally ALWAYS prefer TEs to WRs, as they have more versatility. And Rob Gronkowski and Aaron Hernandez will be going into contract years. The 2013 TE class is potentially loaded, again depending on the underclassmen. Most people will consider WR a more obvious need, with a bunch of veterans and only Brandon Lloyd currently signed beyond 2013. I'm not a big fan of drafting WRs high, and would wait until day 2 or 3.

    3. OG/C. Brian Waters will likely retire after 2012. Dan Koppen is nearing the end of the line, and Logan Mankins and Dan Connolly are over 30.

    The Patriots currently have only 5 picks for 2013, in the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 7th rounds. I'm also going to assume that the Pats somehow get an extra 2013 2nd or 3rd round pick - possibly by trading Brian Hoyer before the trade deadline. Someone will be QB needy, and will jump at the opportunity to get the inside track on signing Hoyer before he comes a FA. If Ryan Mallett continues to develop, Hoyer is expendable, and he will likely want to go somewhere where he has a chance to start in 2013. I'm also guessing that BB will trade a player or two during training camp for a late round pick. In any case, I'm only going to address the first 4 rounds here. Finally, I'm also assuming that the Pats pick 31/32 in each round.

    With those assumptions, here's my VERY early take at 2013 (underclassmen with an *):

    *** Trade: The Pats trade #31/32 plus whatever they acquire for Brian Hoyer (or some other player trade) to move up in the first round to around 16-22, depending on the compensation.

    1. Star Lotulelei, DL, Utah. 6'3" 325#.

    [​IMG]

    Super Beast! Star Lotulelei is the closet thing in years to another Haloti Ngata, and his play on the field (unlike Dontari Poe) backs it up. He is a massive tackle with an exceptional combination of core strength, explosiveness and agility. The 2012 Pac-12 defensive lineman of the year, Lotulelei is a high character prospect who chose not to come out in 2012 in order to get his degree. He is fundamentally solid, and a smart player. He showcased his athleticism on a fake punt against Cal, catching a 17 yard reception:

    [​IMG]

    Lotulelei is my early 2013 1st round binky, along with Alabama OL Barrett Jones. It's a tough call between the two, but this mock goes with the DT and waits to later to take an interior lineman. It would be perfectly reasonable to go the other way, though. I proposed the trade because I can't see Lotulelei lasting to the late 1st round, but the Pats could easily "stand pat" and take one of the other DTs or an OL at 31/32 and use the extra pick (again, assuming they can get one).

    Alternatives:

    1. Johnathan Hankins*, DT, Ohio St. 6'3" 330#. Athletic DT who can push the pocket. With Urban Meyer and Mike Vrabel at OSU, BB will no doubt be wel informed.

    2. Jesse Williams, DT, Alabama. 6'4" 330#. An Australian and JUCO product, Williams is a behemoth with massive strength and a warrior mentality - 330# of pure muscle, a weight room fanatic with extraordinary core strength and explosiveness, and sub-5.00 40 speed. A former rugby player, Williams is athletic enough to play anywhere on the DL in 3-4 and 4-3 formations.

    3. Kwame Geathers / John Jenkins, Georgia. 6'5" 350# (Geathers), 6'3" 340# (Jenkins). Both guys are massive DTs with exceptional footwork and movement skills for their size. Geathers could be another Ted Washington.

    Given the depth of the position and the talent that I see coming out in 2013, one or more of these guys should be within reach, if not available at 31/32.

    2. Levine Toilolo*, TE, Stanford. 6'8" 263#.

    [​IMG]

    Beast! Scouts considered Coby Fleener to be only the 3rd best pro TE prospect that Stanford had in 2011, after Toilolo and Zach Ertz (6'6" 254#). Levine Toilolo is a massive, towering TE with exceptional movement skills who will be an elite red zone target and instant mismatch.

    Rob Gronkowski will be in a contract year in 2013. I think that Aaron Hernandez can be extended for Jermichael Finley money (around $8M/year), but Gronk will break the bank, and may get the franchise tag for 2014. A TE like Toilolo would provide an insurance policy. He wold also give the Pats a tremendous weapon in addiition to Gronk and Ahern in his own right. Toilolo is a redshirt junior, who missed his sophomore season with a knee injury. He had only 25 receptions in 2011 as the third TE of Stanford's troika, but 6 TDs. He will share time with Zach Ertz in 2012.

    Alternatives:

    1. Michael Williams, TE, Alabama. 6'6" 270#. Michael Williams is a physical monster at 270#, with tremendous physicality and core strength. He is a crushing blocker, who also has deceptive speed and the ability to get open and stretch the field.

    2. Joseph Fauria, TE, UCLA. 6'7" 258#. Another massive TE, the nephew of former Patriot TE Christian Fauria.

    3. Philip Lutzenkirchen, TE, Auburn. 6'5" 250#.

    Like DT, 2013 is likely to be very deep and talented at the TE position. In addition to these guys, Notre Dame's Tyler Eifert and Stanford's Zach Ertz will likely go high. Someone will slip a bit.

    3. Mario Benavides, OG/C, Louisville 6'4" 301#.

    [​IMG]

    Sleeper Beast! Benavides brings experience, versatility, size, power and processing speed to the center position. He is a 3 year starter who is a tough, durable, smart, mature player with a bit of nasty disposition. He has played through several injuries, and is a leader on the Cardinal's offensive line. The best Louisville OL prospect since Eric Woods in 2009.

    With Dan Koppen at the end of his career, the Pats take advantage of a deep OC class to take Benavides in the 3rd round. As discussed above, Barrett Jones would have been my first choice, but he will go in the first round, and DT was a higher priority for me in this mock. USCs Khaled Homes is probably also a late 1st/early 2nd prospect. It's entirely possible that the Pats go OL with someone like Jones in the 1st round and then DT in the second with someone like Jesse Williams or John Jenkins.

    4. Andre Ellington, RB, Clemson. 5'10" 190#.

    [​IMG]

    Sleeper Beast! OK, I'm obviously throwing darts here. But with Danny Woodhead in a contract year, Ellington is a versatile "flex back" who can line up at RB or WR and make plays all over the field. He runs more aggressively inside than his size would indicate.

    Alternatives: Too many to possibly enumerate at this early time.

    The 3rd and 4th round picks could easily be switched, depending on how player valuations change over time. I believe both Benavides and Ellington were given mid-round projections for 2012 by the Draft Advisory Committee.

    Again, this is absurdly early, and is intended more as "food for thought" than anything else.
  3. patsfaninpa

    patsfaninpa Rookie

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    We should get a couple of comp picks shouldn't we? We lost BJGE and didn't sign a rb to replace him. A 5th?? We should get one for Mark Anderson de/olb. We only signed vet minimum T. Scott. He signed for a lot more than BJGE. A 4th?? Agree about dt/de as our biggest need.
  4. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    I'm sure you're absolutely right!! Anderson warrants at least a 4th, and possibly a 3rd, for all I know...Green?? Eh...A 6th or a 7th, I expect, but probably knocked off because of Scott...

    As it stands, we have a 1, 2, 3, 4, and 7.
  5. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Rookie

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    I have a ranking of the top 190 or so junior and senior prospects for 2013 that I downloaded so I'll use that as a guide for a four round mock.

    Pick One

    Star Lotulelei and Barrett Jones are the obvious first round options for the Pats but neither will make it to pick 32 :rocker: . So BB will get back to his traditional draft approach and re-start the process of accumulating picks. So with the first round pick the Patriots trade back in to the second picking up a 2014 first or second.

    Pick Two (via whomever)

    Eric Reid, S, LSU

    [​IMG]

    I wonder if my safety obsession will translate from Barron to Reid. Eric Reid was a close second to Mark Barron as far as I'm concerned when I watched games last year. Currently my favourite eligible safety.

    Pick Three (Our own second rounder)

    Tyrann Mathieu, CB, LSU

    [​IMG]

    Your first two 2013 draft picks side by side. The fact that he's a slot corner only will likely mean he drops. He will be a potent weapon on a defense and I'd love to see how BB could use him.

    Pick Four

    Will likely require a bit of a trade up towards the top of the third round.

    Philip Lutzenkirchen, TE, Auburn

    [​IMG]

    I said in the other 2013 thread that he has a bit of the Gronk about him. Check out this clip:

    Lutzenkirchen's One-handed Grab (Auburn) - YouTube

    Gronk!!!!

    The reality is, both TE's will be out of contract at the end of the 2013 season. Can we re-sign both? Lutzenkirchen looks like an ideal replacement.

    Pick Five (Fourth Round)

    James Ferentz, OC, Iowa

    [​IMG]

    I have no idea how good he is. But with that lineage, you just know he'll be linked with us at some stage next year. So I'm getting in there first.

    Pick Six (4th round compensatory)

    Alec Ogletree, LB, Georgia

    [​IMG]

    If there was one guy that stood out to me as much as Barron last year, it was this kid. An undersized linebacker but he was all over the field when I watched Georgia and was consistently making plays. Unfortunately I believe he misses the first five games of next season so I'll have to wait to get my Ogletree fix.

    I reserve the right to amend this mock (some few hundred times) and should not be held to account on it. :D
  6. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    A beautifull effort, Brother!! :rocker:

    And No Limit On Refills!! :D
  7. Gronkandez

    Gronkandez Rookie

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    Can someone fill me in on the deal with brother Mayo? I know he was here a couple years back, then he left here for the other site... then he disappeared from there, and other than one outlier post stating Vontae Davis is the best defensive player in the draft, OTG now posts for him (at least his mocks.) Is Mayo the Robin Masters to OTG's Jonathan Higgins (Magnum PI reference)? Is he a real person?

    ??? Is this assuming a huge escalation in the salary cap? I don't see it at all.
  8. Leemo

    Leemo Rookie

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    You guys are mad mofo's but i love it!
  9. Gronkandez

    Gronkandez Rookie

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    you already ranked 190 guys for next years' draft???? EDIT: Ah you downloaded it from a draft site it appears. That makes more sense. Didn't know those were available yet.

    Since you watch Georgia games, what's your take on Rambo? I know's he's suspended for two games 'he doesn't smoke pot, he just accidently ate a pot brownie.'

    Other UGA defensive prospects are Jarvis Jones, John Jenkins, Kwame Geathers,Shawn Williams, Abry Jones, and Sanders Commings.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  10. Leemo

    Leemo Rookie

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    Where did you g et that brother? Would love to have a peek.
  11. Gronkandez

    Gronkandez Rookie

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    Senior prospects only just put up on rotoworld



    2013 Draft: Top 32 Seniors - NFL Draft Preview - Rotoworld.com

  12. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Rookie

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    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  13. Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

    Merril Hoge's Tie Knot Rookie

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    Damn. Mayoclinic and Manxman are SUPER BEASTS!!
  14. ZoisKing

    ZoisKing Rookie

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    Love the early mocks guys!

    After always having the option of two first round picks, I'm kind of sad we currently don't have the maneuverability of previous years...

    I'm hoping that by midseason the Oakland Raiders QB situation will be in complete disrepair, and they'll desperately trade a first for Ryan Mallett...:rocker:

    Regardless, I'd like to get another pick closer to the first to wrangle a top flight talent who's sure to be sitting there.
  15. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    I like the way you're thinking, there, Brother Zois...[​IMG]

    Do we play the Raiders, this year??

    Maybe we can get a pool together and drop a load of cash on the first guy to STOMP on Carson Palmer's big toe!! Greg Williams could organize it for us. I understand he's Looking For Work...:D
  16. Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

    Merril Hoge's Tie Knot Rookie

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    Or we could all become police officers and be *******s to our favorite prospects until they punch us in the face.

    I'll take Barkley. You guys can draw straws for Lotulelei :eek:

    That way our Cop Puncher Mock Draft can be complete.

    1. Barkley
    2. Lotulelei
    3. Mingo
    4. Amerson
  17. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Hey, if we're going to factor cop punching into our mock:

    1. Star Lotulelei - I've always wanted Haloti Ngata and VW on my DL
    2. Johnathan Hankins, DT, Ohio St. - Hankins or Lotulelei? In the words of OTG, "Hell, why not BOTH?"
    3. Barett Jones, OT, Alabama - he could punch a cop from 5 different OL positions
    4. Tyrann Mathieu, DB, LSU - he probably WOULD punch a cop. Heck, a whole squadron of them.

    Honorable mention to Taylor Lewan, Jesse Williams, William Gholston, Barkevious Mingo, Tyler Eifert, Levine Toilolo, David Amerson and Justin Gilbert.

  18. SeymourTrophies

    SeymourTrophies Rookie

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    Like BB, I dream of 3 massive DT-sized souls in the trenches of the 3-4(or any formation, for that matter), which is why I can't pass up this bad mo fo out of Utah. If he is the next Ngata, his comparison alone will shoot him up the board, that is, so long as no one gives him the damning label of "T-Rex Arms" :eek:.

    Vince isn't getting any younger.

    Is Sidney Ponson entering the NFL draft? I hear he has been in a melee or two with Law Enforcement officials. His core strength is out of this world, but his fluidity and technique could use some Pepper therapy.
  19. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    PREACH it, Brother Mayo!! :rocker:
  20. ZoisKing

    ZoisKing Rookie

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    :rocker: Very funny! What a great idea. :)

    I'll take Jesse Williams and mayo can have Lotulelei!
  21. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'd be THRILLED to get Jesse Williams next year. While I expect Lotulelei and Hankins will get most of the press, Williams is a BEAST with an amazing combination of strength, athleticism and attitude. Please we'd have the start of a great rugby team along with Nate Ebner, and could take on the Jets and Hayden Smith.

    Seriously, I'm thrilled to have Jesse Williams fly under the radar - very difficult for an Alabama prospect to do. I think he'll end up being as good as the other 2 guys. Maybe not as mobile as Lotulelei, but stronger.

    BTW, what do you think of Kawann Short of Purdue?
  22. ZoisKing

    ZoisKing Rookie

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    As a penetrating DT, he looks really good. He wins almost every one on one matchup. He also looks very capable of evading double teams, and is relentless in his pursuit. He isn't the largest prospect, when compared to the other DTs available, but if we maintain a 4-3 base, then (when combined with Jones, Bequette, Hightower, etc) he'd be a guy who'd create a lot of havoc with Wilfork eating up blockers.
  23. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    Forging a Shopping List

    Fanatical Yankee's Cardinal Rule: Never tip your hand to the Opponent.

    Never field players who only do one thing well, if you can possibly help it.

    2013 Patriots Draft ~ Reconnaissance!!

    A look at what I'd love to see us shopping for, after the 2012 Super Bowl Season, based on our current roster, and based on some notions that reflect my own deeply disturbed Philosophy, not that'f Bill the Mad (Genius):

    Fanatical Yankee's 32 Positional Notions ~ 2013 Draft Version!!

    Offense

    01 ~ Feature Ryan Mallett in Weeks 16 and 17, and trade'm for 1 (one) King's Ransom.
    02 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality QuarterBack, and 2 All Pro Talent QB's, developing behind'm.
    03 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Center, and 1 All Pro Talent OC, developing behind'm.
    04 ~ Always strive to have 2 All Pro Quality O Guards, and 2 All Pro Talent OG's, developing behind'm.
    05 ~ Always strive to have 2 All Pro Quality O Tackles, and 2 All Pro Talent OT's, developing behind'm.
    06 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on an Old School Tight End ~ and I mean Blocking Specialists.
    07 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Flex End, and 1 All Pro Talent XE, developing behind'm.
    08 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Wing Back, and 1 All Pro Talent WB, developing behind'm.
    09 ~ Always strive to have 2 All Pro Quality Split Ends, and 2 All Pro Talent SE's, developing behind'm.
    10 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on a Slot End ~ A SL does only one thing exceptionally well.
    11 ~ Unless that Slot End happens to be Wes Welker.
    12 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on a Flanker End ~ FL's only do one thing exceptionally well.
    13 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on a Power Back ~ PB's can't Catch. Defenses know this.
    14 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on a Scat Back ~ SB's can't Block. Defenses know this.
    15 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on a Full Back ~ they can't Run. Defenses know this.
    16 ~ Always strive to have 2 All Pro Quality Flex Backs, and 2 All Pro Talent XB's, developing behind'm.

    Defense

    01 ~ Scrap the 34 Base. FootBall always has been and will always be a Chess Match. I believe that in this Passing Era, the 245 is what'll lead us to Glory ~ an Hybrid Theory of the 245, the 425, the 43, the 34...and more!!

    02 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Nose Tackle, and 1 All Pro Talent NT, developing behind'm.
    03 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality D Tackle, and 1 All Pro Talent DT, developing behind'm.
    04 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Under Tackle, and 1 All Pro Talent UT, developing behind'm.
    05 ~ That's correct: 6 D Tackles!! As QB warrants Triple Protection AquaFresh, so does D Tackle!!
    06 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Left End, and 1 All Pro Talent LE, developing behind'm.
    07 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Right End, and 1 All Pro Talent RE, developing behind'm.
    08 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Sam MidFielder, and 1 All Pro Talent SF, developing behind'm.
    09 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Mike MidFielder, and 1 All Pro Talent MF, developing behind'm.
    10 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Will MidFielder, and 1 All Pro Talent WF, developing behind'm.
    11 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Strong Safety, and 1 All Pro Talent SS, developing behind'm.
    12 ~ Always strive to have 1 All Pro Quality Free Safety, and 1 All Pro Talent FS, developing behind'm.
    13 ~ Always strive to have 3 All Pro Quality CornerBacks, and 2 All Pro Talent CB's, developing behind'm.
    14 ~ Never Waste a Roster Spot on a Gunner or Returner who can't substantially contribute elsewhere.
    15 ~ Ultimately, all Strong Safeties should be able to play ~ at an high level ~ at Free Safety.
    16 ~ Ultimately, all Free Safeties should be able to play ~ at an high level ~ at CornerBack...and Vice Versa!!

    Going Down the Projectable 2013 Roster

    This is a quick assessment of what we project to have on hand, next February, The Gods Granting Good Health, and keeping in mind my insanely ambitious notions, listed above...but allowing for a really good Reserve or two to keep his spot!!

    01 ~ QB ~ Tom Brady
    02 ~ QB
    03 ~ QB

    04 ~ OC

    05 ~ OC ~ Dan Connolly
    06 ~ OG ~ Logan Mankins
    07 ~ OG
    08 ~ OG
    09 ~ OG

    10 ~ OT ~ Nate Solder
    11 ~ OT ~ Sebastian Vollmer
    12 ~ OT ~ Robert Gallery
    13 ~ OT

    14 ~ XE ~ Rob Gronkowski
    15 ~ XE ~ Daniel Fells
    16 ~ WB ~ Aaron Hernandez
    17 ~ WB

    18 ~ SE ~ Jabar Gaffney
    19 ~ SE ~ Donte Stallworth
    20 ~ SL ~ Wes Welker
    21 ~ FL ~ Brandon Lloyd
    22 ~ FL ~ Deion Branch

    23 ~ XB ~ Shane Vereen
    24 ~ XB ~ Danny WoodHead
    25 ~ XB
    26 ~ PB ~ Steven Ridley

    27 ~ NT ~ Vince Wilfork
    28 ~ NT ~ Kyle Love
    29 ~ DT
    30 ~ DT

    31 ~ UT ~ Jon Fanene
    31 ~ UT ~ Myron Pryor

    32 ~ EL ~ Trevor Scott
    33 ~ EL ~ Chandler Jones
    34 ~ EL ~ Jake Bequette
    35 ~ EL ~ Jermaine Cunningham

    36 ~ SF ~ Rob Ninkovich
    37 ~ SF ~ Donta HighTower

    38 ~ MF ~ Brandon Spikes
    39 ~ MF ~ Dane Fletcher

    40 ~ WF ~ Jerod Mayo
    41 ~ WF

    42 ~ SS ~ Pat Chung
    43 ~ SS ~ Nate Ebner
    44 ~ FS ~ Ras I Dowling
    45 ~ FS ~ Tavon Wilson

    46 ~ CB ~ Devin McCourty
    47 ~ CB
    48 ~ CB ~ Alfonzo Dennard
    49 ~ CB ~ Kyle Arrington
    50 ~ CB ~ Sterling Moore


    The last 3 spots are Givens.

    Those 15 Spots are the ones I'll be keeping a keen eye out on, for now...

    3 of them ~ Center, O Guard, and D Tackle ~ are Priorities and possible 1st Round Targets...in my Universe!!
  24. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Rookie

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    Grid

    Interesting list. Lot's I agree with, here's where I differ to varying degrees:

    1. Ras-I-Dowling. It's pretty clear from what we've been hearing out of the organisation that he was drafted as a CB and that they want to play him there. as I said in the other 2013 thread (and I know you differ here), I think we need a specialist safety, one that's an upgrade on Patrick Chung, and is therefore a high priority either through draft or FA.

    2. DT. I think this could be a high draft priority. I'm all for a beast to play alongside and eventually replace Wilfork. However, this is entirely conditional on the right player being there. The last two drafts have demonstrated that adding bodies to the position are not high on BB's priority list. However, if Lotulelei or Hankins are that special big body, and early looks suggest thwey might be, then I'm sure BB will look in that direction.

    3. By the time the next draft rolls around, we will be only one year away from Gronk and Hernandez being out of contract. Keeping both will be very tough so I do think a potential replacement, most likely for Hernandez, becomes an important consideration for the draft.

    4. I'm glad you highlighted the need for a will type midfilder. I think my biggest disappointment from the draft was that we didn't get a midfielder who can drop into coverage. I'm hoping for this as a second to third round option.

    5. Unless we're talking a Barrett Jones or DeCastro quality OL, I don't think this is necessarily a first round option. Whilst BPA at a position of need applies, I think OL's can be found later in the draft.

    Whilst not fixed in stone, I'd target our draft priorities somethin like:

    1. A potentially best in the league type DT. If not there, then I think it's importance as a position of need drops sharply.

    2. Safety. It's still our biggest hole, I'm not sold on what I've seen of Wilson, although hopeful and supportive, and I think Chung, in the last year of his contract, can be upgraded.

    3=. WR. I really like what we've done FA-wise but I do think it's a short-term patch rather than a long-term fix. I'd like BB to start thinking about a longer-term approach to our receivers.

    3=. A pass defending midfielder. I like Hightower, but I'm not sure he's someone you want dropping into coverage too much. aside from Mayo, there's not much else there.

    3=. OL. For Barrett Jones, I'd move this one up the list but I think the Patriots have shown themselves capable of bringing in quality vets or developing prospects.

    4. TE.

    5. RB. Unless Vereen or Ridley show they are capable of carrying the burden, and I'm still hopeful they can, then as an advocate for a good running game, it's a position I'd like them to address.

    6. QB. I like Mallett's chances as the long-term Brady replacement, but with Hoyer likely gone, bringing in a developmental guy who could be competition for Mallett will be a good thing.

    I don't think I differ from you substantially, there's only a slight difference in emphasis.
  25. ZoisKing

    ZoisKing Rookie

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    Great stuff manxman.
  26. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    Ah!! Good stuff, here, Brother Manx ~ agreements and divergences, both. :cool:

    1 ~ Please keep in mind: This is my demented Vision of things, not my prediction of what Mad Bill would do: And it's quite possible that Ras I Dowling will prove to be an exceptional Corner Back, but at this early juncture, I'm only highly confident in his ability to excel at Free Safety. More importantly, from my perspective, is that I consider it wise to develop a team whose Free Safeties might very well be able to excel at Corner, thus building in Depth of Talent at Corner. And I think the best way to do this is to ignore Free Safeties in the Draft, and to target Corners...for the most part. Mad Bill may indeed think otherwise.

    2 ~ Defensive Tackle is an high Priority...for me!! :D Whether or not Bill The Mad (Genius) concurs is another matter, my good man. Considering the absolutely vital importance of this role ~ I consider it second in critical importance only to QuarterBack, and not by much ~ and considering that this team seems clearly headed ~ and wisely so ~ towards Sets ~ especially the 245 and 425 ~ that require not one but TWO high caliber D Tackles...and considering, above all, our inadequate Depth of Talent at that position, especially in light of Vince Wilfork's astonishing Work Load, the last two years, and how susceptible to a season-ending injury they make him...I think it clearly behooves us to make this position a major Priority.

    3 ~ Hah!! No way in HELL would I let either Rob Gronkowski or Aaron the Navigator go until 2020 or so: Flex End + Wing Back command the center of the Chess Board. The impact of those two positions ~ relative to Wide Receivers ~ has a dramatically disproportionate effect on winning Games and Championships...and we have two of the very, very best. To allow either to walk ~ or even enter Free Agency ~ would be flat out NIGHTMARISH, in my view. So while I am the Original ~ and, for a LONG time: ONLY ~ advocate of drafting Depth of Talent at Flex End and Wing Back...we'll have to disagree on taking measures to replace either of those guys for the next several years.

    4 ~ Yes, I couldn't agree more. We had a unique Opportunity to scoop up an amazing Pass Coverage MidFielder, in LaVonte David, and Mad Bill inexplicably let him slide. I was an enormous fan of DeMario Davis, as well, to say nothing of Cam Johnson as an HeffaLump Prospect...Ah, well.

    5 ~ Yes, you understand: I wasn't saying we have to go 1st Round to get an O Guard of suitably awesome Potential ~ Senio Kelemete went in the 5th round, which simply amazes me ~ so we agree on that principle. However, O Guard is a major Priority for me, as I consider them unbelievably vital to winning The Grim Games of Late January. Barret Jones is my favorite for O Guard at this early juncture, and I would love the idea of snatching him and his mate, Chance Womack, and both should be early Rounders...You can't count on an O Guard prospect of Kelemete's stature to drift into the 5th Round every year: This year's crop was incredibly deep, and who knows when we'll see that again??

    Brother Manx Priorities

    1 ~ Could NOT agree more!! :rocker: DT is my #1, as well, you know, and I am INTENSELY excited about this year's Prospects, as BEAUTIFULLY Broken down by The Immortal Brother Mayo!! :D

    2 ~ I don't place Safety anywhere near as high as you, but that, of course, is mostly because I think Pat Chung is a BEAST, and because I want Dowling to swing out to Free Safety. I think Chung will play FAR better with a better and healthier crew around'm, allowing him to focus on his own responsibilities, but we'll see!!

    3 ~ I don't place as much emphasis on Wide Outs, generally, but am 100% in agreement with you that SOMETHING needs to be done!! :eek: We are looking BEAUTIFULL right now, and would CONTINUE to, if Mad Bill shocks me and actually EXTENDS some people instead of letting them go, like he did Mark Anderson...but not for too long, and ~ considering how long it takes Wide Outs to learn their trade ~ I really wanted him to get a piece or two in place THIS year...So I definitely agree that this NEEDS to be addressed!!

    4 ~ 100% with you on the Pass Defending MidFielder!! DAMN, I wish we'd snagged David!! :mad:

    5 ~ Yup!! LOVE Jones...We just diverge on Priority, here.

    6 ~ Tight End. I'm really happy with Daniel Fells as a backup for Gronk for the next few years!! But we BADLY need to get Depth of Talent to go with Aaron the Navigator. Evan Rodriguez would've been an amazing addition to this crew, rather'n some 14 Century Full Back!! :mad:

    7 ~ Yeah, I REALLY wanted us to snag Michael Smith, this year. Opportunity LOST. I think Shane Vereen is going to AMAZE some people, though, and I think we'll have a great crew....In any case, I'd love to see one more Flex Back ~ a guy who's dangerous as a Runner and as a Receiver...and who can block, of course.

    8 ~ We diverge on Mallett, of course: He's just not my kind of QuarterBack.

    9 ~ Concur, Sir!! And it was a great pleasure to share ideas with you, my good man!! Thanks for taking the time, too: Outside of Brother Mayo's posts, there ain't much to read, this time'f year!! :D
  27. Snake Eyes

    Snake Eyes Rookie

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    I totally agree on Kelemete, the 5th round would have been a steal for him. Even worse, we passed on James Brown as a UDFA. He lit up the combine in several drills, I don't know why we wouldnt want to take a show at developing a raw but incredibly athletic prospect like him.

    NFL Videos: 2012 combine workout: James Brown
  28. mayoclinic

    mayoclinic PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Rebuilding the interior of the lines is my clear priority for 2013, on both sides of the ball.

    Unlike Brother Manx, I don't see the need for another "specialty safety" in addition to Chung. And I want to see how Tavon Wilson works out - I have to give BB the benefit of the doubt for now and assume that Wilson could be that kind of centerfield safety who makes the CBs much better. I also think that Nate Ebner has the athleticism and work ethic to become a FORCE - he's not much more raw than Jimmy Graham was as a TE coming out of Miami in 2010, and look how quickly Graham developed. Elite athleticism combined with an unstoppable drive to succeed can go very far.

    I like the Pats' DBs right now. I want to give them time to evaluate them before spending a high pick on another one. With that in mind, there are a lot of guys to like for 2012 - Justin Gilbert, Eric Reid, TJ McDonald, and of course Tyrann Mathieu, among others.

    I value TEs and RBs over wideouts, because of their greater versatility. Yeah, I know you need some, but you can get good WRs in the middle rounds. Not a priority for me ... ever. JMHO, and I know it's not that of most people.

    Lavonte David was SPECIAL, and one of my top 5 binkies of the past 5 years. He had Troy Polamalu kind of instincts. Missing out on him hurts. But it's interesting that BB evaluated so many pass defending MFs and didn't take any. Perhaps he's happy with Jeff Tarpinian and Dane Fletcher. Tarpinian has elite athleticism. No one has David's instincts, but Tarpinian could be a solid pass defending MF. As you know, the one area I most disagree with your "scorched earth" approach to team building is giving up too fast on guys like Tarpiniain, Marcus Cannon, Ryan Mallett, etc.

    I'm with you on this one - interior OL is my co-#1 priority along with DT for 2013. Right now I see 3 potential 1st round interior OL prospects for 2013: Jones, Jonathan Cooper, and Khaled Holmes. Like you, I greatly lament the failure to land Senio Kelemete.

    I'm all in favor of a TE pipeline, and in adding more playmakers to the position. 2013 will be loaded with XE's: Tyler Eifer, Levine Toilolu, Michael Williams, Joseph Fauria, etc. The more the better. I don't see anyone with Aaron Hernandez' skill set coming out right now.

    I badly wanted Doug Martin this year, and I would have been thrilled with Michael Smith. But I think that Brandon Bolden in FA could be a steal, and I'm very high on Vereen and Ridley. I like our RB group right now. But, as with TEs, I'm happy to keep the talent infusion going. There are some nice backs coming out in 2013. Christine Michael, Andre Ellington, Ray Graham, Kenjon Barner, etc.

    Regardless, I think he's a terrific talent and starting caliber QB, and that's not a chip to be thrown away lightly.

    Great series of posts, MM and ZK.
  29. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    1 ~ I really like your choice of the old but still effective term "Benefit of the Doubt" when it comes to moves that Bill the Mad (Genius) makes that we might not like: "In Bill We Trust" as it is invariably employed by the KoolAid Guzzlers ~ meaning: Abdicate your own Judgement, for Mad Bill NEVER makes a mistake!! ~ is a LUDICROUS philosophy to embrace...But giving him the Benefit of the Doubt is another matter, all together: It acknowledges not only our DOUBT...but the fact that it is fully JUSTIFIED...Yet at the same time it honors the Credit that Mad Bill has earned, around here. Nicely put, Sir. [​IMG]

    2 ~ Again: stellar choice of words, Brother Mayo: "Elite athleticism combined with an unstoppable drive to succeed can go very far." That Aspect of FootBall remains VASTLY underrated, despite an ARMY of Late Round and UFA Talent who've forge extraordinary careers despite being initially Cast Away. And I've always said that such players develop a LOT faster than most expect them to!! Nate Ebner, needless to say, as an integral part of my Vision for our Secondary, going forward.

    3 ~ Yeah, you and I may very well be the ONLY guys who are content to wait until Day 3 and UFA to draft Wide Outs...every single YEAR!! Had we pulled in Dale Moss, Junior HemingWay, and Michael Calvin ~ a 7th Rounder + 2 UFA's!! ~ I would've been ECSTATIC!! :D

    4 ~ Yeah, nobody knows my FROTHING love for LaVonte David better'n YOU, Brother Mayo...and vice versa!! [​IMG]

    5 ~ I've given you the wrong impression, I'm afraid: I've always been a VERY big fan of Jeff Tarpinian!! But big enough to put'm on my 53??? I've got some thinking to do about that...

    6 ~ Yep!! Senio Kelemete. Evan Rodriguez. About 20 other guys. The Late Rounds are always rich with Talent ~ more importantly: Talented guys who're willing to bust their @$$es like MAD men to forge exceptional Careers...And yet there are still those foolish enough to consider late round picks to be a waste. :rolleyes:

    7 ~ Don't get me wrong: I like Brandon Bolden. And I think he was a nice, solid pick up...But he's a Power Back. And I want Flex Backs. We've got 2. I want 3 or 4. :D

    8 ~ Who's throwing Mallet away "lightly"?? I want to feature him in late December, and then trade'm for a 1st, a 4th, a 7th, and a 2014 2nd Rounder!! :D
  30. manxman2601

    manxman2601 Rookie

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    Some random thoughts, particularly in light of the most recent discussion about team priorities.

    1. WR. It's interesting that despite this last draft being the deepest at the position for a number of years and how that seemed to tie in with Patriot needs at the time, that BB made the decision to go completely the other way and address the need through FA. Two possible reasons:

    (a) Bringing the band back together. Was this a strategic goal or did things just fall nicely in place?
    (b) Considering past failures, has BB given up on the draft as a source for WRs? It was noticeable to me that the only day of the combine that BB was singled out as being there was the day of the WR drills. Did he not like the class?

    2. Brothers Mayo and Grid make very good points on the secondary and have almost won me round on the lack of need for a dedicated safety. I'm not quite there yet but getting closer. Considering the weakness of the last two drafts at the position and the potential strength of the '13 class, it might benefit the Pats by taking it off the board as a need. Lots of safeties were given franchise tags or signed to short term deals but with a better safety draft class, one of those likely FA safeties might pop free. Also, if teams are going to be taking the likes of Reid, Rambo, McDonald high, the more likely it is that Jones or one of the DT's fall.

    3. Whilst I agree that a stud DT would be a great addition, BB has shown a lot of faith in our current interior D/Line. But this leads me to another point. If, as brothers Mayo and OTG maintain, we are deep in the secondary and having addressed the biggest potential weakness, the pass rush and if BB really likes his interior D/Line, there really is no great area of need for the Pats (leaving personal thoughts aside). No doubt this will change by the end of next season but it does make for an interesting draft from a Patriot's perspective. In which direction do they go? BPA? Address the future (Brady's potential retirement, the expiring contracts of TE's, Chung and Spikes)? Get back to trading back and picking up future picks? Reading the runes on the 2013 draft might be very difficult.

    4. 2011 was an offensive draft. '12 was a defensive one. The last two drafts have barely touched the O and D lines (Solder being the exception). That does seem to be logical direction of the next draft.

    How many days to go? I'm excited already.

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