Vollmer at Left Tackle

[patchick]

Beatty was one of my draft binkies, and is a termendous athletic LT prospect. I would have been happy with him at 23 or 34, much less at 58, and was shocked when we passed on him for Vollmer. But BB and Scar had plenty of opportunity to observe him, and if they chose to pass on Beatty for Vollmer I'm sure they had a reason. Only time will tell if they were right. Vollmer does have a tremendous combination of size, speed and intelligence, though he's a bit raw. I never saw Oher as a good fit because of his tendency to take off plays and his mental lapses.

I think a lot of Pats fans were yelling Beatty's name at #58, it will be interesting to watch the two of them develop. FWIW, one area where Vollmer was consistently rated higher than Beatty was in his intelligence and learning speed. The Pats have a history of drafting very smart OTs.

 

[Pats726]

My take on it is that Vollmer will get most of the snaps during camp and will share time with Light during game week to keep Light fresh. Then next year Light slides over to RT.

Then in 2011 he will be a 33 FA and will probably stay and play for another 4 years.

I tend to think this might be closer to what may happen...I would not say ALL the snaps..but some..to see how he does..and maybe a ritation at LT..as keeping linmen fresh is also important..again depending on the rushers from that side. If Vollmer is good at speed rushers..maybe he will play more. If he can start in 10?? And that is a big if..they drafted a real gem. If he's not suitable for LT..then RT might be the place for him. Either way, I think Vollmer is a keeper and has a solid future here.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I think a lot of Pats fans were yelling Beatty's name at #58, it will be interesting to watch the two of them develop. FWIW, one area where Vollmer was consistently rated higher than Beatty was in his intelligence and learning speed. The Pats have a history of drafting very smart OTs.

And let's not forget the all-important UBP [Ugly Beard Potential].

 

[jmt57]

My take on it is that Vollmer will get most of the snaps during camp and will share time with Light during game week to keep Light fresh. Then next year Light slides over to RT.

That's pretty much my thinking also. Actually I thought the Pats might draft their replacement LT last year, get him a year in the system in '08 and then slide Light over to RT this year.

 

[Kasmir]

Light would lose so much money moving to RT from LT that he'd be sure to go to one of the several teams where he'd be an upgrade at LT. The man is hardly a fool.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Dude I was like WTF when we made the pick and now I can see why we made it. I think he could become our starting left tackle over time but more realistically he will be playing RT for us. He has amazing footwork for a big man. You gotta love a German with a southern draw.lol

That was back right after day one of the Draft...I think he will be playing RT for us very soon, but next year or 2 years from now he will be starting at LT.

 

[DaBruinz]

That is false. Beatty started every game his last two years at UConn and was the starter during his red-shirt sophomore year until he broke his leg.

I have no idea whether Beatty or Vollmer will ultimately prove to be the better pro (since I'm a Pats fan and hate the Giants I hope it's Vollmer), but Beatty is a tremendously athletic tackle prospect.

I stand corrected. Beatty was the starter, but was considered mediocre prior to his senior year..

 

[Ring 6]

Can we please stop the Matt Light has trouble with speed rushers comments.
The FACTS are that this perception started early in his career when the best players he faced were speed rushers. He allowed fewer sacks to them than most LTs yet whenever he allowed one, it was 'cant handle speed rushers'.
Jason Taylor was the primary culprit, but invarianbly Taylor got fewer sacks per game vs Light than the rest of the LTs he faced.
A better way to put it is "A lot of good pass rushers are speed rushers, and since they are good pass rushers LTs have a problem with them, but Light is better than average, and a probowl LT"

 

[ALP]

I don't get the Light criticism. Matt Light may not be Orlando Pace in his prime, but he is one of the better LT in the NFL. I certainly think he is in the top half of the NFL at the position.

Every NFL LT gets beat by speed rushers on occasion. There are some really good players rushing from the outside. Light holds up better than most.

It seems to me when the Patriots have struggled with protection, a lot of it has come up the middle. In the last Super Bowl appearance, the Giants pushed the pocket up in Brady's face, not beating him up from around the outside. In that game, Neal got injured, Mankins didn't play to his usual standards and Koppen was overpowered at times. When the Pats struggle, it is more interior blocking than exterior blocking, IMO.

u like to point to the SB, ill point to our latest game agasint PIT, when it was ONLY outside rushes that got to Matt......and ultimately lost as the game....

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Can we please stop the Matt Light has trouble with speed rushers comments.
The FACTS are that this perception started early in his career when the best players he faced were speed rushers. He allowed fewer sacks to them than most LTs yet whenever he allowed one, it was 'cant handle speed rushers'.
Jason Taylor was the primary culprit, but invarianbly Taylor got fewer sacks per game vs Light than the rest of the LTs he faced.
A better way to put it is "A lot of good pass rushers are speed rushers, and since they are good pass rushers LTs have a problem with them, but Light is better than average, and a probowl LT"

oh crap, someone agrees with me though you probably didnt mean to

I just don't get why people are so bothered with Light. Light did not cost us a SB. So i don't even want to hear that one. If seabass becomes a starter, thats great, but im happy with the line the way it is. Thats assuming they're all healthy

How about, people start worrying about the new secondary we have, and worry less about the ALREADY proven o-line.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

u like to point to the SB, ill point to our latest game agasint PIT, when it was ONLY outside rushes that got to Matt......and ultimately lost as the game....

Matt lost the game? I'll mail ya a copy so you can watch it again

 

[ALP]

Matt lost the game? I'll mail ya a copy so you can watch it again

wut i said was that the rusher was getting to Matt

and b/c of his pressure, we lost the game

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

wut i said was that the rusher was getting to Matt

and b/c of his pressure, we lost the game

I merely meant that the Pats had some others 'errors' that cost the game. Not just Matt, and his brawl towards the end. Yes he didnt help, but that game was lost as a team.

 

[Ungeheuer]

It's amazing how spoiled fans are on this site. Matt Light may not be Walter Jones but he's a hell of a left tackle -- and not only that, he doesn't cost a fortune. You can't have a good offense without a good left tackle and Light has been a rock there throughout the entire Brady-Belichick era. We don't win any of those Super Bowls without Matt Light. He's been tremendous. We should be glad he's signed for a few more years.

As for the Vollmer-Oher-Beatty debate, this again is one of those deals where the people who are griping clearly have no idea what they're talking about and are making their arguments based on evaluations they read in draft guides. I find it very hard to believe that there are die-hard college football fans on this board who spent all last year watching the left side of the line in both Houston and UConn games, and therefore have actual knowledge about why Beatty is a better left tackle than Sebastian Vollmer.

And incidentally, about Michael Oher -- if you actually read The Blind Side, you can understand why anyone would hesitate to draft that kid. He seems like a nice enough guy, but he's like the dictionary definition of High Maintenance. Can you imagine Bill Belichick drafting a guy who needs a tutor to tell him how to read a menu, or put a shirt on? Also, the notion that Vollmer is a bad pick if he can only play right tackle is just plain comical. 58 is too high a pick for a right tackle? Are you kidding? One of our best picks in the last decade was a guard in the first round, and you want to complain about a tackle in the bottom of the second?

This whole argument is absurd. It's impossible for casual fans to evaluate Vollmer or Beatty until they play. All we do know is that this team has a pretty good record of drafting linemen, and beyond that it worked pretty well the last time Floyd Reese drafted a relatively unknown foreign-born tackle. Right? I mean isn't it a little early to be freaking out about a second-round lineman?

 

[ALP]

I merely meant that the Pats had some others 'errors' that cost the game. Not just Matt, and his brawl towards the end. Yes he didnt help, but that game was lost as a team.

and by matt i mean cassel....

and im wasnt blaming it on one guy, i was saying that the fumbles were the reason we lost

if i HAD to blame one guy though, it would be the guy that allowed harrison to get by him 3 tiems

 

[Ring 6]

I think a lot of Pats fans were yelling Beatty's name at #58, it will be interesting to watch the two of them develop. FWIW, one area where Vollmer was consistently rated higher than Beatty was in his intelligence and learning speed. The Pats have a history of drafting very smart OTs.

These are the debates I find it hard to understand.
As fans, all we really have to go on is what other people say about players in the draft, and the limited amount we have seen them on TV.
Then we draw that opinion, and compare it to the one Bill Belichick formed from:
-HIS opinion of the player (not scouts, writers, Kipers, etc)
-Personal contact with the player
-Film STUDY
-HIS knowledge of his system and what is required

and 2 months later fans are acting as if there is any possiblity they would have been better equipped to chose between those 2 players than BB.

It just makes no sense. How can you call it a bad pick. (not you Patchick) It is only a bad pick if you put more faith in the people whose opinions you are using to form yours than you put in BB.
It is a FACT that if any of those people were better at evaluating draft choices than Bill Belichick they would be employed by an NFL team making 10 times as much money.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

beyond that it worked pretty well the last time Floyd Reese drafted a relatively unknown foreign-born tackle?

I was just gonna look this up to avoid feeling stupid, but i can't find a list of his picks with the Titans. Who is the tackle you're talking about? I'm probably gonna feel stupid when you answer

 

[BradyFTW!]

wut i said was that the rusher was getting to Matt

and b/c of his pressure, we lost the game

Gotta agree with you on this one- obviously there were some other things that screwed us in that game, like the kick return fumble and Moss dropping what should have been a touchdown, but James Harrison absolutely dominating Light pretty much precluded the possibility of staging a comeback.

 

[Ungeheuer]

I was just gonna look this up to avoid feeling stupid, but i can't find a list of his picks with the Titans. Who is the tackle you're talking about? I'm probably gonna feel stupid when you answer

Michael Roos. He's Estonian. A lot like Vollmer physically. He's their starting left tackle and a very good one.

 

[Deus Irae]

These are the debates I find it hard to understand.
As fans, all we really have to go on is what other people say about players in the draft, and the limited amount we have seen them on TV.
Then we draw that opinion, and compare it to the one Bill Belichick formed from:
-HIS opinion of the player (not scouts, writers, Kipers, etc)
-Personal contact with the player
-Film STUDY
-HIS knowledge of his system and what is required

and 2 months later fans are acting as if there is any possiblity they would have been better equipped to chose between those 2 players than BB.

It just makes no sense. How can you call it a bad pick. (not you Patchick) It is only a bad pick if you put more faith in the people whose opinions you are using to form yours than you put in BB.
It is a FACT that if any of those people were better at evaluating draft choices than Bill Belichick they would be employed by an NFL team making 10 times as much money.

First, it's not a "FACT that if any of those people were better at evaluating draft choices than Bill Belichick they would be employed by an NFL team making 10 times as much money" by any stretch. "Likely"? Sure, but it's not a fact.

Second, until the day BB is proven infallible, people will disagree with him.

Third, it's sometimes the case (see Clady, Ryan) where both the pick taken by a team and the pick the draftnik wanted taken have success.

Fourth, it's easy to call something a bad pick if you think it's a bad pick. If Vollmer doesn't work out to be a quality starting left tackle, then BB will be open to all sorts of second guessing, and rightfully so.