VJCPatriot's 3/30 Patriots Mock Draft!

[Patriot Missile]

#17 Ryan Kerrigan DE, Purdue

#28 Muhammad Wilkerson, DT, Temple

#33 Danny Watkins, OG, Baylor

(#60 and #92 for St Louis) #47 Leonard Hankerson, WR, Miami

#74 Trade for someone's 2nd in 2012.

#123 Jacquizz Rodgers, RB, Oregon State (my binky RB )

#156 Deunta Williams, FS, North Carolina

#184 Markus White, DE, Florida State

Good job. I think Wilkerson's emergence and hype will not allow him to slide to 28 anymore. Hankerson at 47 was creative and well done. Overall our team is better with a draft like this.

 

[manxman2601]

Box O rocks

Thankyou for your insight.

I take your point about Wilkerson and the Rams, although perhaps they should be considering a bigger body inside as they only ranked 17th in run defense. But the general point remains the same, Wilkerson, Watt and Jordan may not make it to the Pats, and, I believe, few of the OLB options are good value there. Which means we need to think about what the plan B may be.

Reading various Pats sites at the time of the last draft, much the same discussions were being had. "We need a pass rush". "We need a No1 receiver (to replace Moss)". Few considered the possibility that BB viewed cornerback as a first round need. The ensuing collective apoplexy in Pats land following the McCourty pick suggested that the fans hadn't looked beyond the conventional team needs based consensus enough to become comfortable with such an outside the box pick.

I suppose my point is this. Understandably, we as Pats fans are focused on a fairly obvious number of team needs (DE/OLB/OT/G). But to prevent Mccourty like disappointment (thankfully misplaced), perhaps we should start to consider less obvious scenarios so that if they happen, we can more quickly become comfortable with them.

I'm far from being an expert on the college game and I can only o on what I read, and on many draft sites, Amukamara is seen as a potential No1 cornerback. The possibility of having two of these along with Bodden is very appealing. The Jets showed the value of the coverage sack in the playoffs last year, and with what I think is a poor OLB pass rush class, the Patriots may need to depend more heavily on the coverage sack.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Reading various Pats sites at the time of the last draft, much the same discussions were being had. "We need a pass rush". "We need a No1 receiver (to replace Moss)". Few considered the possibility that BB viewed cornerback as a first round need. The ensuing collective apoplexy in Pats land following the McCourty pick suggested that the fans hadn't looked beyond the conventional team needs based consensus enough to become comfortable with such an outside the box pick.

It's why I think if Costanza goes to Detroit at #17 and Ingram is on the board at #17, BB just might throw us another curve ball.

 

[manxman2601]

It's why I think if Costanza goes to Detroit at #17 and Ingram is on the board at #17, BB just might throw us another curve ball.

If all BB's curveballs are McCourtyesque then I'm game. I'm a big fan of a good running game, and the lack of one has been my only disappointment of the recent Patriot era. I would love Ingram to be the pick. He's one of the most NFL ready of all the prospects, he could possibly extend Brady's career or mitigate against injuries for Brady because he won't have to throw so much and he's an added wrinkle for other teams to consider when gameplanning the Patriots.

I'm really quite happy with all the different options in this draft. Kerrigan, Watt, Jordan, Amukamara, Ijalana, aldon Smith, Heyward, Reed, Sheard etc etc. Most teams fans are considering which one of the above they'd like their team to draft. We are potentially considering "which three of the above would like to see a Patriot next year". I'm not sure it's possible for a draft to get better than that and speaks to the genius of the Patriot organisation.

 

[Off The Grid]

First attempt ever.....
Draft Philosophy.....Beef....plus some 2012 action

#17 + #92 = #15 + #146 (Miami) =
JJ Watts DE
Big motor, long arms...I just want to root for the guy. Pats get back to their winning formula. Force 5 OL to battle 3 DTs

#28 + #74 + #184 = #21 + #118 + #140 (KC) =
Mike Pouncey G
I'm beefing the interior line, no matter if Mankins stays or goes. RG is open and the Pats have the luxory of securing the top guard with great DNA. Protect Brady up the middle and open holes for the smurfs

#33 =
Jabaal Sheard DE/OLB
Though I expect BB to trade either #28 or #33, I'm grabbing this pass rusher now. Comparing his tape to Aldon Smith and Houston, Sheard is a round peg that fits in a round hole, unlike Smith and Houston. Loved his college production.

#60 =
Steve Wisniewski C
Looking out long term at the O line, Tackle is a need but i can't fill this need here....but I can look long term and grab this Penn state center and finally replace Koppen, who's is just plain unremarkable. The future of the interior of this O line is being remade, and with the luxory of an excess of picks....beef is good

#69 =
Trade out for a 2nd rounder in 2012(Cardinals)

#118 + #156 = #108(49ers) =
Delone Carter RB. Compact bruiser, productive, fumble free 2010. Improved measurables shows me upside. Does like to punch classmates

#125 =
Trade for 2012 4th rounder plus #172(Vikings)

#140 =
Greg Romeus DE
Toss him on the DL and hope he becomes future value

#172 =
Trade for 2012 5th rounder (don't know don't care)

Summary: I got my 3 guys...Watt, Pouncey, Sheard...I beefed up the interior O line...got me a cerebral QB that can retain playbook with minimal reps and BB strokes Saban...gained future chips with a redshirt DE in waiting. Drafted only 6 players....when checking CB and S depth, slim pickins and very slow. Pats DL had depth, no need. Just don't see the need to draft a surplus of guys with little chance to make roster. So I targeted, and fired.

One of the very most easily followed + logically constructed Mocks I've read.

I certainly disagree with the choice NOT to develop depth, but understand the reasoning.

Well done, sir.

 

[Off The Grid]

Some draft thoughts:

As a new kid round here, I'm not allowed to start a new thread so I hope VJCPatriot doesn't mind a slight hijacking, albeit related, to his excellent thread.

This thread, amongst others, has narrowed my thinking on the draft and I'm finding my thoughts diverging somewhat from some conventions related to this draft. This has become apparent in two ways:

1. The lack of available DE's @17. ESPN has a "draft machine" with which you can submit your own first round mock. As I was running through the mock, I realised that a lot of the conventional prospects normally linked to the Pats @17 were disappearing quickly:

#8 Tennessee Titans - Cameron Jordan (Although Fairley and Bowers are still available, they both have potentially significant red flags. Jordan's versatility and college experience made him the pick.

#9 Dallas Cowboys - JJ Watt (Amukamara was still available but reports suggest the Cowboys aren't really interested. As for OT, they are looking at RT's and this is too high to pick one of them - Carimi is probably their player of choice. Their next position of need is a DE and JJ Watt looks to be the best fit here.

#11 Houston Texans - Ryan Kerrigan (They need a 3-4 pass rusher and by the time they pick in the second, the quality ones will be gone. Kerrigan is the choice because my limited research suggests the Texans prefer high character/effort four year players.

#14 St Louis Rams - Muhammad Wilkerson (This is the stinker. I had Julio Jones going to the Redskins @10 which means the Rams are going for the second option. By all accounts, that means DT. Now normally, most mocks in this scenario have the Rams picking Corey Liuget. I'm not so sure. Again, my research suggests that the Rams would prefer a containment DT rather than a gap penetrator and with Wilkerson shooting up Big Boards (Kiper has him at #10), he seems like the better bet.

So with the four players most likely to go to the Pats @17 already off the board, I ended up picking Tyron Smith. I think having Jordan, Watt and Wilkerson going before 17 is a real, and worrying possibility. The good news though, I got Heyward at #28.

----------

2. I'm also having a go at my own mock in which I'm including trades. One scenario I'm looking at is this. In my mock, I'm trying to find a trade down partner for the Redskins who are without third and fourth round picks. In this scenario, Watt and Wilkerson are available (Jordan goes to the Titans) but there aren't any real choicesof trading partners as the Rams have already traded up to #9 for Julio Jones. So I have the Patriots trading up, with #17, 74, 125 and the 'Skins accepting lesser value for Prince Amukamara. My reasoning: the Patriots don't often get the opportunity to draft a top ten player and the possibility of having two long term potential shut down corners is very appealing. Interestingly, the Patriots have had Amukamara in for a visit. Now they could trade up for Watt or Wilkinson, but with DE's like Heyward, Ellis or Jenkins available later, I'm not sure that's the best approach. In short, I'm quite taken with the idea of nabbing Amukamara for two later round picks.


If this 'hijack' is inappropriate, I apologise and please feel free to delete it. However, I'd love to know whether people think I'm totally off base with these scenarios or whether there is something there.

You are very welcome here, sir.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Box O rocks

Thankyou for your insight.

I take your point about Wilkerson and the Rams, although perhaps they should be considering a bigger body inside as they only ranked 17th in run defense. But the general point remains the same, Wilkerson, Watt and Jordan may not make it to the Pats, and, I believe, few of the OLB options are good value there. Which means we need to think about what the plan B may be.

Reading various Pats sites at the time of the last draft, much the same discussions were being had. "We need a pass rush". "We need a No1 receiver (to replace Moss)". Few considered the possibility that BB viewed cornerback as a first round need. The ensuing collective apoplexy in Pats land following the McCourty pick suggested that the fans hadn't looked beyond the conventional team needs based consensus enough to become comfortable with such an outside the box pick.

I suppose my point is this. Understandably, we as Pats fans are focused on a fairly obvious number of team needs (DE/OLB/OT/G). But to prevent Mccourty like disappointment (thankfully misplaced), perhaps we should start to consider less obvious scenarios so that if they happen, we can more quickly become comfortable with them.

I'm far from being an expert on the college game and I can only o on what I read, and on many draft sites, Amukamara is seen as a potential No1 cornerback. The possibility of having two of these along with Bodden is very appealing. The Jets showed the value of the coverage sack in the playoffs last year, and with what I think is a poor OLB pass rush class, the Patriots may need to depend more heavily on the coverage sack.

I have no issue with considering alternatives:
-- Now there are anywhere from 10-12 defensive linemen projected to round one, some who might be considered OLB in NE's system. Of those projected as round one picks by draftniks, I consider Fairley, Dareus, Bowers, Watt, Kerrigan, Wilkerson, Paea, Miller, and Reed as prospects who could find a place in NE's defense. Paea and Reed are both projected to the latter portion of the first and should still be there in your worst case scenario.
-- I think it's safe to say QB isn't happening, FB, P, PK, S (unless Amukamara is a S in NE's mind), or ILB.
-- I don't consider C or OG or TE good values in round one even if there are some prospects projected that high or top of the second.
-- Once Amukamara goes off the board there isn't a CB worth the effort.
-- RB is pretty much a party of one.
-- Arguably there are WRs rated for the late first, but I'm not one who supports that thinking.
-- Which pretty much narrows the alternative options to OT. Smith and Castonzo are considered the top two now, fair chance at least one is gone by 17. Of the five, I consider Solder and Sherrod the best two options ... but I also would prefer Solder in the early second and Sherrod late second when comparing them to Mankins, Light, and Vollmer coming out of school.

From my view of NE values in round one, a 3-4 DE or OLB conversion project is pretty much "it." That's not to say a CB or WR might slide down to #17 if there's a panicky run on QBs. It's slim pickings in this round, especially when you consider what NE expects out of an early pick. How they might move around to ensure they get another "McCourty" or "Mayo" will be fun to watch.

 

[supafly]

If all BB's curveballs are McCourtyesque then I'm game. I'm a big fan of a good running game, and the lack of one has been my only disappointment of the recent Patriot era. I would love Ingram to be the pick. He's one of the most NFL ready of all the prospects, he could possibly extend Brady's career or mitigate against injuries for Brady because he won't have to throw so much and he's an added wrinkle for other teams to consider when gameplanning the Patriots.

I'm really quite happy with all the different options in this draft. Kerrigan, Watt, Jordan, Amukamara, Ijalana, aldon Smith, Heyward, Reed, Sheard etc etc. Most teams fans are considering which one of the above they'd like their team to draft. We are potentially considering "which three of the above would like to see a Patriot next year". I'm not sure it's possible for a draft to get better than that and speaks to the genius of the Patriot organisation.

While I agree with just about everything you say here, including the possibility of Ingram, I would not get my hopes up for 'which 3 of the above' talk, as I seriously hope that we can just get 2 of these guys--that may end up not happening. We may be closer to the other teams' fans than you think by only ending up with 1 of these players.

However, no matter what, I think we'll end up being a better team because of it, and properly set up for the future..as always. You make a great point when speaking of the genius of this organization.

 

[manxman2601]

While I agree with just about everything you say here, including the possibility of Ingram, I would not get my hopes up for 'which 3 of the above' talk, as I seriously hope that we can just get 2 of these guys--that may end up not happening. We may be closer to the other teams' fans than you think by only ending up with 1 of these players.

However, no matter what, I think we'll end up being a better team because of it, and properly set up for the future..as always. You make a great point when speaking of the genius of this organization.

Well I did say "potentially". You are right however, there will almost certainly be trades. But therein lies the key question. Is there more value to the Patriots in getting star caliber players, or finding value in lower rounds from players that are unlikely to be game breaking type talents.

My view is that the previous two drafts have been about rebuilding with good quality JAG's (and I don't mean that unkindly, a Patriot JAG is better than most other teams). But there needs to be a time when we pick up some stars. Whether that means trading up for one of two, or keeping our first three picks, I'm not so sure. Perhaps, in this weak class, this isn't the year and we'll continue to consolidate with a stronger star-free squad. The thing is, the Patriots are in an almost fail-free position so I'm probably content to sit back and enjoy what will be an amazingly fascinating draft.

 

[supafly]

The thing is, the Patriots are in an almost fail-free position so I'm probably content to sit back and enjoy what will be an amazingly fascinating draft.

Very true. Personally, I am hoping for a combo myself. I would be insanely excited about 2 of the players that you listed, but don't know how realistic that thinking is. I'm truly thinking we get 1 of those, and possibly another 'unsexy' BB type pick.

I'd love the DE/OLB combo, in whatever order, by pick 33 (or somewhere around there, depending on how far we trade down). By the early-mid 40's, it sure would be nice to have that combo, as I do agree that we could certainly add a nice tweak on the defense to what is shaping up to be a good, young side of the ball.

As many have pointed out, we could very well only be a couple defensive players away from becoming a force again--defensively.

 

[everlong]

Seems to be a ton of mock threads so rather than start a new one I'll put one here. I think Watt is worth going up for then I think they'll trade down and pick up talent from the mid second to the mid third where the best value is and not a large drop off if any from the bottom of the first and top of the second.

12 for 17 + 74 Patriots draft JJ Watt and the Vikings get back the Randy Moss pick.
28 Patriots trade to AZ for #69 and a 2012 first
33 for 50+82 to the Chargers
50 Leonard Hankerson WR Miami
60 Demarco Murray RB Oklahoma
69 Allen Bailey DE\OLB Miami
82 Jarvis Jenkins DE Clemson
83 92+123 James Carpenter RT Alabama
84 Clint Boiling OG UGA
156 Greg McElroy QB Alabama
184 Jake Kirkpatrick C TCU

1st rounder in 2012 added